From jamesdtabor at earthlink.net  Wed Oct  1 09:14:30 2008
From: jamesdtabor at earthlink.net (James Tabor)
Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2008 10:14:30 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Sukkoth 20087
Message-ID: <3FCB3D5E-38DA-4A84-ADE1-983690213E09@earthlink.net>

Dear Ross and all,

I am hoping that everyone had a meaningful "Day of the Blast,"  
yesterday, and into today, depending on how the "new moon" observance  
works for some. I stayed home, due to the gas shortage, as I was  
considering joining Dennis Jones and his people at the synagogue in  
Hickory. One of the things I did was listen to Ross' message on Yom  
Teru'ah from last Sunday, which I would highly recommend to everyone  
who has not heard it. I continue to value the teaching Ross Nichols  
does, week in and week out, or "in season and out of season," as the  
old King James puts it, as the best available anywhere.

Ross mentions below that I will not be able to travel to St  
Francisville this year as I had intended and planned to do since last  
year. As for rain being withheld (and that was a very funny reference  
Ross, if people don't get it look at the last verses of Zech 14!), as  
it turns out I will be in Jerusalem the week of Sukkoth, only getting  
back Friday the 17th, followed back-to-back with another obligation  
out of town over the weekend. So, as it turns out, I will be "going  
up" to the place YHVH has chosen during the "Festival of Shelters"  
ahead of us, with no offense to other such places, like St Francisville!

To have this opportunity to be in Jerusalem during Sukkoth week laid  
in my lap was an unexpected surprise, courtesy of a British film  
company doing a documentary, but I am greatly looking forward to it.  
Years ago some of us were in Israel during Sukkoth and it is truly an  
amazing experience, seeing every parking lot, balcony, and garden/yard  
area crammed with all the succahs. One of the highlights of the trip  
will be to sit with Simcha Jacobovici and his family in his sukkah one  
night. Sitting together in the Sukkah is truly one of the most amazing  
experiences one can have, as so many of you know. I urge everyone to  
be sure and experience this in St Francisville if you possible can,  
even if it takes some sacrifice to make the travel and arrange things.  
I will try to hook up with you all via phone and/or video if I can,  
just to sent greetings, if we can work it out. I will miss all of you  
very very much and as much as I am looking forward to Jerusalem, I  
can't stand to think of not being with you and missing all that goes  
on, especially in the informal give and take conversations. Last year  
was simply wonderful! I surely would not want anyone to be discouraged  
from coming because I can not make it there this year and I honestly  
don't think people will.

Years ago Ralph Buntyn and I traveled to New Jersey to spend a day or  
two with David and Nan Horowitz during Sukkoth, with the express  
purpose of sitting together in the Sukkah with him. It is a time we  
both will never forget.

Wishing a meaningful festival time to all, and an insightful and  
inspiring time in the weeks ahead of this  week. May YHVH breathe his  
inspiration through the Spirit upon all of us, when we sit down, and  
when we rise up, and when we walk along the way...

James Tabor

P.S. We sent out United Israel calendars and they should have arrived  
by now so if you did not get one and would like one let me know via e- 
mail with your surface address.

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From dhcole1 at cox.net  Wed Oct  1 09:24:26 2008
From: dhcole1 at cox.net (Dave Cole)
Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2008 09:24:26 -0500
Subject: [Dialogue] new moon hunter
Message-ID: <001201c923d1$68eba320$6500a8c0@davesbook>

Excited is the word!!
Having spent the last two evenings trying to spot "my" new moon while driving home every evening, with no success, I look forward to this evening to be able to sit in my favorite parking lot that has a great view of the evening sky.  So imagine you are driving and come upon a pickup truck pulling a loaded trailer stopped on the side of the road with a wild looking man looking with intent to the skies holding a cell phone, have no fear....its just me!  Ross and I have sort of a local "race" to find it.....the conversation goes sort of like this...rn--"did you see it yet?  dc-- its a new one you know...rn--well text me if you see it,  I will be in an important meeting....dc--I will email you a picture........

Looking forward to the booth.........and a time we can all celebrate together
dave
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Thu Oct  2 05:00:03 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2008 20:00:03 +1000
Subject: [Dialogue] Shana Tova.
Message-ID: <48E49BA3.5080407@westnet.com.au>

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From jamesdtabor at earthlink.net  Thu Oct  2 08:29:23 2008
From: jamesdtabor at earthlink.net (James Tabor)
Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 09:29:23 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] MACHZOR RABBAH - ROSH HASHANA.
In-Reply-To: <48DB6E94.6020108@westnet.com.au>
References: <48DB6E94.6020108@westnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <9F472049-8C5F-469C-B8E3-71D64B5D46A3@earthlink.net>

Dear Joe,

I knew Rabbi Pearlmutter well and visited him a half dozen times at Ir  
Ovot, going back to the 1990s and up through and past the the sad time  
when his son Ari was killed. Several of us have donated funds to plant  
trees in the lovely cemetery that is now on the property, where  
Simcha, his mother, his son, and others who lived at the settlement  
going back 30 years. Simcha was an avid corresponder and I have thick  
files of his letters. He was firm and direct and despite his  
controversial views on Yeshua, polygamy, and other issues, he  
influenced many non-Jews to move toward Torah faith, but to back that  
up by somehow coming to the Land. That was his strongest emphasis-- 
that one can not do anything effectively in the Galut, at least not  
post 1967. He did indeed take me through his views from the Machzor  
for RH but I was not able to agree with him.

James


On Sep 25, 2008, at 6:57 AM, JOE INDOMENICO wrote:

> Shalom Chaverim,
>
> as we prepare for Rosh HaShanah there is something on my heart that  
> I would like to share with you. The jury is still out on Rabbi  
> Simcha Pearlmutter. He has created a stir in both Jewish and  
> Christian circles. In Jewish circles because he was not officially  
> ordained through the appropriate Orthodox Beit Din and in Christian  
> circles because he is vehemently opposed to Christianity whilst  
> believing in Yeshua.
>
> Unfortunately Simcha has passed away. However I have some friends  
> locally here in Australia that have met him personally in the Negev  
> and have passed on to me numerous letters of correspondence that  
> were written over the years. He was a real character who stood up  
> for what he believed. His fascinating insight into the prayers of  
> the Machzor Rabbah for Rosh HaShanah are quite controversial but  
> accurate.
>
> I have included some Jewish links regarding the man to give you all  
> an insight into why there was so much controversy.
> http://www.menorah.org.za/simcha_pearlmutter.php
> http://haemtza.blogspot.com/2006/09/jesus-in-machzor-of-rosh-hashanah.html
> To be accurate "the ministering angel" in the prayer is actually SAR  
> HAPANIM "the Prince of the Countenance/ Front.
>
> I have included a 9 part interview with him. I am curious to hear  
> your feedback. I for one have an open mind to his message. Please  
> take the time to listen. If any of you have additional information  
> on Simcha, I would be interested to hear from you.
>
> PART 1   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CojKfel24sA&mode=related&search=
> PART 2   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0zRINswObiA&mode=related&search=
> PART 3   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oq9ZJT18q7g&mode=related&search=
> PART 4   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nxLD0J-dT4I&mode=related&search=
> PART 5   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAaSBNBTW-0&mode=related&search=
> PART 6   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4XfOWBmstQ&mode=related&search=
> PART 7   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Teyb6taSUxg&mode=related&search=
> PART 8   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zgRVnU-ioo&mode=related&search=
> PART 9   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0HtnG1X0Ohk&mode=related&search=
>
> Shalom v' Ahavah,
> JOE.
>
> _______________________________________________

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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Thu Oct  2 12:29:27 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 13:29:27 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] 'Returning 5769'
Message-ID: <855590370810021029w28f3fa1u5867051786c9cdba@mail.gmail.com>

Shalom to all,

     Although I know many of you already subscribe to 'Kosher Torah,'  I
thought this was too interesting and thought provoking to chance anyone
missing.

     I hope you all had a meaningful Rosh HaShana.

     B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,
                    *  Hanoch
*
Returning, 5769

By HaRav Ariel Bar Tzadok. Copyright (c) 2008 by Ariel Bar Tzadok. All
rights reserved.     Returning is no mere simple change.

Returning means to stop going the way you are now, turning around and going
the other way.

If the way you are going now was the right way, then you would already be
getting close.

You would not need to return, but only confirm your commitment to stay on
your path.

Many of us walk a path with commitment, yet we very rarely ask ourselves if
indeed it is the right path.

It is easy to proclaim oneself religious, to look religious and to act
religious, yet is this all there is to religion, to look like it and to act
like it?

Real religion is not what one does, it is what one is. Herein lies a great
secret of the Masters.

The Holy One, blessed be He, Torah and Israel are all one. This means that
one is in the others and the others are in the one.

Our Masters taught us that in the beginning the Holy One gazed into the
Torah and created the world.

This means that all of existence existed in the Torah; therefore by
deduction we must conclude that Torah exists in everything in existence.

The human soul is attached to Torah. Torah exists in all things. Therefore
the human soul can recognize its source in Torah everywhere and in
everything. This is the meaning of the cry of the angels who proclaimed,
"the whole earth is full of His glory."

To be religious means one must bond with Torah and mitzvot. Yet, one cannot
just do this on the surface and expect it to be done.

That which does not penetrate to the essence has no true connection and thus
no true power.

Torah is inside us, within the very particles that make up every part of us.
It is not in the Heavens or beyond the sea. Torah is within us. We cannot
escape it. We cannot lose it.

We can however lose ourselves and forget our integral connection to the
Torah within us.

This then is the meaning of return. This is true religion; when one
unleashes the Torah from within oneself and allows oneself to again be one
with Torah and with the Holy One, blessed be He.

The unity is already there. It is always here. It is eternal. All we need do
is to reconnect. This is the meaning of return.

Looking religious and acting religious does not make one religious. Only
being religious makes one religious. Being religious is a matter of the
heart. It can never be anything else.

During these days of return it is wise for us to consider these simple
truths...

What path must I walk to find my inner Torah? How do I awaken my sleeping
soul and arouse it to again experience the radiance of truth?

These questions are truths, for what greater truths can there be than the
ones known in the heart.

Life is full of noise and distractions. Take time out of your daily schedule
and take time to put into contemplating your own heart.

The Voice of Heaven is speaking at this very moment. It can be heard deep
within your heart. Hush! Listen for it and you might hear its whisper.

"Come back to me, come back to me." The Voice is calling. "Come back to me
and I shall come back to you." This is the Voice of the inner Torah, the
very echo of the Voice of the Holy One, blessed be He.

Become Torah. Do not just study it as a book. Do not just make it a part of
your life. Torah is far more than a part. It is all parts, each individually
and all together. Inside everything, within every pursuit and behind every
interest Torah is there.

Torah is alive. It is watching you from within the very recesses of your
soul. Unleash it and allow the power of the Living Word to flow through you
and to become you.

When you restore the union of the Holy One, blessed be He, the Torah and
yourself, then the return is complete.

Take the time now to contemplate. Ask Heaven for guidance how to open your
heart and unleash the great power therein. Seek out the Holy One. He has
been looking for you much longer than you have been looking for Him.

Now you know the secret of return. It is not so much a matter of how you do
it; it is simply a matter of getting it done.

Simplicity here is the key. You need no further instruction. All you need is
sincerity and the will to succeed. The Holy One is already with you; as is
His Torah.

Restore the connection; become a walking, living Torah. This is the bonding.
All who are bonded in this fashion to the Holy One and Torah are called
alive. This is the return. This is true Teshuva.

May we all be inscribed in the Great Book of Life, with all the great
blessings from Heaven above.

----------------------------------------------

Shalom, Ariel Bar Tzadok
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Thu Oct  2 12:32:49 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 13:32:49 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] "The Holy King"
Message-ID: <855590370810021032h1da8a869n3bc7eaaede093a3c@mail.gmail.com>

   Rav Kook on the Torah Portion <http://www.ravkooktorah.org/>

<http://www.ravkooktorah.org/ASERET58.htm>

*The Holy King*




------------------------------
Gold from the Land of Israel <http://www.ravkooktorah.org/book-gold.htm>
368 pages, hardcover, online price: $20.50

*"This is the best English-language introduction to the thought of Rav
Kook!"*
- Rabbi Dovid Sears
------------------------------
      *The Holy King*

The days from Rosh Hashanah until Yom Kippur are called "*Aseret Y'mei
Teshuvah,*" the Ten Days of Repentance. During this period, our relationship
with God changes, as reflected in two changes in the daily prayers:


   - Instead of "*the Holy God,*" we say "*the Holy King.*"
   - Instead of "*the King Who loves kindness and justice,*" we say, "*the
   King of justice.*"


What is the significance of these changes?

*Divine Rule*

God governs the world in a different fashion during the Ten Days of *
Teshuvah*. During the the year, His rule is revealed through the attribute
of *Elokut* (Godliness); but during this special time, He rules with the
attribute of *Malchut* (Kingship). What does this mean?

A king judges his subjects according to their current state, deciding who
deserves punishment and who deserves reward. In the Divine rule of *Malchut*,
evil is not tolerated.

In the elevated Divine view of *Elokut*, on the other hand, everything has
an ultimate purpose. God's praise, the Sages taught, also comes from the
wicked [Shemot Rabbah 7]. It may be beyond our limited understanding, but
also evil serves a purpose in the world. Ultimately, the wicked through
their free will only bring sorrow upon themselves.

During the rest of the year, God permits evil, so that the wicked will have
the opportunity to repair their evil during the Ten Days of *Teshuvah*. We
refer to God during the year as the "*Holy God,*" since even base and wicked
actions will lead to holy goals. This form of Divine rule emphasizes God's
kindness and forbearance, and our prayers speak of God as "*loving justice
and kindness.*"

During the Ten Days of *Teshuvah*, however, God is revealed as the "*Holy
King.*" The time has arrived for the wicked to mend their ways. If they fail
to repent, they will be dealt with the attribute of *mishpat*, exacting
judgment. During these ten days we experience God's providence as a King who
rejects all evil, and thus refer to Him as "*the King of judgment.*"

[adapted from Olat Re'iyah vol. I pp. 272-273]

  Rav Kook on the Net: RavKookTorah.org <http://www.ravkooktorah.org/>
This week's Dvar Torah: RavKook.co.nr <http://www.ravkook.co.nr/>
This Dvar Torah: ASERET58.htm <http://www.ravkooktorah.org/ASERET58.htm>
To subscribe/unsubscribe or comments, write to: Rav Kook
List<RavKookList at gmail.com>
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Thu Oct  2 15:07:49 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2008 06:07:49 +1000
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] An Interesting Number]
Message-ID: <48E52A15.1090909@westnet.com.au>

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Subject: [Dialogue] An Interesting Number
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Thu Oct  2 15:20:40 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2008 06:20:40 +1000
Subject: [Fwd: Re: [Dialogue] MACHZOR RABBAH - ROSH HASHANA.]
Message-ID: <48E52D18.9050401@westnet.com.au>

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Subject: Re: [Dialogue] MACHZOR RABBAH - ROSH HASHANA.
Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 09:29:23 -0400
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From rndavar at aol.com  Thu Oct  2 17:03:10 2008
From: rndavar at aol.com (Ross Nichols)
Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 22:03:10 +0000
Subject: [Dialogue] Fw:
Message-ID: <303082728-1222984931-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1973482125-@bxe130.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>

This is what I live for. Glenn forwarded me an exchange where he is teaching someone and here is an example of an ah-ha from his disciple.
Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T

-----Original Message-----
From: "Nichols, Ross K." <ROSS.NICHOLS at GAPAC.com>

Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 16:41:13 
To: <rndavar at aol.com>
Subject: FW: 


 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: CHATTERTON, WALTER G [mailto:WCHATTE at entergy.com] 
Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2008 8:29 AM
To: constancema84 at bellsouth.net
Subject: RE: 

 

:-) you have learned well, grasshopper...

    -----Original Message-----
    From: constancema84 at bellsouth.net
[mailto:constancema84 at bellsouth.net] 
    Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2008 8:27 AM
    To: CHATTERTON, WALTER G
    Subject: 


    I did a search for the word "Heaven" trying to find the
scripture I was asking you about and I came across this and it really
stood out for me.  (I highlighted my key points.) 


    MATTHEW


    Chapter 5


    17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets:
I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. 
    18 For verily I say unto you, Till Heaven and earth pass, one
jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be
fulfilled. 
    19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least
commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in
the kingdom of Heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same
shall be called great in the kingdom of Heaven. 


    Okay, here's what I liked.  From the words of Jesus himself he
mentions THE law and following THE law.  He doesn't mention some
variation of the law or "the law minus a couple things."  He says THE
law.  That stood out for me.  Also, he states that ANYONE (I assume
including himself) beaks any of the LEAST commandments, and teaches
other men to do so, that they will be call the least in Heaven.  Now, to
me, it doesn't seem hard to understand what he's saying. If he came to
change and shake up things, he is contradicting himself.  He would be
making himself LEAST in Heaven.  And I don't believe he is LEAST in
Heaven.  I believe that he came to "DO AND TEACH" The Law, and that he
is great in Heaven.  How then can one argue that he would come and
change things.  

     

    Hmmm....

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From carlson_john at bellsouth.net  Thu Oct  2 20:13:06 2008
From: carlson_john at bellsouth.net (carlson_john at bellsouth.net)
Date: Fri, 03 Oct 2008 01:13:06 +0000
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] An Interesting Number]
In-Reply-To: <48E52A15.1090909@westnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <100320080113.2775.48E571A10009EBAB00000AD722243429029B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF02080106A102019C049D0E0C@att.net>

Shalom Joe, very interesting indeed.

--
John C. 

"Be excellent to each other!" 
Bill and Ted 


-------------- Original message from JOE INDOMENICO <jid at westnet.com.au>: -------------- 

Shalom John,

you might find this interesting.




As the seventh month arrived and concluded the seventh year of the shmita cycle in Eretz Yisrael, the American (Edomic) Empire suffered a historic blow to its stock market:

(MSNBC) "...worst single drop day ever.... a history-making day.... largest single point drop in history...."

Since there are no coincidences, there is a message here (or maybe even a few) from Shamayim. What are we supposed to take from this?

The first thing that came to my mind is that seven is the number of completion. Seven days make a week; seven years make a shmita cycle. The seventh millenium will be the Great Shabbath of time. On the seventh day Hashem rested from all His creating and commanded us to cease from our labors as well in commemoration of that fact.

If this is a virtual flashing neon sign to the Jews on Rosh Hashana, perhaps it is meant to tell us that Hashem is finished holding back from judging the nations who are seventy and who are obligated to seven mitzvot and who want to divide the land of the seven species---Eretz Yisrael.

Here are some further thoughts on "seven":

(Inner.org) Zayin (7) ?A 'vav' whose head extends in both directions and thus appears as a crown. Scepter of a King. [We crown Hashem King in the seventh month---Tishrei.]

(Inner.org) In the Bible we find that G-d has seven eyes (Zachariah 4:10 ). This is obviously not meant to be taken literally, but clearly conveys a secret. In His Providence, G-d overlooks and judges creation from seven perspectives (corresponding to the seven attributes of the heart). [All creation passes before Hashem for judgement in the seventh month---Tishrei.]

(Book of Our Heritage) Jewish tradition attributes special value and significance to being the seventh. Our Sages write: 'All sevenths are beloved above.' In the count of the generations, the seventh generation from Adam was most precious, for it was the generation of Chanoch of whom the verse (Bereshit5:22) states: And Chanoch walked with God. Among our ancestors, the seventh was most favored, for Moshe was the seventh generation from Avraham, and regarding him the verse (Shemot 19:20) states: And Moshe ascended unto God. Among the sons of Yishai, the seventh --- David --- was most favored....

Time is also sanctified by sevenths, and we find (Bereshit2:3): And God blessed the seventh day; the seventh --- shemittah --- year is sanctified; and seven cycles of seven years are crowned by a yovel (jubilee) year. And among months, the seventh --- Tishrei --- is most precious (Yalkut Shimoni, parashat Yisro 276).

...In the Land of Israel, Tishrei is also the harvest season, when the Jewish people witness the material bounty with which God has blessed them. Our sages note that these qualities of Tishrei, "the seventh month," are alluded to by the similarity between the words sheva [seven] and sova [satiety and abundance].

Whatever message you take from this event and the significance of seven, it is definitely a sign for GOOD for ???"? whose letters stand for ??? ????? ???---year of a good sign

Shalom v'Ahavah
JOE.
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Thu Oct  2 21:05:07 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2008 19:05:07 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] Jihad Watch: America as the last man standing
Message-ID: <855590370810021905j4ad61465y20659cd1c805e7a6@mail.gmail.com>

Shalom to all,

        This is a very important interview to read and pass along to
everyone you know.
                   * Hanoch*
**
 Click here: Jihad Watch: America as the last man
standing<http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/022867.php>
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From eliasaph at uniteourheart.com  Thu Oct  2 23:08:10 2008
From: eliasaph at uniteourheart.com (Steve Mathe)
Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2008 21:08:10 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] 'Returning 5769'
In-Reply-To: <855590370810021029w28f3fa1u5867051786c9cdba@mail.gmail.com
 >
References: <855590370810021029w28f3fa1u5867051786c9cdba@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200810030408.m93482Ce020482@mail207c25.carrierzone.com>


A small commentary on what Hanoch's forward of Rabbi Bar Tzaddok's 
Returning, 5769 at 10:29 AM 10/2/2008, you wrote

>Returning is no mere simple change.
>
>Returning means to stop going the way you are now, turning around 
>and going the other way.
>
>If the way you are going now was the right way, then you would 
>already be getting close.
>
>You would not need to return, but only confirm your commitment to 
>stay on your path.


The opening paragraph of Rabbi Bar.Tzaddok's Yom Teruah message 
reminds me of Isa. 1: 16-17 from where many rabbis take their 
definition of "repentance:"  This passage is the basis of what Rabbi 
bar Tzaddok says above, i.e.  "Stop what evil you are doing, turn 
around and go the other way, doing good." This is the prescription 
for the quintessential Divine directive for all mankind found in 
Psalm 90:3, which I take to be the summary of the whole 
Tanakh's  instruction for all:  "Shuvoo b'nei Adam" / "Return ye 
children of men."

Speaking of "change," I wish Sarah Palin would have called for a 
fundamental "spiritual change" that needs to be looked at to combat 
and. "turnaround" the utterly wrong direction of the greed-motivated 
downward spiral dive the nation is in.  If she is elected, I hope she 
will be a leader of "house cleaning" in the nation.

Steve

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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Fri Oct  3 07:58:58 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2008 05:58:58 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] G-d as Lover or Judge?
Message-ID: <855590370810030558i26b2cf27vc97e26be72b56303@mail.gmail.com>

These are insights that Rabbi Aaron first shared with me when we were flying
together from Johannesburg to Cape Town, South Africa.  It's great to see it
in print; enjoy!

Shabbat Shalom,
            * Hanoch*
**
**
*  by Rabbi David Aaron, Founder and Dean of Isralight  [image:
http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?e=001iscyb0D0W8QAznzP696BNIDNX6Ue7gr2cjHJTGAaNmDN7dLGo0jMUU8bfVwjhPOv-JE6QsSicf4pE1AcGxWAGrBFHqWKSrQgu8E6O8KmLOYInjA5dVXUXw==]<http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?e=001iscyb0D0W8QAznzP696BNIDNX6Ue7gr2cjHJTGAaNmDN7dLGo0jMUU8bfVwjhPOv-JE6QsSicf4pE1AcGxWAGrBFHqWKSrQgu8E6O8KmLOYInjA5dVXUXw==>


Is G-d a Lover or a Judge?

[image:
http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?e=001iscyb0D0W8TZ9JN9a8l4hpebRiIW3HoMH5NADBSFPKzX2gu6ksaU3HauCMMpmOpjAvLuFHa8bGttvnAk5q5ivxSkqm4WoZa1wOp55zc7Xi0F8-es9WYSjlQ9RVs3DGza8k8FpLUVH7I7qYTMYknDyjPKHkfsgYJ_]<http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?e=001iscyb0D0W8TZ9JN9a8l4hpebRiIW3HoMH5NADBSFPKzX2gu6ksaU3HauCMMpmOpjAvLuFHa8bGttvnAk5q5ivxSkqm4WoZa1wOp55zc7Xi0F8-es9WYSjlQ9RVs3DGza8k8FpLUVH7I7qYTMYknDyjPKHkfsgYJ_>


When we take a bird's eye view of the holidays that inaugurate the New Year,
we see a collection of diverse and disturbing images for G-d. The
predominant image for G-d, on Rosh Hashanah, is King and Judge who is
writing us into a cosmic Book of life or death. Yom Kippur is associated
more with G-d as a compassionate forgiving Father. Sukkot features G- d as a
lover---the sukkah also symbolizes a wedding canopy. And on Simchat Torah we
reach the height of intimacy and complete union with G-d. What are we to do
with all this imagery? Are we really supposed to believe all this?

Surely all these images are only metaphors for a higher divine truth that is
beyond spoken words and conceptual images. We can only know the divine truth
experientially. Anyone who believes that G-d is literally a King, Judge,
Father or Lover is making graven images of G-d and committing spiritual
idolatry. What then is the meaning and value of all these metaphors?

As far as metaphors go, these are the closest images that allude to the
truth. According to Jewish mysticism, these conceptual metaphors are
vehicles to access the transcendental truth of G-d. They are the metaphors
that can take us to the threshold of the immediate and direct experience of
G-d that is beyond all words and concepts. Any other metaphors wouldn't even
get us close to the truth.

Our task and goal on these holy days, is to use these metaphors of King,
Father and Lover towards building our consciousness and awareness of G-d, so
that we can receive and experience G-d's guiding power, forgiveness and
love.

With every word of prayer and every detail of the rituals, we are building
the right metaphors necessary to channel the divine truth into our life.
Think of all these metaphors as the code number to a great combination lock.
The Torah gives us the right balance and combination of metaphors necessary
to unlock the vault and get to the real treasures of divine truth.

We need to believe that G-d is like a King and Judge who stands over us and
judges us on Rosh Hashanah. We then need to believe that G-d is also like a
forgiving Father, who picks us up, supports and forgives us on Yom Kippur.
And then on Sukkot, G-d is like our Lover, close to us, holding us in a
loving embrace. All this unlocks the door to experiencing the ecstasy of our
intimate connection with G-d on Simchat Torah.

This is the true meaning and power of faith. Faith is not a collection of
ideas that we adopt. It is an orientation to life and the Source of all
life-G-d. Faith is a way of seeing. Unlike the popular saying "Seeing is
believing", Jewish mysticism teaches, "Believing is seeing." In other words,
the greater our faith is in G- d, the more G-d can become manifest in our
lives. The more we believe that G-d is like a King, the more divine power
and guidance can enter in to our lives. The more we believe that G-d is like
a compassionate Father, the more compassion and forgiveness can become
manifest in our lives. And the more we believe that G-d is like a Lover, the
more divine love, intimacy and oneness can fill our lives. The more we
believe, the more we can receive.

Rabbi David Aaron
Author of Endless Light, Seeing G-d, The Secret Life of G-d, Inviting
G-d Inand Living
A Joyous Life
*
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Fri Oct  3 12:09:41 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2008 10:09:41 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] "We are all Israelis"
Message-ID: <855590370810031009r22267936x48fd5ad8062f2cc0@mail.gmail.com>

I believe that this applies to Ephramites as much as it applies to Jews...

    Shabbat Shalom,
                    * Hanoch*


Vayelech: We Are All Israelis 4 Tishrei 5769, 03 October 08 01:42
by by Yehuda HaKohen

(IsraelNN.com) "Moshe went and spoke these words to all of Israel. He said
to them, 'I am a hundred and twenty years old today; I can no longer go out
and come in, for *HaShem* has said to me, "You shall not cross the Jordan."
*HaShem*, your G-d, He will cross before you, and you shall possess them;
Yehoshua, he shall cross over before you, as *HaShem* has spoken.' " (*
Devarim* 31:1-3)

Moshe, who taught, guided and nurtured the Hebrew Nation for forty years in
the wilderness, was not to be permitted into *Eretz Canaan*. The great
prophet who received the Torah on Israel's behalf would have to take leave
of his people just before the liberation of our homeland and the
establishment of G-d's Divine Kingdom therein.

The most well known explanation for why Moshe was forbidden from crossing
the Jordan is that he had once lost his patience with Israel and struck a
rock in anger. The *Midrash*, however, explains that this incident was only
when the punishment took effect. In truth, it had been decreed decades
earlier that Moshe would be prohibited from entering the western portion of
*Eretz Yisrael*.

"G-d said to Moshe, 'Whoever acknowledges his homeland is buried in his
homeland. Yosef acknowledged his homeland, as it is written, "For indeed I
was kidnapped from the land of the Hebrews...." (*Bereishit* 40:15) You did
not acknowledge your homeland.... How? The daughters of Yitro said, "An
Egyptian man saved us from the shepherds...." (*Shemot* 2:19) You heard them
and remained silent. Therefore you will not be buried in your homeland.' " (
*Devarim Rabbah* 2:8)

Although he had been raised as royalty in Pharaoh's palace and had never in
his life actually seen the Land of Israel, Moshe was held accountable for
allowing himself to be called "an Egyptian".

Jews should be careful never to view ourselves as belonging to any nation or
country other than our own. Moshe, the paradigm of Hebrew unity and
responsibility - who killed an Egyptian on the spot for merely striking a
Hebrew slave - was severely punished for not protesting when being referred
to as an Egyptian man. This episode teaches us that we must be careful not
to refer to ourselves as German, French, American or anything else other
than Israeli.

It must be understood that Israel is one national entity with one common
destiny, and that there are no legitimate national agendas outside of the
Torah's blueprint for Redemption. And it is only through the Redemption of
Israel that history's goal will be achieved and the world will reach
perfection according to *HaShem*'s Divine plan for Creation.
 www.IsraelNationalNews.com <http://www.israelnationalnews.com/>
(c) Copyright IsraelNationalNews.com
Subscribe to the free Daily Israel Report - sub.israelnn.com
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Fri Oct  3 13:27:50 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2008 11:27:50 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] "B'Rosh HaShana..." 'On Rosh HaShana...'
Message-ID: <855590370810031127t7c44134dm9de66f4acb742b50@mail.gmail.com>

Click here: YouTube - berosh
hashanah<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxcif-NiAfM&feature=related>
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From shdennis at rogers.com  Fri Oct  3 17:12:20 2008
From: shdennis at rogers.com (Stephen Dennis)
Date: Fri, 3 Oct 2008 19:12:20 -0300
Subject: [Dialogue] Jihad Watch: America as the last man standing
References: <855590370810021905j4ad61465y20659cd1c805e7a6@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <00ca01c925a5$1b05db50$65012b0a@H02GGMADENNISS1>

Hanoch, 

Thanks for a very worthwhile article.   Because this is one of the crucial issues of our time, if not the most crucial, I will be sending this link on to friends.  

For others on the list  ... take the time to read this. 

Shalom 

Stephen 


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Hanoch Young 
  To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
  Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2008 11:05 PM
  Subject: [Dialogue] Jihad Watch: America as the last man standing


  Shalom to all,

          This is a very important interview to read and pass along to everyone you know.
                      Hanoch

  Click here: Jihad Watch: America as the last man standing 


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
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From RNDAVAR at aol.com  Fri Oct  3 23:17:59 2008
From: RNDAVAR at aol.com (RNDAVAR at aol.com)
Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2008 00:17:59 EDT
Subject: [Dialogue] Succoth 08 - update 10-03-08
Message-ID: <cdb.405879ef.36184877@aol.com>

The Roots of Faith Congregation from Saint Francisville, Louisiana presents  
Succoth 08 with Arba 4 - a Biblical Teaching Conference held  during the 
Ancient Festival of Succoth at the historic Temple Sinai Synagogue -  the Synagogue 
without walls!
 
This conference has become an annual event hosted by Ross Nichols and the  
congregation of Roots of Faith. This year, the teachers from Arba4 will present  
their topics live over the web allowing people from around the world to be a  
part of the audience. If you cannot come to us, we hope to bring this event 
to  you.
 
ARBA4 is a web site that was organized to present multi-media teachings  
about the Bible, Judaism, Gentiles, Christianity, Non-Jews, Torah, Tanak, New  
Testament, Prophecy and Current Events. _www.ARBA4.com_ (http://www.ARBA4.com)  
currently features, Joseph &  Debbie Good, Ross K Nichols and Dr. Walter Oakley.
 
In addition to the more "formal" classes we have discussed having some  
informal, but facilitated conversations. 
 
We also hope to take a live call from our friend Dr. James D. Tabor at some  
point. James will be in Jerusalem during the conference and we hope to  
arrange for a quick greeting from him.
 
A final version of the program will be posted soon but here are the time  
slots so that you can begin to make plans to listen in live. This is tentative,  
but is getting close to final as far as the time slots go. As soon as the  
speakers send me their topics I will determine how to plug it all in and  
re-publish. All times are Central Time Zone.
 
Friday, October 17th
Welcome and Erev Shabbat  Fellowship at Temple Sinai Synagogue - 6 P.M. until
Ross Nichols  will welcome those in attendance and those who are listening in 
live over the  Internet.
Ross will introduce the speakers; Joe Good, Debbie Good, Walter  Oakley.
Open Mic - The microphones will now turn to  those in attendance.  We will 
take some time to allow people to share what  brings them to this place in 
celebration of an ancient Hebrew  Festival.
Live Music to follow until we depart for the  campground.
 
Saturday, October 18th
 
9:30 - 10:00 / Meet and Greet
10:00 - 11:30 / First Class
2:00 - 3:30  / Second Class
4:00 - 6:00 / Third Class
Live Music to follow until we  depart for the campground.
 
Sunday, October 19th
 
9:30 - 10:00 / Meet and Greet
10:00 - 11:30 / First Class
2:00 - 3:30  / Second Class
7:00 P.M. until - Ross Nichols Sunday Shul Class on Torah  Portion Bereshith
 
All classes will be webcast live and posted as podcasts as soon as  possible.
Individual classes or a collection of the entire conference will be  offered 
as a package at a later date. Proceeds to go to Arba4 to further the  teaching 
and outreach of Torah Faith to the nations.
 
We hope that many of you will be able to spend the weekend with us, but for  
those that cannot make the trip we hope that you will listen in live.
 
We hope and intend to set some things up that will allow you to interact  
with the speakers and those in attendance, via phone and internet - but details  
are still in the works.
 
If you are coming to the conference and have not yet signed up on my  
website, please do so.  We are getting close and I will be sending out more  regular 
updates as we draw closer to the conference.
 
If you have questions or concerns, please email me at _rndavar at aol.com_ 
(mailto:rndavar at aol.com) .
 
Shabbat Shalom, Ross
 
Ross K.  Nichols 
_www.RootsofFaith.org_ (http://www.rootsoffaith.org/) 





**************New MapQuest Local shows what's happening at your destination.  
Dining, Movies, Events, News & more. Try it out!      
(http://local.mapquest.com/?ncid=emlcntnew00000001)
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From eliasaph at uniteourheart.com  Sun Oct  5 02:35:52 2008
From: eliasaph at uniteourheart.com (Steve Mathe)
Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 00:35:52 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] calling all Ten Tribes enthusiasts to networking
Message-ID: <200810050737.m957bB1D015229@mail207c25.carrierzone.com>

Dear Friends,

Am sounding the shofar call again, for the new network established at 
http://www.azamra.org.  Do not let the fact that Rabbi Avraham 
Greenbaum, a Breslover from Jerusalem is heading it.  I think it is a 
great thing, that there is at least one rabbi, who knows that Joseph 
lives and is willing to give them a space on his newly established 
worldwide network.

Am calling all those who are interested to belong, so that we can 
network in the future for projects we can all be part of, regrdless 
of our particular religious leanings.  If you are of Ephraim, be it 
of Christian, Jewish, Abrahamic Faith, or whatever other leanings, 
there is a place for you.

For now, am just trying to have you register on the network, so you 
can be on it, and contacted for live forums, and discussions, etc. 
The system is rather new, and am not sure how to work it yet, and 
some glitches are to be ironed out in it.  The idea is to be on it, 
and that will be a beginning of a worldwide Ephraimite, 
Joseph-related network that I have wanted to see actualized for some 
time.  baruch hasehm, it is here. In the coming year, I hope to see 
it actually do things that will promote cohesiveness and cooperation 
among our diverse members for the purposes of promoting our "coming 
near" to HaShem as the Work of Eli Y-ah in the "the latter days" will 
lead us. The idea here is to follow Yaakov Avinu's command to "gather 
yourselves together" at the end of days, and also what Isaiah tells 
us in Isa. 45:20: "Assemble yourselves and come, draw near together, 
ye that are escaped of the nations..."

When you register and fill out your profile sheet, be sure to put 
down among your interests: "Networking with Ten Tribes."  This way 
all those interested in finding you will know what your particular 
interests are.  I for one will try to contact all of you who have 
such an interests to let you know the latest of some items of 
interest on which we can cooperate, i.e. do something.  True, we have 
lots to discuss, argue and deliberate.  We can also do "some" things 
for starters.  Not many, only "some" things. For those endeavors, we 
need to come together and pool our resources, not just in this group, 
but with other groups and individuals who identify as "Ephraim."

Am of the opinion, that we need to be active in projects among 
ourselves as well on behalf of our common cause with Israel / 
Yehudah.   It is time.

I also invite you to tune in to Rabbi Greenbaum's Sunday class 
tomorrow, live from Jerusalem, with chat-room facilities.   This way 
you will get a flavor of who he is.

BTW, there is no need to fear here that anyone will try to convert 
you or anyone else or to coopt your groups for anything.  We just 
hope that you will be converted by HaShem to be what He wants you to 
be, a son and daughter "in whom He is well pleased." You take with 
you the learning that you want and need. No one is perfect, and there 
is not pretention to any perfection with Rabbi Greenbaum.  He is 
human as the rest of us.  He does have a great love for the Torah and 
all those who seek its ways.

The idea is to present ourselves as a group in Jerusalem before 
HaShem.  Ephraim is very divided among himself, and you can stay that 
way.  I am writing an article on that now.  There is no need to fear 
that I or anyone else will try to "convert" you.  Just draw 
near.  This is what Elijah tells the alienated  northern Israelites , 
(I Kings 18:30).  I have every reason to believe that HaShem in His 
greater end-time work will replicate on a greater scale His former 
small scale work He wrought through Elijah the prophet during the 
days of Ahab and Jezebel.  Fair enough?  Let's get going gang!!

Let's see you in the chat room tomorrow, and please sign up on the 
network.  The three part haftara reading for this past Shabbat (Hos. 
14:2-1), Micah 7:18-20, Joel 2:15-27), and the haftarah for second 
day of Yom Teruah (Jer. 31:1-20) should be giving us an impetus to 
all of us do so.  Let's get going.  Register NOW!  
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From patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com  Sun Oct  5 09:00:03 2008
From: patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com (Pat Robbins)
Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 10:00:03 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] calling all Ten Tribes enthusiasts to networking
In-Reply-To: <200810050737.m957bB1D015229@mail207c25.carrierzone.com>
References: <200810050737.m957bB1D015229@mail207c25.carrierzone.com>
Message-ID: <BLU125-DS4E2545E14598DCE976402BA3E0@phx.gbl>

This is wonderful, Steve!  What a lovely and encouraging email to read first thing this morning!  

I'll be tuning in to Rabbi  Avraham later this morning too.  I believe the live broadcast begins at 11:00 a.m. EST, 10:00 a.m. Central Time and 8:00 a.m. in California on www.azamra.org  -  I usually just try to get a place by clicking into his "Living Torah Online Study" a bit early because I know the space is limited, and I want to be able to talk with the Rabbi and others online.

It's truly amazing to see the Tribes coming together, and a member of the Rabbinic establishment of Israel chatting with them as he teaches his Torah lesson online!  BARUCH HASHEM that THE TIME is upon us!!!!!   May Hashem hold each and every one of us in the Palm of His Hand and show us His Way, and may He lead us safely Home.  

Henei ma tov....... ("Behold how good and how pleasant it is for brethren to dwell together as one!!!!"  Ps. 133:1)

Love,

Pat


From: Steve Mathe 
Sent: Sunday, October 05, 2008 3:35 AM
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
Subject: [Dialogue] calling all Ten Tribes enthusiasts to networking


Dear Friends, 

Am sounding the shofar call again, for the new network established at http://www.azamra.org.  Do not let the fact that Rabbi Avraham Greenbaum, a Breslover from Jerusalem is heading it.  I think it is a great thing, that there is at least one rabbi, who knows that Joseph lives and is willing to give them a space on his newly established worldwide network. 

Am calling all those who are interested to belong, so that we can network in the future for projects we can all be part of, regrdless of our particular religious leanings.  If you are of Ephraim, be it of Christian, Jewish, Abrahamic Faith, or whatever other leanings, there is a place for you. 

For now, am just trying to have you register on the network, so you can be on it, and contacted for live forums, and discussions, etc. The system is rather new, and am not sure how to work it yet, and some glitches are to be ironed out in it.  The idea is to be on it, and that will be a beginning of a worldwide Ephraimite, Joseph-related network that I have wanted to see actualized for some time.  baruch hasehm, it is here. In the coming year, I hope to see it actually do things that will promote cohesiveness and cooperation among our diverse members for the purposes of promoting our "coming near" to HaShem as the Work of Eli Y-ah in the "the latter days" will lead us. The idea here is to follow Yaakov Avinu's command to "gather yourselves together" at the end of days, and also what Isaiah tells us in Isa. 45:20: "Assemble yourselves and come, draw near together, ye that are escaped of the nations..." 

When you register and fill out your profile sheet, be sure to put down among your interests: "Networking with Ten Tribes."  This way all those interested in finding you will know what your particular interests are.  I for one will try to contact all of you who have such an interests to let you know the latest of some items of interest on which we can cooperate, i.e. do something.  True, we have lots to discuss, argue and deliberate.  We can also do "some" things for starters.  Not many, only "some" things. For those endeavors, we need to come together and pool our resources, not just in this group, but with other groups and individuals who identify as "Ephraim." 

Am of the opinion, that we need to be active in projects among ourselves as well on behalf of our common cause with Israel / Yehudah.   It is time. 

I also invite you to tune in to Rabbi Greenbaum's Sunday class tomorrow, live from Jerusalem, with chat-room facilities.   This way you will get a flavor of who he is. 

BTW, there is no need to fear here that anyone will try to convert you or anyone else or to coopt your groups for anything.  We just hope that you will be converted by HaShem to be what He wants you to be, a son and daughter "in whom He is well pleased." You take with you the learning that you want and need. No one is perfect, and there is not pretention to any perfection with Rabbi Greenbaum.  He is human as the rest of us.  He does have a great love for the Torah and all those who seek its ways.  

The idea is to present ourselves as a group in Jerusalem before HaShem.  Ephraim is very divided among himself, and you can stay that way.  I am writing an article on that now.  There is no need to fear that I or anyone else will try to "convert" you.  Just draw near. This is what Elijah tells the alienated  northern Israelites , (I Kings 18:30).  I have every reason to believe that HaShem in His greater end-time work will replicate on a greater scale His former small scale work He wrought through Elijah the prophet during the days of Ahab and Jezebel.  Fair enough?  Let's get going gang!! 

Let's see you in the chat room tomorrow, and please sign up on the network.  The three part haftara reading for this past Shabbat (Hos. 14:2-1), Micah 7:18-20, Joel 2:15-27), and the haftarah for second day of Yom Teruah (Jer. 31:1-20) should be giving us an impetus to all of us do so.  Let's get going.  Register NOW! 


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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From eliasaph at uniteourheart.com  Sun Oct  5 10:16:06 2008
From: eliasaph at uniteourheart.com (Steve Mathe)
Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 08:16:06 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] R. Greenbaum's class is on now
Message-ID: <200810051516.m95FG67f011499@mail2505.carrierzone.com>

Shalom Everyone,

Just a reminder, that R. Greenbaum's class is on now.  It is 8:15 AM 
Pacific Standard Time.   You ca listen in, even if you do join the 
chat room.  However, I recommend that you join the chat room, with a 
screen name.  No one will know who you are.  Your presence will help 
R. Greenbaum  to see that the class is increasing in size. See you there.

Steve



From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sun Oct  5 12:54:05 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 13:54:05 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Olmert is totally delusional....
Message-ID: <855590370810051054v1c97c2e5xdf1159fa74260bd7@mail.gmail.com>

An excellent analysis of the insanity currently happening, even as I write
this...
                  * Hanoch*
**
 *Column One: Olmert's parting blows*
October 3, 2008
Caroline Glick, THE JERUSALEM POST

Outgoing Prime Minister Ehud Olmert has never been a shrinking violet. And
on Monday, he made clear that he has absolutely no intention of leaving the
public stage quietly.

In a Rosh Hashana interview with Yediot Aharonot, Olmert admitted for the
first time that he is negotiating deals with Syria and the Fatah-led faction
of the Palestinian Authority committing Israel to withdraw from the Golan
Heights, from dozens of neighborhoods in Jerusalem and the Temple Mount, as
well as from all or nearly all of Judea and Samaria.

Olmert noted that he is the first prime minister to state explicitly that he
supports Israel's geographical contraction to the 1949 armistice lines.
Indeed, none of his predecessors were ever so explicit. And his likely
successor in office - Foreign Minister Tzipi Livni - loses her voice every
time she is asked whether she believes that Israel should withdraw from
Jerusalem, the Golan Heights and all of Judea and Samaria.

Olmert's willingness to spell out the expanse of the territorial handovers
he supports makes him unique among Israel's premiers. But his stated view
that Israel has no choice other than to withdraw from almost all the lands
it took control of during the Six Day War has been the common view of every
Israeli prime minister except Likud leader Binyamin Netanyahu since 1993.
Yitzhak Rabin, Shimon Peres, Ehud Barak and Ariel Sharon all signaled their
support for this view. Indeed, all of their central policies while in office
were predicated on it.

THE QUESTION is, why has this been the case? Why is it that for the past 15
years, at a certain point in their tenures every prime minister aside from
Netanyahu has come to the conclusion that Israel must turn over its land to
those sworn to its destruction?

Like Rabin, Peres, Barak and Sharon before him, Olmert makes no rational
argument for withdrawal. He simply asserts it. And like his predecessors,
Olmert uses three rhetorical tricks to support his assertion. First, he
notes the uniqueness of his position as prime minister. Olmert knows Israel
must surrender its land simply because he is prime minister. Sharon
expressed this most clearly when he intoned, "What you see from here, you
don't see from there."

Second, Olmert and his predecessors - and his likely successor Livni - all
claim that "everybody knows" that Israel must withdraw. That is, you have to
be completely out of your mind not to agree with me because every
right-minded person agrees with me.

Olmert made this intellectually intimidating point explicitly on Monday in
reference to the Golan Heights when he said, "I want to see if there is one
person in the State of Israel who believes that it is possible to make peace
with Syria without conceding anything on the Golan Heights."

Finally, Olmert and his predecessors - and his likely successor - argue that
it is inevitable that Israel withdraw to the 1949 armistice lines. And since
it is inevitable, it might as well be done right now. As Olmert said - again
of the Golan Heights, - "I put it to you, say in the next year or two a
regional war erupts and we find ourselves in a military confrontation with
Syria... I ask myself, what happens after we beat them? First of all we will
pay a price [for victory] and it will be painful. And after we pay what we
pay, what will we say to them? 'Let's talk.' And what will the Syrians say?
'Let's talk about the Golan.'"

The assertion that a prime minister knows more than regular people is true.
But no secret information in the world counterbalances empirical evidence
that is open for all to see. While it may or may not be true that Israel can
live at peace with the Palestinians and Syrians without returning to the
1949 armistice lines, it is manifestly true that neither the Syrians nor the
Palestinians are interested in living at peace with Israel. So while an
interesting theoretical question, the issue of whether Israel needs to give
up land for peace is completely irrelevant today.

Both the Syrians and the Palestinians know that Olmert - like his
predecessors since Rabin - is willing to go back to the 1949 armistice lines
in exchange for peace. And operating on this knowledge, over the past 15
years, both societies have gravitated into the Iranian axis.

Today, at the same time as Syrian President Bashar Assad holds indirect
talks about an Israeli surrender of the Golan Heights, he has amassed 25,000
soldiers on his border with northern Lebanon. He is rebuilding his nuclear
program with Iranian money and North Korean scientists. He has pledged to
the Iranians that he will continue arming Hizbullah and Hamas and that his
negotiations with Olmert will be coordinated ahead of time with Iran.

As for the Palestinians, at every stage of their relationship with Israel
for the past 15 years, every one of their leaders - from Fatah, Hamas and
Islamic Jihad alike - has been categorical in his refusal to accept Israel's
right to exist. Moreover, insofar as Fatah is concerned, the violent
conflict with Israel was supposed to have ended in 1993. In 1993, Yasser
Arafat pledged that from then on, all of the Palestinians' issues with
Israel would be resolved through negotiations and that terror would be
combated, not fostered.

While calling for immediate territorial surrenders to enemies uninterested
in peace, Olmert - like his predecessors - also claims that the risk
involved in surrendering the Golan Heights, Judea, Samaria and Jerusalem is
minimal because Israel is so strong. As Olmert put it, "We are stronger than
they are. I tell you, Israel is the strongest country in the Middle East. We
can handle all our enemies and we can handle all our enemies together and
win."

Yet Olmert - like his predecessors - fails to acknowledge that if we give up
the lands we took control over in 1967 we will be much weaker. And our
ability to deter our enemies from joining together to attack us will be
severely curtailed. He ignores the fact that it was Israel's withdrawal from
Lebanon in May 2000 that inspired the Palestinians to attack us in September
2000. He ignores the fact that Israel's withdrawal from Gaza in 2005
inspired Hizbullah to attack us in 2006. And he ignores the fact that
Israel's failure to defeat Hizbullah in 2006 inspired Hamas to take control
of Gaza in 2007. And in all of this, he ignores the fact that Hamas,
Hizbullah and Syria are controlled by Iran.

AS FOR Iran, when the issue of Teheran's nuclear weapons program comes up,
the leader who says we can beat all our enemies at once is suddenly singing
another tune. Israel, "the strongest country in the Middle East," is crazy
if it thinks it can defend itself against its most formidable foe.

In Olmert's view, "Part of our exaggeration of our power and our lack of any
sense of proportion is found in the statements being made here about Iran...
The assumption that if America, Russia and China and Britain and Germany
don't know how to handle the Iranians that we the Israelis do know - this is
an example of a loss of proportions."

So Olmert, like Sharon, Barak, Peres and Rabin before him, has made the
determination that the only strategy that Israel can follow is one of utter
defeatism and surrender. And he - like they before him - has made this
strategic calculation in the face of empirical evidence that shows that
whatever the costs of retaining the status quo - or of actually defeating
our enemies - the cost of surrender and defeatism is surrender and defeat.
That is, the cost to the country of following their lead to surrender is
higher than the cost of not surrendering or subcontracting our survival to
outside powers.

SO IF the view that Israel's only option is surrender has no basis in
empirical evidence, what accounts for Olmert's baseless assertions?

The answer, unfortunately, is clear. Quite simply, life is easier for
premiers, and much better for former premiers on the Left than on the Right.

As Olmert considers his options going forward, he knows two things. First,
he knows that the international lecture circuit is eminently more generous
to former Israeli prime ministers who speak ill of Israel than it is for
former premiers who defend Israel. Second, he knows that if he ever hopes to
return to politics, he will only be able to return as the head of the Left.
His explicit statements on the need for Israeli capitulation will serve him
well in both ventures.

Then there is the issue of Olmert's legal woes. While Olmert's policy
decisions are the same as all of his predecessors, the circumstances in
which he is leaving office are analogous only to those that confronted Ehud
Barak.

Like Olmert, Barak left office under a cloud of criminal probes. And in his
final months in office, he cast all remaining vestiges of strategic
rationality to the seven winds in his desperate negotiations with Arafat.
Despite the fact that his government had already collapsed, neither the
Supreme Court nor the Attorney-General's Office told him he lacked the legal
right to concede Israel's sovereignty over Jerusalem. And in recognition of
his embrace of post-Zionism, once Barak was out of office, all the criminal
probes against him were quietly closed.

Like Barak, Olmert probably won't be around long enough to conclude the
surrenders he strives for. But that doesn't mean that his statements are not
dangerous for the country.

Far-left politicians and their counterparts in the media claim that Olmert
is brave to speak as openly as he has. And this is true. It does take some
bravery to stick your finger in the eye of the general public - which
doesn't support your views.

Olmert's statements and actions, which contradict the pledges he made to
voters in 2006, are a slap in the face of the Israeli electorate.
Unfortunately, the public has grown all too used to such blows. Rabin, Barak
and Sharon were all elected on the basis of hawkish platforms. And they all
abandoned their platforms after they were elected. This constant deceit has
made the public cynical and engendered a sense of powerlessness among
Israeli citizens. This sense is merely exacerbated by the sight of Livni
working madly to avoid standing for election by attempting to form a new
government. This is all the more true given that she rests her claim to
governing legitimacy on her narrow victory in a tiny primary race riven by
allegations of corruption.

So by ignoring the basic reality of Israel's strategic challenges and
speaking of irrelevant concessions to imaginary peace partners while
demonstrating his abject contempt for the public, Olmert is causing us great
harm. He is reinforcing our belief that we have no option other than
deceitful leaders who ignore our rights and reality. And this is a dangerous
delusion. Because the truth is that not all of Israel's leaders are
defeatists. There are still leaders who put the country first. They are
simply not friends of Olmert's.

caroline at carolineglick.com
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sun Oct  5 13:05:13 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 14:05:13 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Learning to read between the lines...
Message-ID: <855590370810051105h602cc63bk2dc8939b11fafbbc@mail.gmail.com>

The article below illustrates a situation that has begun occurring; the
Israeli Army is not (under political restraints) sufficiently protecting the
Jewish residents of Yehuda v'Shomron (Judea & Samaria) - the very Biblical
heartland.  And, they're not aggressively pursuing Arab attackers, and have
even begun 'recalling' some weapons that had been provided to the Jews
there.  This is all part of the policy to "encourage" them to abandon their
homes and move to pre-'67 Israel - without a repeat of the horrors of Gush
Katif.  Make the area Judenrein ('Jew Free') - that's the goal...and blame
the victims, not their Arab-Nazi Jihadist attackers.....
        *  Hanoch*
**


Residents 'Help' Army Provide Security 6 Tishrei 5769, 05 October 08 10:25
by by Hillel Fendel

(IsraelNN.com) Jewish residents of towns in Shomron (Samaria) and Yehuda
(Judea) note a worrisome increase in terrorist incidents of late, and many
of them say the government's approach must be changed.

Esther Karish of Kedumim, a member of the Shomron Residents Council, says,
"The declarations by Prime Minister Olmert regarding Jews perpetrating
pogroms on non-Jews, and his willingness to give away parts of the Land of
Israel, cause the Arabs here to raise their heads and endanger the lives of
the Jewish residents."

She made the remarks on Thursday, shortly after the army completed what she
called a "strong-armed" evacuation and destruction of the Shvut Ami
outpost.  While the destruction was taking place, just south of Kedumim,
Arabs in the area set fire to the brush near the would-be neighborhood,
endangering both the soldiers and the residents.

*False Media Reports
*The fire was falsely reported in the general Israeli media as having been
set by Jews in an Arab olive grove.

On Wednesday night, prior to the demolition, Arabs from a nearby village
stoned no fewer than six Jewish cars returning after the Rosh HaShanah
holiday.

"There have been more stonings and more firebombs of late," Karish said,
"not to mention the recent arsons and stabbings in Yitzhar... It's true that
the army blocked the Arab village's access road to the main road here, but
the Arabs have found a way to detour it.  If we don't respond, then the army
will always say that they are doing what they can and cannot do more.
Therefore, if the residents stand up for their rights to safety and
security, things will look different."

Meanwhile, the Commander of the Central Region in the IDF, Gen. Gad Shamni,
says the situation is largely the fault of the Jewish leadership in Judea
and Samaria.  "The rabbinic and public leadership in Judea and Samaria is
responsible for the rise in settler violence," Shamni was quoted as saying.

Rabbi Elyakim Levanon, rabbi of the veteran Shomron town Elon Moreh, is not
having any of it: "I've been hearing these claims for 27 years. What
violence is he talking about? The Jewish residents have been the victims of
terrorist shooting, the stabbing of a boy and arson in Yitzhar, and daily
rock-throwings.  If I'm not mistaken, the only damage done [when the Yitzhar
residents responded to the stabbing/arson attack]was that some windows were
broken; not one Arab was hurt.  But on our side, Jews are hurt."%ad%

"In the past," Rabbi Levanon said, "there were open channels of
communication between the Central Commander and the rabbinic and public
leadership in Yesha - but I know of no such thing with Shamni.  He doesn't
know us, so how can he come out with these criticims? His remarks are
irresponsible. First let him come and sit with us, and he'll see what
beautiful things are being done to connect between the IDF and the
residents."

"On the other hand, we expect to see the army respond more appropriately to
the hostile and violent activity on the part of the Arabs in these areas,
and not to be influenced and weakened by the political echelons."

On Saturday night, in Gush Etzion, Arabs threw four Molotov cocktails at an
Israeli car. No one was hurt and there was no damage.
 www.IsraelNationalNews.com <http://www.israelnationalnews.com/>
(c) Copyright IsraelNationalNews.com
Subscribe to the free Daily Israel Report - sub.israelnn.com
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sun Oct  5 13:20:00 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 14:20:00 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] What every American needs to read - please circulate
Message-ID: <855590370810051120i432bdac6rc0f52c549f851d7b@mail.gmail.com>

  *EVERY AMERICAN NEEDS TO READ THIS* *AND UNDERSTAND WHAT IT MEANS **!*



*
**
**Editor's Note: Below are selected excerpts from Brigitte Gabriel's speech
**delivered at the Intelligence Summit in Washington DC    **


**We gather here today to share information and knowledge. Intelligence is
not merely cold hard data about numerical strength or armament or **disposition
of military forces. The most important element of intelligence has to be
understanding the mindset and intention of the enemy. The West has been
wallowing in a state of ignorance and denial for thirty years as Muslim
extremist perpetrated evil against innocent victims in the name of Allah. **

I was ten years old when my home exploded around me, burying me under the
rubble and leaving me to drink my blood to survive, as the perpetra tors
shouted, 'Allah Akbar!' My only crime was that I was a Christian living in a
Christian town. At 10 years old, I learned the meaning of the word
'infidel.'

I had a crash course in survival. Not in the Girl Scouts, but in a bomb
shelter where I lived for seven years in pitch darkness, freezing cold,
drinking stale water and eating grass to live. At the age of 13, dressed in
my burial clothes going to bed at night, waiting to be slaughtered. By the
age of 20, I had buried most of my friends--killed by Muslims. We were not
Americans living in New York , or Britons in London . We were Arab
Christians living in Lebanon .

As a victim of Islamic terror, I was amazed when I saw Americans waking up
on September 12, 2001, and asking themselves 'Why do they hate us?' The
psychoanalyst experts were coming up with all sort of excuses as to what did
we do to offend the Muslim World. But if America and the West were paying
attention to the Middle East they would not have had to ask the question.
Simply put, they hate us because we are defined in their eyes by one simple
word: 'infidels.'

Under the banner of Islam 'la, ilaha illa Allah, muhammad rasoulu Allah,'
(None is god except Allah; Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah) they murdered
Jewish children in Israel , massacred Christians in Lebanon, killed Copts in
Egypt, Assyrians in Syria, Hindus in India, and expelled almost 900,000 Jews
from Muslim lands. We Middle Eastern infidels paid the price then. Now
infidels worldwide are paying the price for **indifference and
shortsightedness. **

Tolerating evil is a crime. Appeasing murderers doesn't buy protection. It
earns one disrespect and loathing in the enemy's eyes. Yet apathy is the
weapon by which the West is committing suicide. Political correctness forms
the shackles around our ankles, by which Islamists are leading us to our
demise.

America and the West are doomed to failure in this war unless they stand up
and identify the real enemy: Islam. You hear about Wahabbi and Salafi Islam
as the only extreme form of Islam. All the other Muslims, supposedly, are
wonderful moderates. Closer to the truth are the pictures of the irrational
eruption of violence in reaction to the cartoons of Mohammed printed by a
Danish newspaper. From burning embassies, to calls to butcher those who mock
Islam, to warnings that the West be prepared for another holocaust, those
pictures have given us a glimpse into the real face of the enemy. News
pictures and video of these events represent a canvas of hate decorated by
different nationalities who share one common ideology of hate, bigotry and
intolerance derived from one source:  authentic Islam. An Islam that is
awakening from centuries of slumber to re- ignite its wrath against the
infidel and dominate the world. An Islam which has declared 'Intifada' on
the West.

America and the West can no longer afford to lay in their lazy state of
overweight ignorance. The consequences of this mental disease are starting
to attack the body, and if they don't take the necessary steps now to
control it, death will be knocking soon. *  *If you want to** **understand
the nature of the enemy we face, visualize a tapestry of snakes. They
slither and they hiss, and they would eat each other alive, but they will
unite in a hideous mass to achieve their common goal of imposing Islam on
the world. **

This is the ugly face of the enemy we are fighting. We are fighting a
powerful ideology that is capable of altering basic human instincts. An
ideology that can turn a mother into a launching pad of death. A perfect
example is a recently elected Hamas official in the Palestinian Territories
who raves in heavenly joy about sending her three sons to death and offering
the ones who are still alive for the cause. It is an ideology that is
capable of offering highly educated individuals such as doctors and lawyers
far more joy in attaining death than any respect and stature life in society
is ever capable of giving them.

The United States has been a prime target for radical Islamic hatred and
terror. Every Friday, mosques in the Middle East ring with shrill **prayers
and monotonous chants calling death, destruction and damnation down on
America and its people. The radical Islamist deeds have been as vile as
their words. Since the Iran hostage crisis, more than three thousand
Americans have died in a terror campaign almost unprecedented in its
calculated cruelty along with thousands of other citizens worldwide.
**
**Even the Nazis did not turn their own children into human bombs, and then
rejoice at their deaths as well the deaths of their victims. **This
intentional, indiscriminate and wholesale murder of innocent American
citizens is justified and glorified in the name of Islam. **

America cannot effectively defend itself in this war unless and until the
American people understand the nature of the enemy that we face. Even after
9/11 there are those who say that we must engage our terrorist enemies, that
we must address their grievances. Their grievance is our freedom of
religion. Their grievance is our freedom of speech. Their grievance is our
democratic process where the rule of law comes from the voices of many not
that of just one prophet. It is the respect we instill in our children
towards all religions. It is the equality we grant each other as human
beings sharing a planet and striving to make the world a better place for
all humanity. Their grievance is the kindness and respect a man shows a
woman, the justice we practice as equals under the law, and the mercy we
grant our enemy. Their grievance cannot be answered by an apology for who or
what we are.

**Our mediocre attitude of not confronting Islamic forces of bigotry and
hatred wherever they raised their ugly head in the last 30 years, has
empowered and strengthened our enemy to launch a full scale attack on the
very freedoms we cherish in their effort to impose their values and way of
life on our civilization.**
**
**If we don't wake up and challenge our Muslim community to take action
against the terrorists within it, if we don't believe in ourselves as
Americans and in the standards we should hold every patriotic American to,
we are going to pay a price for our delusion. For the sake of our children
and our country, we must wake up and take action. In the face of a torrent
of hateful invective and terrorist murder, America's learning curve since
the Iran hostage crisis is so shallow that it is almost flat. The longer we
lay supine, the more difficult it will be to stand erect.**  *



*Brigitte Gabriel is an expert on the Middle East conflict and lectures
nationally and internationally on the subject. She's the former news anchor
of World News for Middle East ? television and the founder of
AmericanCongressforTruth.com <http://americancongressfortruth.com/> ..  *



*Complete article is at
http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID016 *

*Do you doubt this ?     Go to --
http://www.snopes.com/politics/soapbox/gabriel.asp*
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From eliasaph at uniteourheart.com  Sun Oct  5 13:43:24 2008
From: eliasaph at uniteourheart.com (Steve Mathe)
Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 11:43:24 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] Olmert is totally delusional....
In-Reply-To: <855590370810051054v1c97c2e5xdf1159fa74260bd7@mail.gmail.co
 m>
References: <855590370810051054v1c97c2e5xdf1159fa74260bd7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200810051843.m95IhNcl031939@mail206c25.carrierzone.com>


Caroline Glick wrote:


>Far-left politicians and their counterparts in the media claim that 
>Olmert is brave to speak as openly as he has. And this is true. It 
>does take some bravery to stick your finger in the eye of the 
>general public - which doesn't support your views.

However, it can also take outright stupidity and insanity, of which 
this is exhibit "A"!!  May HaShem deliver us from ourselves, because 
Olmert and Obama are leaders who indicate severe judgment upon us, 
and it could get worse... if they or their proteges win.....

One of the curses we just read a few weeks ago is: "And the L-RD will 
smite thee with madness, (shiga'on, an insanity characterized by 
furious maniacal behavior), and with blindness and with astonishment 
(timmahon / confusion, panic)  of heart. Certainly, the blind are 
leading many of the blind......   it is all a chastisement upon us 
that the Tribes of Israel may wake up.


Olmert and Obama are certainly energized for what they must do.  May 
we all be also energized by the Ruach at such happenings, for what we 
must do.  Let us all ask Hashem to inspire us, and let us all get 
ready to do our parts in "the final conflict" that is shaping 
up.  Rabbi Greenbaum said today that it looks like the world is 
getting ready for world war.  So is HaShem, and we are part of that 
mobilization.

Steve




At 10:54 AM 10/5/2008, you wrote:
>An excellent analysis of the insanity currently happening, even as I 
>write this...
>                    Hanoch
>
>Column One: Olmert's parting blows
>October 3, 2008
>Caroline Glick, THE JERUSALEM POST
>
>Outgoing Prime Minister Ehud Olmert has never been a shrinking 
>violet. And on Monday, he made clear that he has absolutely no 
>intention of leaving the public stage quietly.
>
>In a Rosh Hashana interview with Yediot Aharonot, Olmert admitted 
>for the first time that he is negotiating deals with Syria and the 
>Fatah-led faction of the Palestinian Authority committing Israel to 
>withdraw from the Golan Heights, from dozens of neighborhoods in 
>Jerusalem and the Temple Mount, as well as from all or nearly all of 
>Judea and Samaria.
>
>Olmert noted that he is the first prime minister to state explicitly 
>that he supports Israel's geographical contraction to the 1949 
>armistice lines. Indeed, none of his predecessors were ever so 
>explicit. And his likely successor in office - Foreign Minister 
>Tzipi Livni - loses her voice every time she is asked whether she 
>believes that Israel should withdraw from Jerusalem, the Golan 
>Heights and all of Judea and Samaria.
>
>Olmert's willingness to spell out the expanse of the territorial 
>handovers he supports makes him unique among Israel's premiers. But 
>his stated view that Israel has no choice other than to withdraw 
>from almost all the lands it took control of during the Six Day War 
>has been the common view of every Israeli prime minister except 
>Likud leader Binyamin Netanyahu since 1993. Yitzhak Rabin, Shimon 
>Peres, Ehud Barak and Ariel Sharon all signaled their support for 
>this view. Indeed, all of their central policies while in office 
>were predicated on it.
>
>THE QUESTION is, why has this been the case? Why is it that for the 
>past 15 years, at a certain point in their tenures every prime 
>minister aside from Netanyahu has come to the conclusion that Israel 
>must turn over its land to those sworn to its destruction?
>
>Like Rabin, Peres, Barak and Sharon before him, Olmert makes no 
>rational argument for withdrawal. He simply asserts it. And like his 
>predecessors, Olmert uses three rhetorical tricks to support his 
>assertion. First, he notes the uniqueness of his position as prime 
>minister. Olmert knows Israel must surrender its land simply because 
>he is prime minister. Sharon expressed this most clearly when he 
>intoned, "What you see from here, you don't see from there."
...................... 
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From chattertonw at bellsouth.net  Sun Oct  5 13:51:38 2008
From: chattertonw at bellsouth.net (chattertonw at bellsouth.net)
Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 18:51:38 +0000
Subject: [Dialogue] Olmert is totally delusional....
In-Reply-To: <200810051843.m95IhNcl031939@mail206c25.carrierzone.com>
References: <855590370810051054v1c97c2e5xdf1159fa74260bd7@mail.gmail.com>
	<200810051843.m95IhNcl031939@mail206c25.carrierzone.com>
Message-ID: <100520081851.24510.48E90CBA0000103700005FBE22230650629B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>

Exodus 15:3 3 YHVH is a man of war: YHVH is his name. 

Isaiah 42:13 YHVH shall go forth as a mighty man, he shall stir up jealousy like a man of war: he shall cry, yea, roar; he shall prevail against his enemies. 


-------------- Original message from Steve Mathe <eliasaph at uniteourheart.com>: -------------- 


Caroline Glick wrote: 



Far-left politicians and their counterparts in the media claim that Olmert is brave to speak as openly as he has. And this is true. It does take some bravery to stick your finger in the eye of the general public - which doesn't support your views.

However, it can also take outright stupidity and insanity, of which this is exhibit "A"!!  May HaShem deliver us from ourselves, because Olmert and Obama are leaders who indicate severe judgment upon us, and it could get worse... if they or their proteges win.....  

One of the curses we just read a few weeks ago is: "And the L-RD will smite thee with madness, (shiga'on, an insanity characterized by furious maniacal behavior), and with blindness and with astonishment (timmahon / confusion, panic)  of heart. Certainly, the blind are leading many of the blind......   it is all a chastisement upon us that the Tribes of Israel may wake up.


Olmert and Obama are certainly energized for what they must do.  May we all be also energized by the Ruach at such happenings, for what we must do.  Let us all ask Hashem to inspire us, and let us all get ready to do our parts in "the final conflict" that is shaping up.  Rabbi Greenbaum said today that it looks like the world is getting ready for world war.  So is HaShem, and we are part of that mobilization. 

Steve




At 10:54 AM 10/5/2008, you wrote:

An excellent analysis of the insanity currently happening, even as I write this...
                  Hanoch
 

Column One: Olmert's parting blows
October 3, 2008
Caroline Glick, THE JERUSALEM POST


Outgoing Prime Minister Ehud Olmert has never been a shrinking violet. And on Monday, he made clear that he has absolutely no intention of leaving the public stage quietly.

In a Rosh Hashana interview with Yediot Aharonot, Olmert admitted for the first time that he is negotiating deals with Syria and the Fatah-led faction of the Palestinian Authority committing Israel to withdraw from the Golan Heights, from dozens of neighborhoods in Jerusalem and the Temple Mount, as well as from all or nearly all of Judea and Samaria.

Olmert noted that he is the first prime minister to state explicitly that he supports Israel's geographical contraction to the 1949 armistice lines. Indeed, none of his predecessors were ever so explicit. And his likely successor in office - Foreign Minister Tzipi Livni - loses her voice every time she is asked whether she believes that Israel should withdraw from Jerusalem, the Golan Heights and all of Judea and Samaria.

Olmert's willingness to spell out the expanse of the territorial handovers he supports makes him unique among Israel's premiers. But his stated view that Israel has no choice other than to withdraw from almost all the lands it took control of during the Six Day War has been the common view of every Israeli prime minister except Likud leader Binyamin Netanyahu since 1993. Yitzhak Rabin, Shimon Peres, Ehud Barak and Ariel Sharon all signaled their support for this view. Indeed, all of their central policies while in office were predicated on it.

THE QUESTION is, why has this been the case? Why is it that for the past 15 years, at a certain point in their tenures every prime minister aside from Netanyahu has come to the conclusion that Israel must turn over its land to those sworn to its destruction?

Like Rabin, Peres, Barak and Sharon before him, Olmert makes no rational argument for withdrawal. He simply asserts it. And like his predecessors, Olmert uses three rhetorical tricks to support his assertion. First, he notes the uniqueness of his position as prime minister. Olmert knows Israel must surrender its land simply because he is prime minister. Sharon expressed this most clearly when he intoned, "What you see from here, you don't see from there."
...................... 
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From eliasaph at uniteourheart.com  Sun Oct  5 14:14:24 2008
From: eliasaph at uniteourheart.com (Steve Mathe)
Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 12:14:24 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] Olmert is totally delusional....
In-Reply-To: <100520081851.24510.48E90CBA0000103700005FBE22230650629B0A0
	2D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>
References: <855590370810051054v1c97c2e5xdf1159fa74260bd7@mail.gmail.com>
	<200810051843.m95IhNcl031939@mail206c25.carrierzone.com>
	<100520081851.24510.48E90CBA0000103700005FBE22230650629B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>
Message-ID: <200810051914.m95JEMu1025973@mail207c25.carrierzone.com>


Yeah,  the G-d of Israel is not a peacenik who puts flowers in the 
gun barrels of murderers and death camp builders and hopes that will 
change their minds to be "flower children."  May we all wise up soon!!


At 11:51 AM 10/5/2008, you wrote:

>Exodus 15:3 3 YHVH is a man of war: YHVH is his name.
>
>
>
>Isaiah 42:13 YHVH shall go forth as a mighty man, he shall stir up 
>jealousy like a man of war: he shall cry, yea, roar; he shall 
>prevail against his enemies.
>
>
>
>
>-------------- Original message from Steve Mathe 
><eliasaph at uniteourheart.com>: --------------
>
>
>Caroline Glick wrote:
>
>
>>Far-left politicians and their counterparts in the media claim that 
>>Olmert is brave to speak as openly as he has. And this is true. It 
>>does take some bravery to stick your finger in the eye of the 
>>general public - which doesn't support your views.
>
>However, it can also take outright stupidity and insanity, of which 
>this is exhibit "A"!!  May HaShem deliver us from ourselves, because 
>Olmert and Obama are leaders who indicate severe judgment upon us, 
>and it could get worse... if they or their proteges win.....
>
>One of the curses we just read a few weeks ago is: "And the L-RD 
>will smite thee with madness, (shiga'on, an insanity characterized 
>by furious maniacal behavior), and with blindness and with 
>astonishment (timmahon / confusion, panic)  of heart. Certainly, the 
>blind are leading many of the blind......   it is all a chastisement 
>upon us that the Tribes of Israel may wake up.
>
>
>Olmert and Obama are certainly energized for what they must do.  May 
>we all be also energized by the Ruach at such happenings, for what 
>we must do.  Let us all ask Hashem to inspire us, and let us all get 
>ready to do our parts in "the final conflict" that is shaping 
>up.  Rabbi Greenbaum said today that it looks like the world is 
>getting ready for world war.  So is HaShem, and we are part of that 
>mobilization.
>
>Steve
>
>
>
>
>At 10:54 AM 10/5/2008, you wrote:
>>An excellent analysis of the insanity currently happening, even as 
>>I write this...
>>                   Hanoch
>>
>>Column One: Olmert's parting blows
>>October 3, 2008
>>Caroline Glick, THE JERUSALEM POST
>>
>>Outgoing Prime Minister Ehud Olmert has never been a shrinking 
>>violet. And on Monday, he made clear that he has absolutely no 
>>intention of leaving the public stage quietly.
>>
>>In a Rosh Hashana interview with Yediot Aharonot, Olmert admitted 
>>for the first time that he is negotiating deals with Syria and the 
>>Fatah-led faction of the Palestinian Authority committing Israel to 
>>withdraw from the Golan Heights, from dozens of neighborhoods in 
>>Jerusalem and the Temple Mount, as well as from all or nearly all 
>>of Judea and Samaria.
>>
>>Olmert noted that he is the first prime minister to state 
>>explicitly that he supports Israel's geographical contraction to 
>>the 1949 armistice lines. Indeed, none of his predecessors were 
>>ever so explicit. And his likely successor in office - Foreign 
>>Minister Tzipi Livni - loses her voice every time she is asked 
>>whether she believes that Israel should withdraw from Jerusalem, 
>>the Golan Heights and all of Judea and Samaria.
>>
>>Olmert's willingness to spell out the expanse of the territorial 
>>handovers he supports makes him unique among Israel's premiers. But 
>>his stated view that Israel has no choice other than to withdraw 
>>from almost all the lands it took control of during the Six Day War 
>>has been the common view of every Israeli prime minister except 
>>Likud leader Binyamin Netanyahu since 1993. Yitzhak Rabin, Shimon 
>>Peres, Ehud Barak and Ariel Sharon all signaled their support for 
>>this view. Indeed, all of their central policies while in office 
>>were predicated on it.
>>
>>THE QUESTION is, why has this been the case? Why is it that for the 
>>past 15 years, at a certain point in their tenures every prime 
>>minister aside from Netanyahu has come to the conclusion that 
>>Israel must turn over its land to those sworn to its destruction?
>>
>>Like Rabin, Peres, Barak and Sharon before him, Olmert makes no 
>>rational argument for withdrawal. He simply asserts it. And like 
>>his predecessors, Olmert uses three rhetorical tricks to support 
>>his assertion. First, he notes the uniqueness of his position as 
>>prime minister. Olmert knows Israel must surrender its land simply 
>>because he is prime minister. Sharon expressed this most clearly 
>>when he intoned, "What you see from here, you don't see from there."
>......................
>
>
>_______________________________________________
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From eliasaph at uniteourheart.com  Sun Oct  5 14:20:17 2008
From: eliasaph at uniteourheart.com (Steve Mathe)
Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 12:20:17 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] Timmerman on coming war with Iran
Message-ID: <200810051920.m95JKGKY008194@mail205c25.carrierzone.com>

Here is some interesting speculation form Newsmax:


The Coming War with Iran: 6 Days in Hell!

Newsmax Magazine's blockbuster issue has major 
cover stories, including an exclusive special 
report by Newsmax contributing editor and Iran 
expert Kenneth R. Timmerman, "Six Days to War," 
which lays out the scenario likely to unfold if the U.S. and Iran go to war.

In Timmerman's report you'll find out why "Six 
Days to War" could happen sooner than you think ? 
as many American assets are already "in position" for an attack.

Timmerman also details the deadliness and 
unintended consequences of a U.S. attack against 
an increasingly militant Iran.

That attack could come sooner than you think.

As the Bush administration ratchets up the 
pressure, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs says 
the military option is still on the table and 
warns Iran that the U.S. can launch massive strikes using Navy and Air power.

The new American commander in the region, Gen. 
David Petraeus, has also told Congress that Iran 
is supporting Iraqi insurgents killing Americans. 
President Bush said in a White House address that 
Iran, along with al-Qaida, are "two of the greatest threats to America."

Timmerman's report on the looming war with Iran 
is based on sources including top Israeli 
intelligence officers, military and political 
leaders interviewed in Israel and Washington, 
D.C., and a key planning document ? obtained 
exclusively by Newsmax ? developed by the Iranian navy.

Timmerman is the bestselling author of "Countdown 
to Crisis: The Coming Nuclear Showdown with Iran. 
His "Six Days to War" report in Newsmax Magazine 
offers a scenario that represents one likely 
course a conflict with Iran might take, and explores:
    * Iran's arsenal, including ballistic 
missiles, Silkworm anti-ship missiles ? and chemical weapons facilities.
    * The first target of a U.S. strike
    * How Iran would launch its counterattack
    * America's military plan, Operation Clean Slate
    * Hezbollah's response to the war's outbreak 
? a rain of missiles on Israel
    * America's secret war power and technology
    * The "nightmare scenario" ? what if Iran already has nuclear weapons?
    * How the U.S. would use its huge air superiority
    * Retired Lt. Gen. Thomas McInerney's "Big George" scenario to disarm Iran
    * The war's shocking effect on oil supplies ? and oil prices
    * The repercussions in Iraq
    * How American strikes could cripple the Iranian navy
    * The U.S. commando raids that target Iran's missiles
    * U.S. bunker busters' devastating effect on Iranian nuclear sites
    * The scenario's surprising end to hostilities
    * And much more.
More at: http://w3.newsmax.com/a/apr07/?s=al&promo_code=6C40-1

Steve 
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sun Oct  5 14:27:51 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 15:27:51 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Some Rosh HaShana reflections
Message-ID: <855590370810051227u759c2a86xf32d3396b2f091d5@mail.gmail.com>

Shalom,

     As Yom Kippur draws closer, I'm still trying to digest what
I experienced and learned on Rosh HaShana.  Once again, while looking at the
Machzor (the Rosh HaShana and Yom Kippur prayer book), there are certain
things which jumped off the page at me; figuratively speaking, of course.
What's fascinating is that I have read those very same things for most of my
life, but continue to "notice" things for the "first time."  It's a really
interesting phenomenom.  And maybe one day I can actually figure out why I
am noticing them at THAT time...
                   * Hanoch

*On Rosh HaShana & Yom Kippur, right before Musaf, the service that follows
the Torah & Haftarah (Prophets) reading, there is a 'Readers Meditation'
which is chanted by the Chazan (Cantor, or prayer leader).  For any of us
who are thinking about reaching out to friends, relatives or neighbors about
the whole Torah & Ephramite concept, we should consider the following, and
be strengthened by it.  None of us is "perfectly qualified," but HaShem will
know what is in our hearts.  Part of that prayer is below...

   *"Poor in worthy deeds, I am horribly frightened in thy presence who art
enthroned and receiving praise from Israel. I have come to plead before thee
on behalf of they people Israel, who have made me messenger though I am not
deserving nor qualified for the task.  Hence I beseech thee, G-d of Abraham,
G-d of Isaac and G-d of Jacob, O L-rd, merciful and gracious G-d of Israel,
almighty and revered One, make my errand successful when I seek mercy for
myself and for those who have commissioned me.  Blame them not for my sins,
convict them not for my iniquities, for I am a transgressor indeed.  Let
them not be shamed because of me and my faults..."
*        (translation is from the Birnbaum Machzor)
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From eliasaph at uniteourheart.com  Sun Oct  5 15:55:24 2008
From: eliasaph at uniteourheart.com (Steve Mathe)
Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 13:55:24 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] Fwd: Special Invitation: McCain & Obama Forum on Israel
	& Iran
Message-ID: <200810052055.m95KtMYZ014272@mail206c25.carrierzone.com>

FYI, mark your calendars. We could watch these Online:


>Subject: Special Invitation: McCain & Obama Forum on Israel & Iran
>Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 14:59:00 -0500
>
>
>You are receiving this offer as an Aish.com subscriber.
>These advertisements help Aish.com provide you with meaningful, 
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><http://www.theisraelproject.org/>
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>Israel, the threat of Iran and other key issues.
>[]
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>You can join in person, listen by phone or watch online.
><https://www.kintera.org/site/apps/ka/rg/register.asp?c=hsJPK0PIJpH&b=4543239&en=6oLKKQOjHcKIIHPjG6JKLPMjFeKKKTPwFeIRKWOqGaIQLVOsGfLLKOPoG9JHLOPuEsF>RSVP 
>to Attend In Person 
><https://www.kintera.org/site/apps/ka/rg/register.asp?c=hsJPK0PIJpH&b=4541201&en=hsIJLVOGIiKNKWPFL8LII1OPJsJVK3NLKeILJXODKjKZJcPYE>RSVP 
>to Listen by Phone or Watch Online
>
>Featured Cities:
>
>October 16th - New York City
>7pm
>Park East Synagogue
>163 East 67th Street
>New York, NY 10021
>_____________________________________________________
>October 19th - Boston, MA with the Jewish  Community Relations 
>Council of Greater Boston and Combined Jewish Philanthropies
>
>4pm (doors open at 3:30pm)
>Congregation Kehillath Israel
>384 Harvard Street
>Brookline, MA 02446
>______________________________________________________
>October 23rd - Chevy Chase, MD with Jewish Community Relations 
>Council of Greater Washington, Jewish Federation of Greater 
>Washington, Greater Washington Area Chapter of Hadassah and Ohr 
>Kodesh Congregation
>Moderated by:
>Washington Post Editorial writer and columnist- Ruth Marcus
>
>7:30pm (doors open at 7pm)
>Ohr Kodesh Congregation
>8300 Meadowbrook Lane
>Chevy Chase, MD 20815
>______________________________________________________
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>Council of the Jewish Federation of South Palm Beach County
>
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>Olympic Heights High School
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>______________________________________________________
>October 27th - Miami, FL with Jewish Community Relations Council of 
>the Greater Miami Jewish Federation
>in partnership with the American Jewish Committee, Greater Miami & 
>Broward Chapter, the American Jewish Congress; and the Anti-Defamation League
>
>7pm (doors open at 6:30pm)
>Temple Emanu-El the South Beach Synagogue
>1701 Washington Avenue
>Miami Beach, FL 33139
>Valet parking will be provided
>______________________________________________________
>October 30th - Cleveland, OH with The Cleveland Jewish News
>
>7pm (doors open at 6:30pm)
>Location TBA
>
><https://www.kintera.org/site/apps/ka/rg/register.asp?c=hsJPK0PIJpH&b=4543239&en=6oLKKQOjHcKIIHPjG6JKLPMjFeKKKTPwFeIRKWOqGaIQLVOsGfLLKOPoG9JHLOPuEsF>RSVP 
>HERE to Join Us In Person
>
><https://www.kintera.org/site/apps/ka/rg/register.asp?c=hsJPK0PIJpH&b=4541201&en=hsIJLVOGIiKNKWPFL8LII1OPJsJVK3NLKeILJXODKjKZJcPYE>Can't 
>Attend in Person? 
><https://www.kintera.org/site/apps/ka/rg/register.asp?c=hsJPK0PIJpH&b=4541201&en=hsIJLVOGIiKNKWPFL8LII1OPJsJVK3NLKeILJXODKjKZJcPYE>RSVP 
>to Listen by Phone or Watch Online
>
>Space is limited; please respond early to ensure your seat.
>
>For more information, please conact Sarah Marcus at
><mailto:sarahm at theisraelproject.org>sarahm at theisraelproject.org
>
>* Please continually check 
><http://www.theisraelproject.org/forums>www.theisraelproject.org/forums 
>for updated information on locations, times and sponsors.
>
>----------
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sun Oct  5 16:31:22 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 17:31:22 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Important Rosh HaShana teaching..
Message-ID: <855590370810051431vf4705a5x9c51276a8a4eb726@mail.gmail.com>

I'm not quite sure how/why I never really noticed this before, but the
Haftorah (Prophetic portion chanted after the Torah reading) for the
2nd day of Rosh HaShana is amazing.  I'm astounded that it is read in every
synagogue in the world, and it's real meaning is glossed over; or more
likely - misunderstood, or taken as a metaphor.  It's the first 20 verses of
Yermiyahu (Jeremiah), Chapter 31.  The following translation comes from the
Birnbaum Machzor.  Make sure to read the last 2 paragraphs very closely....

                   *  Hanoch*

*" Thus says the L-rd:  The people who survive the sword shall find grace in
the wilderness, when Israel goes to seek rest.  From afar the L-rd appeared,
saying: 'With everlasting love I love you, hence I draw you to me with
affection.  Again will I build you and you shall be restored, maiden of
Israel!  Again shall you array yourself in your timberels and join the merry
dancers.  Again shall you planty vineyards on the hills of Samaria; the
planters whall plant and enjoy the fruit.  The day will come when the
watchmen on Mount Ephraim shall call: 'Let us rise and go up to Zion, to the
L-rd our G-d.'

Thus says the L-rd: ' Sing merrily for Jacob shout aloud on the hill-tops of
the nations, ring outyour praises and say: Save they people, O L-rd, the
remnant of Israel,  I am bringing them from the north-land, and will gather
them from the uttermost parts of the world; blind and lame are among them,
women with child and women in travail - a great company shall come back
here.  They shall come weeping, and I will lead them with grace; I will
guide them to streams of water, by a smooth road where they shall not
stumble; for to Israel I am a father, and Ephraim is my first born.'

Hear the word of the L-rd, you nations and announce it in faroff islands,
saying: 'He who has scattered Israel gathers them, and tends them as a
shepherd tends his flock.'  For the L-rd has delivered Jacob, and freed him
- from a stronger power.  They shall some singing on the heights of Zion,
and shall stream to the goodness of the
 L-rd - to the corn, the wine, the oil, the sheep and the cattle; they shall
be like a watered garden, and they shall languish no more.  Then shall
maidens delight in dancing, young men and old shall rejoice alike;  I will
change their grief to gladness, I will console and cheer them after their
sorrow.  I will satisfy the priests with abundance; my people shall be with
my bounty says the L-rd.

Thus says the L-rd: a voice is heard in Ramah - lamentation, bitter weeping
; it is Rachel weeping for her children; she refuses to be comforted, for
they are away.  Thus says the L-rd: Restrain your voice from weeping, your
eyes from tears; your work shall have its reward, says the L-rd; they shall
return from the land of the enemy.  There is hope for your future says the
L-rd; the children shall return to their own land.

I have indeed heard Ephraim bemoaning himself: 'Thou hast chastised me, I
have been punished, like an untrained calf; O take me back, let me return,
for thou art the L-rd my G-d.  Surely when I did turn I repented, when I did
learn I smote myself in remorse;  I am ashamed and confused , for I bear the
disgrace of my youth.'  Is it because Ephraim is my favorite son, my beloved
child?  As often as I speak of him I rememeber him fondly;  my heart yearns
for him, I will have pity on him, says the L-rd."
*
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From eliasaph at uniteourheart.com  Sun Oct  5 17:09:14 2008
From: eliasaph at uniteourheart.com (Steve Mathe)
Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 15:09:14 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] Important Rosh HaShana teaching..
In-Reply-To: <855590370810051431vf4705a5x9c51276a8a4eb726@mail.gmail.com
 >
References: <855590370810051431vf4705a5x9c51276a8a4eb726@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200810052209.m95M9FOs027383@mail205c25.carrierzone.com>

Yes, Hanoch, it is for the same reason that other Jews have not 
noticed this before.  Now you do, because HaShem has called you to 
see, and hear.  It is time.  Sheheyanu....  that we are alive to see this....

Steve



At 02:31 PM 10/5/2008, you wrote:
>I'm not quite sure how/why I never really noticed this before, but 
>the Haftorah (Prophetic portion chanted after the Torah reading) for the
>2nd day of Rosh HaShana is amazing.  I'm astounded that it is read 
>in every synagogue in the world, and it's real meaning is glossed 
>over; or more likely - misunderstood, or taken as a metaphor.  It's 
>the first 20 verses of Yermiyahu (Jeremiah), Chapter 31.  The 
>following translation comes from the Birnbaum Machzor.  Make sure to 
>read the last 2 paragraphs very closely....
>
>                      Hanoch
>
>" Thus says the L-rd:  The people who survive the sword shall find 
>grace in the wilderness, when Israel goes to seek rest.  From afar 
>the L-rd appeared, saying: 'With everlasting love I love you, hence 
>I draw you to me with affection.  Again will I build you and you 
>shall be restored, maiden of Israel!  Again shall you array yourself 
>in your timberels and join the merry dancers.  Again shall you 
>planty vineyards on the hills of Samaria; the planters whall plant 
>and enjoy the fruit.  The day will come when the watchmen on Mount 
>Ephraim shall call: 'Let us rise and go up to Zion, to the L-rd our G-d.'
>
>Thus says the L-rd: ' Sing merrily for Jacob shout aloud on the 
>hill-tops of the nations, ring outyour praises and say: Save they 
>people, O L-rd, the remnant of Israel,  I am bringing them from the 
>north-land, and will gather them from the uttermost parts of the 
>world; blind and lame are among them, women with child and women in 
>travail - a great company shall come back here.  They shall come 
>weeping, and I will lead them with grace; I will guide them to 
>streams of water, by a smooth road where they shall not stumble; for 
>to Israel I am a father, and Ephraim is my first born.'
>
>Hear the word of the L-rd, you nations and announce it in faroff 
>islands, saying: 'He who has scattered Israel gathers them, and 
>tends them as a shepherd tends his flock.'  For the L-rd has 
>delivered Jacob, and freed him - from a stronger power.  They shall 
>some singing on the heights of Zion, and shall stream to the goodness of the
>  L-rd - to the corn, the wine, the oil, the sheep and the cattle; 
> they shall be like a watered garden, and they shall languish no 
> more.  Then shall maidens delight in dancing, young men and old 
> shall rejoice alike;  I will change their grief to gladness, I will 
> console and cheer them after their sorrow.  I will satisfy the 
> priests with abundance; my people shall be with my bounty says the L-rd.
>
>Thus says the L-rd: a voice is heard in Ramah - lamentation, bitter 
>weeping ; it is Rachel weeping for her children; she refuses to be 
>comforted, for they are away.  Thus says the L-rd: Restrain your 
>voice from weeping, your eyes from tears; your work shall have its 
>reward, says the L-rd; they shall return from the land of the 
>enemy.  There is hope for your future says the L-rd; the children 
>shall return to their own land.
>
>I have indeed heard Ephraim bemoaning himself: 'Thou hast chastised 
>me, I have been punished, like an untrained calf; O take me back, 
>let me return, for thou art the L-rd my G-d.  Surely when I did turn 
>I repented, when I did learn I smote myself in remorse;  I am 
>ashamed and confused , for I bear the disgrace of my youth.'  Is it 
>because Ephraim is my favorite son, my beloved child?  As often as I 
>speak of him I rememeber him fondly;  my heart yearns for him, I 
>will have pity on him, says the L-rd."
>_______________________________________________
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From rndavar at aol.com  Sun Oct  5 18:28:28 2008
From: rndavar at aol.com (Ross Nichols)
Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 23:28:28 +0000
Subject: [Dialogue] Yom Kippur
Message-ID: <260222424-1223249247-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1339204472-@bxe130.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>

The teaching for tonight's Sunday Shul is on Yom Kippur. Listen in live at 7PM.

I hope that you can listen to the message before Wednesday at sundown if you cannot catch it live.

Love and shalom, Ross
Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T


From jid at westnet.com.au  Sun Oct  5 21:24:39 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2008 12:24:39 +1000
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] Important Rosh HaShana teaching..]
Message-ID: <48E976E7.5090305@westnet.com.au>

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From: "Hanoch Young" <youngbarzel at gmail.com>
Subject: [Dialogue] Important Rosh HaShana teaching..
Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 17:31:22 -0400
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From eliasaph at uniteourheart.com  Sun Oct  5 23:15:46 2008
From: eliasaph at uniteourheart.com (Steve Mathe)
Date: Sun, 05 Oct 2008 21:15:46 -0700
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] Important Rosh HaShana teaching..]
In-Reply-To: <48E976E7.5090305@westnet.com.au>
References: <48E976E7.5090305@westnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <200810060416.m964FpRb023257@mail2506.carrierzone.com>

JOE,

How true, the Neviim have been all but totally forgotten, and not 
studied at all.  Rabbi Bar Tzaddok's 2004 dream calls for the 
studying of the Neviim by all Jews, from Yeshivot to all 
Congregations, and individuals. His dream was a Divine call to that 
in our times: http://koshertorah.com/PDF/great-lesson.pdf.

Though Judah has forgotten the Neviim, there may be a Divine hand in 
that. Had he not forgotten it, they would have remembered Ephraim all 
along and his name would not have been blotted out from the memory of 
men, and he would no have become "lost."  Now that time is over, as 
Ephraim is beginning to wake up, some few, e.g. Hanoch and rabbi 
Greenbaum, are alerted to Ephraim's existence.  The  Neviim are also 
needed for they call all Israel to repentance "in the latter days," 
as we read in last weeks parsha, in Deut. 31:29.  Baruch HaShem that 
we are seeing the beginning of great changes to come, (and we are not 
speaking of Obama!).

It is time to remember.....

Steve


At 07:24 PM 10/5/2008, you wrote:
>Shalom Hanoch,
>
>I have scanned a commentary from the Midrash by Rabbi Moshe Feinstein.
>The Rabbis have been aware of the "PRODIGAL SON " coming home.
>
>Throughout the past 2000 years there has always been an emphasis in 
>Judaism for the Torah , Mishnah and the Talmud . The casualty has 
>been the Neviim. Even our local Rabbis agree with this statement. 
>The breath of HaShem has always spoken through the Prophets.
>
>I guess you really heard the shofar on Rosh HaShana. Baruch HaShem !!!!!
>
>We live in momentous days indeed.
>
>Shalom v'Ahavah
>JOE.
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Mon Oct  6 06:59:39 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2008 04:59:39 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] Great timing to see this now...
Message-ID: <855590370810060459p20a6e9b5q7aae75342bf8ac@mail.gmail.com>

     The Lekarev Report
   *7 Tishrei 5769
* *October 6, 2008
*  Shalom

This is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those
days, says Hashem; I will put My Torah in their inward parts, and I will
write it on their hearts; and I will be their G-d, and they shall be My
people.

Jeremiah 31:33
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From ROSS.NICHOLS at GAPAC.com  Mon Oct  6 08:22:39 2008
From: ROSS.NICHOLS at GAPAC.com (Nichols, Ross K.)
Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2008 08:22:39 -0500
Subject: [Dialogue] FW: Preparing our Hearts with a Day of Self Denial
Message-ID: <CAFFEC80641E3E4183BF90B0E461D6AC04BB37FF@msgcpla090.srv.gapac.com>

All,

 

Glenn just sent this out and I think that it is a very good note that
should be forwarded on as we approach Yom Kippur.  I taught last night
on this subject.  The key point that I tried to convey last night was
that we should "deny ourselves".  I will write a blog entry on this at
some point before Wednesday.

 

In the two texts mentioned by Glenn below from Leviticus, the charge to
deny ourselves shows up 5 times.

 

Thanks for sending this out Glenn!

 

Shalom, Ross

 

-----Original Message-----
From: CHATTERTON, WALTER G [mailto:WCHATTE at entergy.com] 
Sent: Monday, October 06, 2008 7:45 AM
To: undisclosed-recipients
Subject: Preparing our Hearts with a Day of Self Denial
Importance: High

 

All, 

I invite you to join me and millions around the world in preparing our
hearts for this festival season by observing the only Biblically
ordained fast (Lev. 16:29-31, Lev. 23:26-32) beginning at sundown
Wednesday to sundown Thursday. It is a time to examine ourselves,
repent, forsake our own desires, and turn our focus to The LORD and
others. May I suggest a thoughtful reading of Daniel 9 as a guide for
how to effectively intercede in this crucial time of drawing near to The
LORD.

May The LORD grant us His mercy, grace and compassion as we humble
ourselves and seek His face! 

Therefore also now, saith the LORD, turn ye even to me with all your
heart, and with fasting, and with weeping, and with mourning: And rend
your heart, and not your garments, and turn unto the LORD your God: for
he is gracious and merciful, slow to anger, and of great kindness, and
repenteth him of the evil.  Joel 2:12-13

Thanks, 

Glenn 

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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Mon Oct  6 11:41:50 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2008 12:41:50 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Educational Resources for Sukkot
Message-ID: <855590370810060941l3595298cg8bc3c15cd86665c0@mail.gmail.com>

Date:    Sun, 5 Oct 2008 21:18:29 +0200
From:    Jacob Richman <jrichman at JR.CO.IL>
Subject: Educational resources for Sukkot
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT

Hi Everyone!

Sukkot is the Jewish holiday that commemorates how protective
"Clouds of Glory" surrounded the Jewish people after leaving
Egypt during the forty years of wandering in the desert.
It also commemorates how the Jews lived in temporary dwellings
during that same time.
Sukkot begins Monday night, October 13, 2008.

The J Site - Jewish Education and Entertainment

http://www.j.co.il

has several entertaining features to celebrate Sukkot:

Jewish Trivia Quiz: Sukkot

What is the Hebrew date of the first day of Sukkot ?
What is another name for the Sukkot holiday ?
What does Sukkot commemorate ?
What is the minimum area of a Sukkah as defined in the Talmud ?
What is the maximum height of a Sukkah ?
What does the Aramaic word "Ushpizin" mean ?
Who gets called to the Torah reading on Simchat Torah ?

The above questions are examples from the multiple choice
Flash quiz. There are two levels of questions, two timer settings.
Both kids and adults will find it enjoyable.

Additional Sukkot resources and games on the J site include:
Free Sukkot Clipart
The Hebrew Hangman Game
The Multilingual Word Search Game (English / Hebrew / Russian)
My Hebrew Songbook (Hebrew Song Lyrics)
My Jewish Coloring Book (online / offline)

The J site has something for everyone, but if that is not
enough, I posted on my website 62 links about Sukkot,
from laws and customs to games and recipes.
Site languages include English, Hebrew, Russian, Spanish,
French, Portuguese, German and Italian.

All 62 links have been reviewed / checked this week.
The web address is:

http://www.jr.co.il/hotsites/j-hdaysu.htm

I also created a list of 16 cool Sukkot YouTube videos.
The address is:
http://www.jr.co.il/videos/sukkot-videos.htm

Please forward this message to relatives and friends,
so they may benefit from these holiday resources.
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Mon Oct  6 11:54:31 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2008 12:54:31 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Head of NATO: 'World can't stop Iran nukes'
Message-ID: <855590370810060954o36ee7db0g44fb4a8192bdfe64@mail.gmail.com>

So, when European countries have the chance to stop the Iranian Hitler, just
60+ years after the Shoah (Holocaust), they say there's nothing they can
do....hmm....but then again, Jewish blood has always been valued as pretty
cheap in Europe...

                           * Hanoch*

   NATO head: World can't stop Iran nukes     [image:
mail]<http://www.jta.org/cgi-bin/iowa/popups/email.html?article=110675>
E-mail
article <http://www.jta.org/cgi-bin/iowa/popups/email.html?article=110675>
<http://www.facebook.com/share.php?u=http://jta.org/cgi-bin/iowa/breaking/110675.html>
 Share
on Facebook<http://www.facebook.com/share.php?u=http://jta.org/cgi-bin/iowa/breaking/110675.html>
<http://digg.com/submit?phase=2&url=http://jta.org/cgi-bin/iowa/breaking/110675.html>
Digg
this<http://digg.com/submit?phase=2&url=http://jta.org/cgi-bin/iowa/breaking/110675.html>
[image:
mail] <feedback at jta.org> Tell the Editors <feedback at jta.org>
<http://technorati.com/search/http://jta.org/cgi-bin/iowa/breaking/110675.html>
What
bloggers
are saying<http://technorati.com/search/http://jta.org/cgi-bin/iowa/breaking/110675.html>

Published: 10/06/2008

The secretary-general of NATO said he does not think the world will be able
to stop Iran from building a nuclear bomb.

Jaap de Hoop Scheffer told a World Policy Conference in southeast France
organized by a French think tank that the United Nations has failed to halt
Iran's nuclear program, Reuters reported Monday.

Because of this, Scheffer said, he would never expect Israel to halt its
suspected nuclear program.

"As we all know, Israel never admits to what it has, but I do not see very
many arguments for the Jewish state to abandon its potential," Reuters
quoted him as saying.

Iran claims its nuclear program is strictly for creating domestic electric
power.

 *More Breaking News from JTA*
    [image: mail]*JTA Daily Briefing:* Our free newsletter delivers breaking
news & timely, topical information right to your inbox: Enter Name:
E-Mail Address:
     <http://ads.davidkelseymedia.com/www/delivery/ck.php?oaparams=2__bannerid=40__zoneid=4__cb=a9aceb150b__maxdest=http://affiliate.hebrewonline.com/aw.aspx?A=108&Task=Click>
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From patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com  Mon Oct  6 08:13:57 2008
From: patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com (Pat Robbins)
Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2008 09:13:57 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] NEW NETWORK FOR THE TRUTH FROM ISRAEL: Israel World News!
Message-ID: <BLU125-DS6DD97387ACBBBD90755E4BA390@phx.gbl>

There is a new News Network trying to get off the ground in Israel in order to broadcast the TRUTH OF HASHEM'S LAND to the world!!!!  This is the first sample of what it will be.  From what I've seen in the video below (which takes about 10 minutes to download), such a network could have a HUGE impact upon the world!  It could wake up Planet Earth to G-d's Land, His people (ALL HIS PEOPLE!!!!), and His Plan!!!!!  Am asking all to pray that it will succeed in getting on the air waves. 

PRESENTING THE TRUTH TO THE WORLD, HERE'S ISRAEL WORLD NEWS.....................................................


Pat






        Here's what we're working on  here in Israel  right now.  We are hoping to be on air within the next six months.  I hope everyone enjoys it!

        Cody


        ? 



          IsraelWORLD
                  T e l e v I s i o n

              Shana Tova Cody ,

              thanks so much for your help, I hope I can see you before you leave, 

               1. Here is the link to the Demo Broadcast of IsraelWorldNews channel :
                Press  http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?qg2qfwzozz1  and download the video .
              ( it take about 10 minutes - 95 MG)

              2. A link to Former Minister Nathan Sharanski supporting IsraelWorldNews channel :
                                  press  sharekey and download the video.
                
              IWTV will broadcast news, analysis, documentaries, history programs, Israel?s hi-tech and military industries, agriculture, technological and scientific innovation, the Arab world, business, culture, studio panel discussions ,world and Israeli politics, the war on terror, and international relations .
              IWTV will be a unique, powerful voice in the global media community, with a worldwide reach that cannot be ignored.
              Attached is the KPMG investment overview. Please feel free to contact me personally with any questions
              Best Regards

              Tsafrir Ronen
              Israel World Television

              IsraelWorldTv at gmail.com
              Israel cell : 972 -52 -2358440

     




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


_______________________________________________

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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Tue Oct  7 10:17:09 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Tue, 7 Oct 2008 11:17:09 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Our World: The convenient war against the Jews
Message-ID: <855590370810070817q5646058g6786e3af0b44d0e5@mail.gmail.com>

No need to comment on this one....the truth of it is self-evident.
                *  Hanoch*
**

*Our World: The convenient war against the Jews
*October 7, 2008
Caroline Glick, THE JERUSALEM POST

In the end, the global jihad, and the West's fickle response to radical
Islam's assault on its civilization, is about hating Jews. This truth, never
wholly hidden from view, was exposed in all its ugliness in recent months
with startling disclosures by former Italian president and Senator-for-life
Francesco Cossiga.

In a letter to Italy's Corriere della Serra in August, Cossiga acknowledged
that during the early 1970s, then Italian prime minister Aldo Moro signed an
agreement with Yassir Arafat's PLO and affiliated organizations that enabled
the Palestinians to field terrorists, operate bases and store weapons in
Italy in exchange for immunity from attack for Italy and Italian interests
worldwide. Cossiga also acknowledged that even when the Palestinians
murdered Italians, the government still protected them. Indeed, he admitted
for the first time that the largest terror attack ever to take place on
Italian soil - the bombing of the Bologna train station in July 1980 which
killed 85 people - was the work of PLO-affiliated terrorists from George
Habash's Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine.

At the time of the bombing, Cossiga was Italy's prime minister. Right after
it occurred, he blamed the atrocity on neo-fascists. In his words at the
time, "Unlike leftist terrorism, which strikes at the heart of the state
through its representatives, black terrorism prefers the massacre because it
promotes panic and impulsive reactions."

In August, he claimed that it was the work of the PFLP and asserted that the
bomb exploded inadvertently. That is, the Palestinians hadn't meant to kill
non-Jews - so Italian authorities protected them.

On Friday, Cossiga expanded on his disclosures to Corriere della Serra in an
interview with Yediot Aharonot's Rome correspondent Menachem Ganz. Cossiga
admitted that it wasn't just Israeli targets that Italy permitted the
Palestinians to attack with impunity, but Jewish targets as well. Indeed, in
at least one and probably two incidents, the Italians colluded with the
Palestinians in their attacks against Jews. On October 9, 1982, six
terrorists opened fire on worshippers leaving Rome's Great Synagogue. Dozens
of Jews were wounded and two-year-old Stefano Tache was murdered. Hours
before the attack the Italian police detail charged with securing the
synagogue was withdrawn.

Then too, in December 1985, Palestinian terrorists opened fire on the El Al
ticket counter at the Rome airport. Ten people were killed. Another seven
people were murdered in a simultaneous attack against the El Al ticket
counter at the Vienna airport. According to Cossiga, Italian intelligence
agencies received prior warning of the attack but didn't bother to share the
information with Israel.

Cossiga explained to Yediot, "No Italian targets were hit. They attacked the
Israeli airline at the airport. The murdered were all Israelis, Jews, and
Americans."

Then there was the hijacking of the Italian cruise liner Achille Lauro off
the Egyptian coast in October 1985. Palestinian terrorists led by Abu Abbas
commandeered the ship. They shot wheelchair-bound American Jewish passenger
Leon Klinghoffer and threw him overboard while he was still alive. The
Egyptians freed the hijackers and sent them off on a flight to Libya.
American jets forced a plane to land at a NATO base in Sicily. The Italians
refused to permit the Americans to take the hijackers into custody and freed
Abbas. The Italians cast the standoff as a victory against American bullies.
But it really amounted to a surrender to Palestinian murderers. As Cossiga
explained, "Since the Arabs were capable of harming Italy more than the
Americans, Italy surrendered to them."

COSSIGA ALLEGES that his country's agreement with the Palestinians has
recently been expanded to include Hizbullah. After the Second Lebanon War,
Italy agreed to command the UNIFIL force charged with preventing Hizbullah
from reasserting control over southern Lebanon and blocking its re-armament
efforts. Yet Cossiga asserts, "I can state with absolute certainty that?
Italy has a deal with Hizbullah according to which UNIFIL forces turn a
blind eye to Hizbullah's rearmament so long as no attacks are carried out
against soldiers in the force."

Ganz notes ruefully that although Cossiga's statements provoked the Italian
Jewish community to demand that Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi investigate
the government's collusion with Palestinian terrorists, no such
investigation is likely to be forthcoming. Ganz explains that Berlusconi
himself is not immune to the anti-Semitism that caused his predecessors to
abstain from protecting Italy's Jewish citizens. When he addresses Italian
Jews, Berlusconi often calls the Israeli government "your government," and
so exposes his adherence to the view that Jews are not true citizens of any
country other than Israel.

The anti-Semitic belief that all Jews are Zionists and therefore all Jews
are fair game in the war against Israel - itself simply another round of the
age-old war against the Jews - allows anti-Semites to obfuscate the fact
that their anti-Israel rhetoric is simply warmed over Jew-hatred. People
like Iranian leaders Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Ali Khamenei, and Palestinian
terrorists from the PLO and their progeny in Hamas and Hizbullah nearly
always limit their threats to "Zionists," and so pretend that they aren't
actually anti-Semites.

Their razor-thin deception is eagerly embraced by their fellow travelers in
the West - from university professors like Juan Cole, Steven Walt and John
Mearshimer, to policymakers like Brent Scowcroft and Zbigniew Brzezinski, to
Western decision-makers and European heads of state, and an alarming number
of American politicians.

This deception is par for the course of anti-Semitism. Throughout history
anti-Semites have used Jew-hatred as a way to rally their troops. By
attacking Jews as the collective enemy, tyrants have given their people a
convenient, weak culprit to attack to deflect criticism away from their own
failures or to hide real enemies from pacifistic publics uninterested in
fighting. Anti-Semitism appeals to people's basest instinct. But people
don't like to acknowledge how much they hate Jews, and Jews have always
preferred to deny that they are hated.

So anti-Semitic leaders have disguised their appeal to base instinct by
pretending that they are actually appealing to sublime aspirations. In the
case of the Nazis for instance, Adolf Hitler and Josef Goebbels appealed to
Germanic pride and love for the Fatherland. Today, the Left appeals to
people's aspirations for peace and justice. It is only by permitting and
indeed enabling Jews to die and the Jewish state to be destroyed that
"peace" can be secured and the Palestinians can receive "justice."

THIS STRATEGY appeals to European - and to greater and lesser degrees
American - policymakers for two reasons. First, as French Foreign Minister
Bernard Kouchner made clear in an interview with Ha'aretz on Friday, while
the West understands that Islamic jihadists seek the destruction of Europe
and the US, they believe - in part because their own anti-Semitism leads
them to exaggerate Jewish power - that they will get away with coddling the
Arabs and Iran because Israel will protect them.

Referring to Iran's nuclear weapons program, Kouchner said that no one is
particularly worried about Iran's nuclear threat because everyone believes
that Israel will attack Iran for them. In his words, "I honestly don't
believe that [a nuclear arsenal] will give any immunity to Iran. First, you
[Israel] will hit them before [they acquire nuclear weapons]? Because Israel
has always said that it will not wait for the bomb to be ready. I think that
they [the Iranians] know. Everybody knows."

What is ironic about this view is that it exposes the inversion of
anti-Semitic rhetoric. Five years ago, former Malaysian prime minister
Mahathir Mohamed told an approving audience of Islamic heads of state, "The
Jews rule the world by proxy. They get others to fight and die for them."

But the West's belief that Israel will protect it from Iran shows that the
opposite is true. The West is absolutely certain that Israel is its proxy,
and that Jews will fight and die protecting it from the forces of global
terror and jihad.

THE SECOND reason the Western champions of "peace" have opted to sell Israel
and the Jews out to the jihadists is because as anti-Semites, Western
"anti-Zionists" fear Jewish power and therefore want us to be weak. So it is
that for the past 40 years, European governments and the US State Department
have bankrolled anti-Zionist groups in Israel like Peace Now, B'tselem and
Four Mothers. So it is that they have blamed Israel for Palestinian
terrorism. And even when Israel succumbs to all their demands for
territorial withdrawals, they always manage to demand still more.

In the same interview with Ha'aretz for instance, Kouchner on the one hand
praised Prime Minister Ehud Olmert and Foreign Minister Tzipi Livni for
their willingness to surrender Jerusalem, Judea and Samaria to the
Palestinians, but argued that this is still not enough. Israel must also
accept the free immigration of the hostile descendants of the Arabs who left
Israel in 1948. That is, Israel must also agree to its own destruction in
order to pave the way for "peace." In his words, "The main problem is the
refugees and Jerusalem, but more the refugees. Olmert and Livni do not have
the perception of this."

Kouchner for one is certain that Livni will come around to recognizing the
need to allow hostile foreign-born Arabs to move here. "I think she will
change. This is always the case for people that are in charge for politics
and for life," he claimed.

Kouchner soothed the reporters' fears of national destruction by claiming
that he's probably not talking about more than 100,000 hostile Arabs
immigrants. But that's today.

If Livni does form a government and comes around to this view, leave it to
the West to explain that placing "arbitrary" limits on Arab immigration is a
human rights abuse, and that Israel's Zionist racism is compelling the Arabs
and Iran to kill Jews and Westerners around the world.

AND THIS brings us to perhaps the greatest irony of the West's collusion
with the Arabs and Iran in their war against the Jews. The logical outcome
of the twin delusions of anti-Semitism - that Jews are all powerful and that
the Jews must be cut down to size - is the destruction of Israel. And if
that happens, the West will find itself in jaws of the Islamic jihadists
they have been feeding the Jews to for four decades.

The West's subversion of the Israeli elite has fomented a situation where
many Israeli leaders have embraced their anti-Semitic views of Israel.
Leaders like Livni and Olmert, and the media and academia in Israel, have
largely accepted the notion that Israel is to blame for the global jihad.
Today these leaders uphold Jewish weakness as an ideal. The longer these
Western-supported elites remain in power, the larger the chance that Israel
won't attack Iran and that Israel will allow itself to be destroyed in the
interest of pursuing "peace" with Palestinian terrorists.

And if Israel is destroyed, the West won't be able to depend on us Jews to
fight and die for them anymore. They will be all alone.


=============================================
Women For Israel's Tomorrow  (Women in Green)
POB 7352, Jerusalem 91072, Israel
Tel: 972-2-624-9887 Fax: 972-2-624-5380
mailto:wfit2 at womeningreen.org
<wfit2 at womeningreen.org>http://www.womeningreen.org
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Wed Oct  8 00:55:36 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Wed, 08 Oct 2008 15:55:36 +1000
Subject: [Dialogue] TZOM KAL
Message-ID: <48EC4B58.4020006@westnet.com.au>

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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Wed Oct  8 08:57:03 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 09:57:03 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] The Message of Tshuva from Hevron
Message-ID: <855590370810080657x6d8ef37bk33486966b072c713@mail.gmail.com>

    *Tshuva*

David Wilder
October 08, 2008

For the past month and a half, lives of observant Jews have revolved around
one particular expression ? that being tshuva, meaning, in broad terms,
repentance. For an entire month prior to the New Year, Rosh HaShana, special
prayers are recited, Torah classes are held, and personal acts of
introspection permeate our existence. This, of course, culminates on the
holiest day of the year, that being tomorrow, Yom Kippur. On this day we
beseech G-d to forgive our wrongdoings, be they between man and the Good
L-rd, or between man and his fellowman.



It's much easier to face G-d and ask for forgiveness from Him. In our silent
prayers, be they formal or informal, we can confess to our human errors and
plead for Divine clemency. G-d doesn't wait for once in four years to sign
executive orders granting pardons. It's something that can be done every
day, every minute or every second of every day. And especially on Yom Kippur
when we forgo just about all elements of our physical lives, abstaining from
food and other earthly pleasures, to immerse ourselves in total
spirituality, as much as we humanly can.



It's much more difficult to ask forgiveness from our fellow man. Admitting
mistakes to a friend, co-worker, boss or employee, or to a close family
member isn't always easy. Sometimes, actually, it's very hard. But that's
what this day's all about. G-d cannot grant forgiveness for issues between
two people until they settle the problem themselves.



However this is just one aspect of tshuva and forgiveness. There's at least
one other side (probably more).



The ideal of forgiving is not only a personal commitment. It is also a
national obligation. Keep in mind that the word 'tshuva' literally means
'return.' In a religious sense, 'returning' from the wrong paths we've
taken, and this time around, turning down the right road of holiness and
purity.


Exactly fourteen years ago, following election of Yitzhak Rabin, Israel
began formally negotiating with Yassir Arafat and the PLO. Those talks led
to Oslo. That curse, still with us today, has led to the murders of almost
2,000 people, in cold blood.



Oslo led to the Hebron Accords, which divided the city, abandoning over 80%
of Hebron to the Palestinian authority. Exactly eight years ago, these
accords led to shooting attacks on Hebron from the hills Israel 'gave' to
our enemy. The shooting continued for two years. Dozens of people in the
Hebron region and over a thousand Jews throughout Israel were killed during
this war.



Oslo and Hebron led to Gush Katif. Almost 10,000 people expelled from their
homes, and countless rockets fired into Israel from the land Israel
abandoned to our enemies.



A short time after the 'other side' of Hebron was vacated by Israeli
security forces in favor of armed terrorists in uniform by then Defense
Minister Fuad ben Eliezer in the fall of 2002, then Hebron Brigade
commander, Col. Dror Weinberg held a meeting with a group of local civilian
security leaders. During that meeting, on a Friday morning in November, Col.
Weinberg warned that terrorists were planning a major attack, but that
little more information was available. That night, Col. Dror Weinberg and
eleven other men were killed during the attack he had discussed earlier that
same day.



Yesterday, speaking to a group of mostly Swedish youth at the 1929 memorial
room in Beit Hadassah, I told them that history has to be learned from. In
August, 1929 the Jewish leadership in Hebron believed that their Arab
neighbors would shield them from any attacks, protecting them from harm's
way. That leadership was wrong. That mistake cost 67 lives and the expulsion
of Hebron's surviving Jewish population from the city.



When the Hebron accords were signed, Israeli military officers said straight
out that 'our security is dependent on cooperation from the PA.' We know
exactly where that cooperation led; to Jewish cemeteries, widows and
orphans. And national disgrace.



A week ago outgoing Prime Minister Ehud Olmert, once mayor of Jerusalem, in
a broad newspaper interview, expressed his opinion that Israel must 'give
back' just about all of Judea and Samaria, including East Jerusalem, and the
Golan Heights, in exchange for peace.



As we approach Yom Kippur, we have received solid information that Defense
Minister Ehud Barak and Central Command General Gadi Shamni want to do it
again. Give it another chance. 'Return' the 'other side' of Hebron to PA
terrorists in uniform. They believe that Fatah forces are preferable to
Hamas. (Achikam Amichai and David Rubin from Kiryat Arba were killed just
over a half a year ago by Fatah 'palestinian police.)



According to the information we have, some of which was published yesterday
on ynet and more today in the Jerusalem Post, a meeting is to take place on
October 15,  a week from today, between very high ranking Israeli security
officers, including the head of the Civil Administration and also possibly
General Noam Tivon (former Hebron military commander, serving in Hebron at
the beginning of the 'Olso War' aka the Second Intifada), presently
commander of forces in Judea and Samaria. During this meeting it is quite
likely that details of transfer of security responsibility from Israel to
the PA in over 80% of Hebron will be discussed and finalized.



This is, I guess, in their opinion, Tshuva ? returning. Not returning to
G-d's ways, not returning to Eretz Yisrael and Israeli national pride.
Rather, returning to the same mistakes made time and time again, leading to
Israel blood being shed, to cemeteries and mourning.



I also believe in the necessity to 'do Tshuva.' And this is what I try to
express to groups I meet here in Hebron, especially when they are youth. I
tell them that must do Tshuva ? no, not necessarily 'religious' tshuva,
keeping Shabbat and Kashrut. Rather I encourage them to fulfill another kind
of tshuva ? of coming home, of making Aliyah, of returning to their
Homeland, coming to live here in Eretz Yisrael, in the State of Israel.



I firmly believe that there is no more significant act that a Jew can do
today than such tshuva, returning home to our Land. This is real Tshuva ?
not the kind espoused by Barak and Olmert, Shamni and Tivon. Keep in mind
that had Gush Katif been filled with 50,000 people,  that process of
expulsion could never have begun. So too in all of Judea and Samaria. The
secret to our remaining in these regions is dependent on Tshuva, on Jews
coming back, from all over the world, coming home to our ancient homeland.
When there are a half a million Jews in Yesha, there won't be anything to
talk about. This should be our number one goal: Tshuva ? not only for a
month and half of the year, but every day of the entire year. This is what
Am Yisrael needs today, more than anything else.



On behalf of the entire Hebron extended family, please accept our wishes for
a Shana Tova, a good and happy New Year, for a 'Gmar Chatima Tova, for an
easy fast, and for a quick and successful fulfillment of the mitzvah of
Tshuva, coming home to Eretz Yisrael.








   ***comments * <http://www.hebron.com/english/article.php?id=439#comments>





*The Jewish Community of Hebron**
*POB 105 , *Kiryat Arba-Hebron 90100
**hebron at hebron.org.il*<hebron at hebron.org.il>
*   *
*Tour Hebron:** Tel 972-52-431-7055 or write:
tour at hebron.com <simcha at hebron.org.il>*

*The Hebron Fund**
*1760 Ocean Ave., Brooklyn, NY 11230
*www.hebronfund.com  hebronfund at aol.com   <hebronfund at aol.com>*
718-677-6886


*Web:* www.hebron.com *Ma'arat HaMachpela:* www.machpela.com
*Gift shop*:*www.hebrongifts.com*

*You too can Help Hebron **-  http://www.hebrontruma.com*

*To subscribe or unsubscribe to the Hebron list, simply email:**
*hebron.mail-subscribe at hebron.org.il <hebron_today-subscribe at hebron.org.il>
hebron.mail-unsubscribe at hebron.org.il<hebron_today-unsubscribe at hebron.org.il>
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Wed Oct  8 09:23:40 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 10:23:40 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] A Prayer and a Blessing for Yom Kippur
Message-ID: <855590370810080723v59760a50q6392bd8653105b05@mail.gmail.com>

 Shalom L'Kulchem,

          As we come closer to Yom Kippur I wanted to make a suggestion to
everyone reached by this email.  Please go to the site:
www.uniteourheart.com  and print out (under Prayer-Projects) the
Confessional Prayer for Ephraim and make sure to say it during Yom Kippur.

        Although the Yom Kippur liturgy is filled with exceptional tefilot,
please add this one; especially THIS Yom Kippur.  I personally will be
saying it 12 times over the course of Yom Kippur - keeping in mind all 12 of
our Tribes.

       May you and your families be blessed with a year filled with Brachot;
May HaShem have mercy on HIS Land and *ALL *of HIS people; May this be the
year we reclaim the Har HaBayit and rebuild the Bet HaMikdash; and may this
year be the one where we experience the Geula Shlema - the complete
redemption.

     With wishes for you to have a  meaningful and contemplative fast, G'mar
Chatima Tova.

     B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,
               * Hanoch*
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From patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com  Wed Oct  8 11:41:52 2008
From: patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com (Pat Robbins)
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 12:41:52 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] A Prayer and a Blessing for Yom Kippur
In-Reply-To: <855590370810080723v59760a50q6392bd8653105b05@mail.gmail.com>
References: <855590370810080723v59760a50q6392bd8653105b05@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BLU125-DS35DBA49AA70D27D52F904BA3B0@phx.gbl>

Will certainly follow your suggestion, Hanoch.  What better time to contemplate our special Confessional Prayer than on this most solemn day.  Thank you so much for  this email, and wishing you and all on this list a meaningful and contemplative fast as well.

Love,

Pat


From: Hanoch Young 
Sent: Wednesday, October 08, 2008 10:23 AM
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
Subject: [Dialogue] A Prayer and a Blessing for Yom Kippur


 Shalom L'Kulchem,

          As we come closer to Yom Kippur I wanted to make a suggestion to everyone reached by this email.  Please go to the site: www.uniteourheart.com  and print out (under Prayer-Projects) the Confessional Prayer for Ephraim and make sure to say it during Yom Kippur.  

        Although the Yom Kippur liturgy is filled with exceptional tefilot, please add this one; especially THIS Yom Kippur.  I personally will be saying it 12 times over the course of Yom Kippur - keeping in mind all 12 of our Tribes.  

       May you and your families be blessed with a year filled with Brachot; May HaShem have mercy on HIS Land and ALL of HIS people; May this be the year we reclaim the Har HaBayit and rebuild the Bet HaMikdash; and may this year be the one where we experience the Geula Shlema - the complete redemption.

     With wishes for you to have a  meaningful and contemplative fast, G'mar Chatima Tova.

     B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,
                Hanoch


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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From eliasaph at uniteourheart.com  Wed Oct  8 11:49:41 2008
From: eliasaph at uniteourheart.com (Steve Mathe)
Date: Wed, 08 Oct 2008 09:49:41 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] Yom Kippur / Day of Coverings in the latter days
Message-ID: <200810081649.m98GnbHM007779@mail207c25.carrierzone.com>

Dear Friends on the Dialogue list,

As the most solemn holy day of Yom Kippur is fast approaching, am 
asking all of you to do the task that is set before us as 
representatives of the awakening Ten Tribes of Israel from the Valley 
of Dry Bones.  That task is to ask for forgiveness for our peoples, 
for the manifold ways we have transgressed the injunctions in the 
Torah to respect God by keeping His commandments to deal honestly 
with our fellow men.

In the midst of this most crucial election process not many are 
calling for a national repentance of the sin of greed.  Hosea tells 
us that our peoples "have not cried unto me with their heart, when 
they howled upon their beds, they assemble themselves for corn and 
wine, and they rebel against me."  (Hos. 7:14).  Surely, we are bound 
to many idols, and G-d rightly reproves us : "their drink is sour, 
they have committed whoredom continually, her rulers (shields) with 
shame do love, 'give me'." (Hos. 4:18).

A question asked of the candidates asked was: "What don't you know 
and how will you learn it?"  This was most appropiate and timely 
message to the whole nation, for Hosea tells us: "The iniquity of 
Ephraim is bound up, his sin is hid,"  (Hos. 13:12), and "My people 
are destroyed for lack of (the) knowledge, (Hos. 4:6).
While we look for leaders to pull us out of the quagmire we have sunk 
into, God tells us: "O Israel, thou hast destroyed thyself, but in me 
is thine help." (Hos.13:9).

May I recommend the prayerful reading of the whole book of Hosea on 
this day?  It is written for us to be reminded in "the latter days" 
of the prophecies of our backsliding into immoral morass that we 
cannot extricate ourselves from.  As the United States government is 
trying to save itself from economic collapse by buying, i.e. 
"covering  up" the toxic papers of false promises of our leaders' and 
our confidence games, we can be reminded of how we have our God who 
promises to cover our sins on this day of Yom Kippurim, the Day of Coverings.

To aid in the forming of words with which which we are to come before 
God on this day, please download the updated "The Confession Prayer 
for Ephraim" at: 
http://www.uniteourheart.com/Prayer-Projects/Prayer/Confession%20Prayers%20VII.pdf. 


To be primed for this prayer, please print out and read the article: 
"Take 
Words," 
http://www.uniteourheart.com/Prayer-Projects/Take-Words.html.  It 
comments on the fact that when Israel is to return to Her God, she is 
to use the Divinely prescribed protocols to do so. Those protocols 
are the very words written to us in the Torah, the Writings and the 
Prophets.  The sacrifices were protocols on how to approach God.  The 
words He has given us, are the "calves of our lips" as the 
appropriate ways with which we are "to come near" in the "Work of Eli 
Y-h" in the "latter days." The Confession Prayer for Ephraim is 
composed with that injunction in mind and uses the very words from 
the Scriptures which pertains to Ephraim.  Yes, it uses the King 
James language, for its words are etched into the conscious and 
subconscious of our English speaking peoples.

May the G-d of Israel hear us and all those asking for mercy for 
ourselves and interceding for our peoples.

Steve Mathe

http://www.uniteourheart.com

"Only Torah, prayer and repentance unifies the Tribes of Israel."

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From patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com  Wed Oct  8 16:03:51 2008
From: patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com (Pat Robbins)
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 17:03:51 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Yom Kippur / Day of Coverings in the latter days
In-Reply-To: <200810081649.m98GnbHM007779@mail207c25.carrierzone.com>
References: <200810081649.m98GnbHM007779@mail207c25.carrierzone.com>
Message-ID: <BLU125-DS2E6A473C99695DDAB7F6EBA3B0@phx.gbl>

Have printed it, and will study "Take Words" before beginning the Confession Prayer.  Thank you so much, Steve.

Pat


From: Steve Mathe 
Sent: Wednesday, October 08, 2008 12:49 PM
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
Subject: [Dialogue] Yom Kippur / Day of Coverings in the latter days


Dear Friends on the Dialogue list,

As the most solemn holy day of Yom Kippur is fast approaching, am asking all of you to do the task that is set before us as representatives of the awakening Ten Tribes of Israel from the Valley of Dry Bones.  That task is to ask for forgiveness for our peoples, for the manifold ways we have transgressed the injunctions in the Torah to respect God by keeping His commandments to deal honestly with our fellow men.  

In the midst of this most crucial election process not many are calling for a national repentance of the sin of greed.  Hosea tells us that our peoples "have not cried unto me with their heart, when they howled upon their beds, they assemble themselves for corn and wine, and they rebel against me."  (Hos. 7:14).  Surely, we are bound to many idols, and G-d rightly reproves us : "their drink is sour, they have committed whoredom continually, her rulers (shields) with shame do love, 'give me'." (Hos. 4:18).

A question asked of the candidates asked was: "What don't you know and how will you learn it?"  This was most appropiate and timely message to the whole nation, for Hosea tells us: "The iniquity of Ephraim is bound up, his sin is hid,"  (Hos. 13:12), and "My people are destroyed for lack of (the) knowledge, (Hos. 4:6).
While we look for leaders to pull us out of the quagmire we have sunk into, God tells us: "O Israel, thou hast destroyed thyself, but in me is thine help." (Hos.13:9).

May I recommend the prayerful reading of the whole book of Hosea on this day?  It is written for us to be reminded in "the latter days" of the prophecies of our backsliding into immoral morass that we cannot extricate ourselves from.  As the United States government is trying to save itself from economic collapse by buying, i.e. "covering  up" the toxic papers of false promises of our leaders' and our confidence games, we can be reminded of how we have our God who promises to cover our sins on this day of Yom Kippurim, the Day of Coverings. 

To aid in the forming of words with which which we are to come before God on this day, please download the updated "The Confession Prayer for Ephraim" at: http://www.uniteourheart.com/Prayer-Projects/Prayer/Confession%20Prayers%20VII.pdf. 

To be primed for this prayer, please print out and read the article: "Take Words,"  http://www.uniteourheart.com/Prayer-Projects/Take-Words.html. It comments on the fact that when Israel is to return to Her God, she is to use the Divinely prescribed protocols to do so. Those protocols are the very words written to us in the Torah, the Writings and the Prophets.  The sacrifices were protocols on how to approach God.  The words He has given us, are the "calves of our lips" as the appropriate ways with which we are "to come near" in the "Work of Eli Y-h" in the "latter days." The Confession Prayer for Ephraim is composed with that injunction in mind and uses the very words from the Scriptures which pertains to Ephraim.  Yes, it uses the King James language, for its words are etched into the conscious and subconscious of our English speaking peoples. 

May the G-d of Israel hear us and all those asking for mercy for ourselves and interceding for our peoples.

Steve Mathe

http://www.uniteourheart.com

"Only Torah, prayer and repentance unifies the Tribes of Israel." 




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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From jamesdtabor at earthlink.net  Wed Oct  8 16:14:02 2008
From: jamesdtabor at earthlink.net (James Tabor)
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 17:14:02 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Meaningful Fasting...
Message-ID: <330FED42-B8F9-442B-BC94-CFF69B8FC5B3@earthlink.net>


Just some thoughts on this holy evening...\

Two male goats are selected for Yom Kippur, one is "for YHVH" and the  
other "for Azazel."  Both are said to be "for a sin offering" (v. 5).

One is slain and the other is sent away into the wilderness.  What has  
been confusing to me and many others who have discussed this passage  
is that BOTH goats are spoken of as somehow providing "atonement," or  
better translated "covering."  So why the difference?

I have always favored the interpretations that make the two goats  
positive and negative, and it is the case that Azazel in ancient  
Jewish texts (1 Enoch, etc.) is the name for an "angel" who opposes  
YHVH.  But if one is negative and one positive, how can both provide  
"covering"?

What I had never noticed is that the first goat, the one that is "for  
YHVH," that is slain, makes "covering for the Holy Place because of  
the uncleanness of the people and because of their transgressions, all  
their sins" (v. 16).  In other word, the blood off that goat is to  
cleanse the Tabernacle that has become unclean because of the sins of  
the people, NOT to removed the sins of the people per se.

In contrast, the sins of the people themselves are PUT ON the head of  
the live goat.  That goat is not killed, yet that goat too is spoken  
as a "sin offering" (v.5), ,making atonement/covering (v. 10), and  
that goat "bears all their iniquities" into a remote area.

I think this distinction might be an important one.  I see no evidence  
in this text that the slain goat is for the forgiveness of the  
people's sins as such...and this is how the Christians have read this  
(see Hebrew 9), applying it to "Christ."  The other goat is not even  
spoken of in the N.T. texts and yet it seems THAT goat is the "sin  
bearer."


I think a lot of the reason this mystery of the two hairy goats is  
difficult to grasp, and engenders many opinions, is that we come to  
the text with presuppositions from our backgrounds, assumptions, and  
the history of interpretation.  It is hard to actually read the text  
with "new eyes" and allow it to say what it appears to say.

The  more I think about it the more I am persuaded that the "two hairy  
goats" represent two related pictures of the "Covering" or redemption  
from sins that comes each year on YK, the Day of Covering...One is  
related to YHVH dwelling in the Tent of Meeting, the other to  
Azazel...It is the latter that has gotten people confused, because  
most, especially the Christians, have transferred the meaning of the  
latter to the former, and read about the blood of the slain goat as if  
it brings redemption from moral sins. But look at the text...

Since BOTH are spoken of as "sin-offerings," and both "atone," but one  
by dying and the other by being driven into the wilderness--they seem  
to be closely related, rather than one "good" and the other "evil."  I  
think I am more and more inclined to give up this view of the good/ 
evil contrast.

I think the key might be to look at Lev 16:15-20.  The goat that is  
KILLED and the blood that is shed is specifically said to be for the  
"covering" (atoning) for the sins of the people, yes, but as related  
to the "uncleaness" of the HOLY PLACE.  In other words, Aaron going  
in, with blood from the bull for himself and household, and blood from  
the goat for the people, is related to making the TENT or Tabernacle  
holy where YHVH dwells--among an unclean people--see v. 16!  This  
seems very clear to me. This is what we would call "ritual" cleansing.  
It is specifically related to the Tent/Tabernacle.

Accordingly, the way the slain goat on YK is interpreted by the  
Christians, as in Hebrews 9, as a picture of the atoning for sins in  
general, especially for "moral" failures, through the shedding of  
blood, is incorrect.  The statement "without the shedding of blood  
there is no remission of sins" is often quoted, but I think  
incorrectly.  Notice, with the live goat there is no shedding of blood  
mentioned!  And yet, what is said of this one?

The goat that really "bears the sins" is the one sent away, into the  
desert.  Notice v. 22.  All the sins and iniquities and transgressions  
are put on the head of this LIVE goat and he is send away TO Azazel!   
This seems to be what really brings the thorough REMOVAL of the sins  
of the people, the ultimate "covering" that comes on Yom Kippur--not  
the blood of that first goat that was for the cleansing of the Tent of  
Meeting. It is as if to say--to hell with your sins!  They are cast  
FAR AWAY, to the desert places, where Azazel and the demons dwell.

I realize in 2nd Temple times there is the tradition of casting this  
second goat off a cliff and killing it. And this might be  
appropriate.  But if one sticks with the text itself, there is an  
emphasis on the LIVE goat--not a dead one.  It is the SENDING forth,  
to the desert, to Azazel, that seems to be the point.  No SHED BLOOD  
is mentioned or involved.

I find this to be very important and for me it is a breakthrough. What  
it means is that the MAIN image of ATONEMENT, the one GREAT atonement,  
on the DAY of atonement/ covering, is the REMOVAL of sins borne by a  
LIVE animal--NOT the via the shedding of blood. I truly think this has  
implications in taking us beyond the sacrificial system of ritual  
cleansing that was set up in connection with the Mishkan, upon which  
everyone has seemed to focus.

That is why the Haphtarah readings for YK are so powerful.  The story  
of Jonah is read. And then the passage in Micah 7:18-20--where sins  
are CAST AWAY...into the depths of the sea. The whole emphasis is on  
TURNING, and then sins being carried away--on "mercy not sacrifice" as  
the Prophets put it.



James Tabor



From dhcole1 at cox.net  Wed Oct  8 19:52:57 2008
From: dhcole1 at cox.net (Dave Cole)
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 19:52:57 -0500
Subject: [Dialogue] Meaningful Fasting...
References: <330FED42-B8F9-442B-BC94-CFF69B8FC5B3@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <B342E5E379C34F44B9BA58CED2CEA73F@davesbook>

James,  thank you for this "jewel"....both you and Ross have emphasized this 
"turning" idea for as long as I have been turning my ears toward what ya'll 
have to say......

dave
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "James Tabor" <jamesdtabor at earthlink.net>
To: <dialogue at rootsoffaith.org>
Sent: Wednesday, October 08, 2008 4:14 PM
Subject: [Dialogue] Meaningful Fasting...


>
> Just some thoughts on this holy evening...\
>
> > The whole emphasis is on
TURNING, and then sins being carried away--on "mercy not sacrifice" as
the Prophets put it.

> James Tabor
>
> _______________________________________________ 



From carlson_john at bellsouth.net  Wed Oct  8 20:04:21 2008
From: carlson_john at bellsouth.net (carlson_john at bellsouth.net)
Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2008 01:04:21 +0000
Subject: [Dialogue] Meaningful Fasting...
In-Reply-To: <B342E5E379C34F44B9BA58CED2CEA73F@davesbook>
References: <330FED42-B8F9-442B-BC94-CFF69B8FC5B3@earthlink.net>
	<B342E5E379C34F44B9BA58CED2CEA73F@davesbook>
Message-ID: <100920080104.17674.48ED58950005C96A0000450A22218801869B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF02080106A102019C049D0E0C@att.net>

Ditto!

--
John C. 

"Be excellent to each other!" 
Bill and Ted 


-------------- Original message from "Dave Cole" <dhcole1 at cox.net>: -------------- 


> James, thank you for this "jewel"....both you and Ross have emphasized this 
> "turning" idea for as long as I have been turning my ears toward what ya'll 
> have to say...... 
> 
> dave 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "James Tabor" 
> To: 
> Sent: Wednesday, October 08, 2008 4:14 PM 
> Subject: [Dialogue] Meaningful Fasting... 
> 
> 
> > 
> > Just some thoughts on this holy evening...\ 
> > 
> > > The whole emphasis is on 
> TURNING, and then sins being carried away--on "mercy not sacrifice" as 
> the Prophets put it. 
> 
> > James Tabor 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________ 
> 
> _______________________________________________ 
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From RNDAVAR at aol.com  Wed Oct  8 21:35:08 2008
From: RNDAVAR at aol.com (RNDAVAR at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 22:35:08 EDT
Subject: [Dialogue] Yom Kippur 
Message-ID: <bd1.3fa4956b.361ec7dc@aol.com>

I just posted a blog entry for Yom Kippur on my blog - 
_http://rootsoffaith.org/blog-and-podcasts/_ (http://rootsoffaith.org/blog-and-podcasts/) 
 
Check it out if you are interested.

Shalom!  Ross
 
Ross K.  Nichols 
_www.RootsofFaith.org_ (http://www.rootsoffaith.org/) 





**************New MapQuest Local shows what's happening at your destination.  
Dining, Movies, Events, News & more. Try it out!      
(http://local.mapquest.com/?ncid=emlcntnew00000001)
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From chattertonw at bellsouth.net  Thu Oct  9 11:49:08 2008
From: chattertonw at bellsouth.net (chattertonw at bellsouth.net)
Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2008 16:49:08 +0000
Subject: [Dialogue] (no subject)
Message-ID: <100920081649.14867.48EE3604000984BF00003A1322218675169B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>

All, 

This note just in from my mother concerning Ezra. What better time to do an Isaiah 57-58 fast by focusing on praying to HaSHeM for a 12 year old boy with cancer?

Thank you,

Glenn

Christine, our daughter-in-law, called this evening to let us know that Micah had to put Ezra in the hospital this afternoon.  We had talked to her this morning and she had said he wasn't  doing well at all.  He is on 24hour oxygen and the drs' felt he should be under their observation.  They also wanted to put him on an IV cause they we concerned he would get pneumonia.  He is very weak and they gave him a blood transfusion and hope to do some chemo.  It doesn't look good for him, so please pray  especially for his Dad, Micah and our son and daughter.  This has been a long hard fight for all of them.  Ezra still hopes to get well and go on a trip to Italy with his grandparents, or so he told Chris.  Thank you all for praying.  
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From patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com  Thu Oct  9 12:03:29 2008
From: patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com (Pat Robbins)
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 13:03:29 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <100920081649.14867.48EE3604000984BF00003A1322218675169B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>
References: <100920081649.14867.48EE3604000984BF00003A1322218675169B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>
Message-ID: <BLU125-DS3F4D1D59D3E01EE8A8052BA3A0@phx.gbl>

Computer's on - heard your email come in and saw your words about Ezra.  Am praying for him.

Love,

Pat


From: chattertonw at bellsouth.net 
Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2008 12:49 PM
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
Subject: [Dialogue] (no subject)


All, 

This note just in from my mother concerning Ezra. What better time to do an Isaiah 57-58 fast by focusing on praying to HaSHeM for a 12 year old boy with cancer?

Thank you,

Glenn

Christine, our daughter-in-law, called this evening to let us know that Micah had to put Ezra in the hospital this afternoon.  We had talked to her this morning and she had said he wasn't  doing well at all.  He is on 24hour oxygen and the drs' felt he should be under their observation.  They also wanted to put him on an IV cause they we concerned he would get pneumonia.  He is very weak and they gave him a blood transfusion and hope to do some chemo.  It doesn't look good for him, so please pray  especially for his Dad, Micah and our son and daughter.  This has been a long hard fight for all of them.  Ezra still hopes to get well and go on a trip to Italy with his grandparents, or so he told Chris.  Thank you all for praying.  


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


_______________________________________________
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Thu Oct  9 15:36:21 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 06:36:21 +1000
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] (no subject)]
Message-ID: <48EE6B45.2080808@westnet.com.au>

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From jid at westnet.com.au  Thu Oct  9 16:03:50 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 07:03:50 +1000
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] A Prayer and a Blessing for Yom Kippur]
Message-ID: <48EE71B6.9050200@westnet.com.au>

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Subject: [Dialogue] A Prayer and a Blessing for Yom Kippur
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 10:23:40 -0400
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Thu Oct  9 16:20:02 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 07:20:02 +1000
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] Meaningful Fasting...]
Message-ID: <48EE7582.1020809@westnet.com.au>

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Subject: [Dialogue] Meaningful Fasting...
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 17:14:02 -0400
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Fri Oct 10 06:12:51 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 04:12:51 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] Erev Shabbat - the Lekarev Report
Message-ID: <855590370810100412h25dc566bv6787374bc65daf26@mail.gmail.com>

     The Lekarev Report
   *11 Tishrei 5769
* *October 10, 2008
*  Shabbat Shalom

For the portion of Hashem is His people, Jacob is the lot of His
inheritance.  He found him in a desert land, and in the waste, a howling
wilderness; He encompassed him about, He cared for him, He kept him as the
apple of His eye;  as an eagle that stirs up her nest, hovers over her
young, spreads her wings, takes them, and bears them on her pinions.

Deut. 32:9-11
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Fri Oct 10 07:20:37 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 05:20:37 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] Yes, Riots & Pogroms on Yom Kippur...in ISRAEL!
Message-ID: <855590370810100520h5d1bbe79h93339a1c88f13578@mail.gmail.com>

Do I even have to comment on this?  But there IS an answer to this, if only
we would have the courage to trust in HaShem, not the resident (current or
future) of the White House...
                                       *   Hanoch*

 Akko Riots Blamed on Leniency
by Hillel Fendel

MK Uri Ariel (Tekumah/National Union) and his party colleague MK Tzvi Hendel
are paying a post-Yom Kippur visit to Akko, site of the Arab pogrom against
Jewish property.  Speaking from the northern coastal city on Friday morning,
Ariel said, "First of all, we must know that it was Arab MK Abbas Zakour who
basically instigated the riots.  He was one of the first people on the
scene, and he made the call for hundreds of Arabs to come to the scene,
after which they started destroying cars and stores."

MK Ariel added, "The Israel-Arab problem is a very deep-seated one, and
though Public Security Minister Avi Dichter is here trying to bring quiet,
his actions won't help the long-term issues, and can only exacerbate them.
Many Arabs simply do not recognize Israeli sovereignty..."
MK Ariel: "Many Arabs simply do not recognize Israeli sovereignty."

Asked what he would like Dichter to do "today or this week," Ariel said,
"It's not a question of this week. The criminals amongst the Arabs must
first of all be dealt with very harshly according to the law.  In the
long-term, we cannot keep covering up this problem of the growing brazenness
of the Arabs, and it must be faced head-on."

Ariel said the Jewish residents of Akko "are embittered at the feeble police
response, as well as the inaction of the municipality.  They are hoping for
a change..."

Ariel was referring to the upcoming municipal elections, but
Kadima-affiliated Mayor Shimon Lancry is expected to be re-elected, despite
yesterday's Arab riots.

Ruby Luzon, a resident of Akko and member of the local branch of Tekumah,
said, "The Arabs rioted for hours without the police doing anything. But
when the Jews demonstrated, the police used shock guns and other
riot-dispersal means, and some Jews were even injured as a result."

As the news of the riots became known on Thursday night, Ariel said, "For
years, Israeli society - and thus the police and State Prosecution as well -
is very forgiving of the undermining activity of the 'Israeli' Arabs.  The
results of ignoring their behavior erupted in Akko today."
"We're fooling ourselves, ignoring the participation of Israeli-Arabs in
terrorist attacks, refusing to recognize that most of the property crimes in
Israel are carried out by Arabs."

"We have been fooling ourselves all these years," Ariel said. "We are
ignoring the participation of Arabs with Israeli citizenship in terrorist
attacks, and we refuse to recognize that most of the property crimes in
Israel are carried out by Arabs."

"We also don't want to know about the systematic Arab takeover of Jewish
neighborhoods in Israeli cities," he said. "Significant centers of unrest
exist, just like in Akko, in Lod, Ramle, Yaffo, Carmiel, Upper Nazareth, and
Haifa as well.  There, too, Arab riots and destruction of Jewish property
are just a matter of time."

Ariel says left-wing groups are to blame as well "for years of spreading the
lies that 'Israeli'-Arabs are victims of discrimination.  The Arabs of
Israel spit in the well from which they drink, and are a fifth column in
Israel.  No economic complaints on their part can justify the calls to
'Murder the Jews!' and the like."
Comment on This
Story<http://trailer.web-view.net/Links/0X16A02CC834FE64F698EC6C90063C7479E12DCB0C92354B7F2B2FA34CEF434D88589944C8590A62F637E2F168034FA55DDA3B755E1F8EB53EB056B0C882B44C4E.htm>


2. Riots in Akko on Yom Kippur by Nissan Ratzlav-Katz

An Arab driver nearly ran down a group of Jews in the street, the latter -
fearing a terror attack - stoned him, and Arabs rioted and vandalized Jewish
property in the mixed northern coastal city of Akko (Acre) during the Yom
Kippur holiday and fast. Clashes began Wednesday evening and lasted through
Thursday night. Police are on alert to prevent further provocations or acts
of vengeance.

The day of violence began Wednesday evening, just after the start of the Yom
Kippur fast, when an Arab driver from Akko's Old City entered a
majority-Jewish neighborhood at high-speed. The vehicle raised suspicions,
as in Israel it is considered unacceptable for anyone other than emergency
vehicles to drive on Yom Kippur, the holiest day in the Jewish calendar,
although it is not forbidden by law. The driver had to bypass a barrier set
up to block traffic at the entrance to the neighborhood.

A resident of the city told Israel National News that the motorist was
spotted driving at a high speed towards a park where a group of Jewish youth
had gathered. Fearing they were the target of a vehicular terrorist attack -
of the type that has been perpetrated several times in recent months - the
youths pelted the car with rocks and called for help. Jews from the
neighborhood gathered and the driver took refuge with his relatives, a local
Arab family.

At that point, Akko Arabs were called to come to the aid of the driver and
his family, with the help of a rumor that Jews had killed an Arab resident
of the Old City. Arabs began smashing cars and "everything in their way,"
one eyewitness said.  A police officer, the Arab driver and another person
were lightly injured as hundreds of people, Jews and Arabs, clashed.

*'If You Leave Your Homes, We'll Kill You'
*Police, representatives of Akko City Hall and local Arab leaders managed to
end the clashes, but the violence continued as Arabs heading back to their
neighborhoods ran riot through Jewish areas of the city. Calling "Death to
the Jews" and Allah hu akbar ("Allah is great"), the rioters vandalized
hundreds of Jewish-owned shops and vehicles, and threw rocks at people on
their way to or from Yom Kippur prayers.

According to an eyewitness, "The Arabs threatened Jews that if they left
their home they'd be attacked. The Arabs began vandalizing Jewish-owned cars
in the street and smashing windows. Afterwards, we saw them coming with axes
and slashing tires. It was awful. Residents were afraid to leave for the
synagogue."

Sources in the Akko municipality claimed that among those inciting the Arab
mobs were known Islamist activists. Police arrested eight people on
suspicion of involvement in the violence. Four people were arraigned
Thursday, the others will see a judge on Friday.

*More Violence as the Fast Ends
*Clashes resumed Thursday night after the fast ended, with demonstrations by
hundreds of Jews and Arabs near the train station in the eastern section of
the city and near the housing projects in the northern neighborhoods. Jewish
youths set fire to an empty lot and attempted to make their way to other
parts of the city.

Police blocked the eastern entrance to Akko and have been pushing Jewish
protesters back towards a local first aid station. To disperse the crowds,
police used stun and gas grenades, as well as water hoses, but had
difficulty controlling the demonstrators. Clashes with the police continued
sporadically into the night, as the Northern District Police Chief, Shimon
Koren, is personally overseeing the crowd control operations.

Police are deploying hundreds of officers, patrol cars and special forces in
the city's hot spots. "We know that Jews intend to carry out acts of
revenge, but we are not talking about an organized initiative," a police
spokesman said. "The force will prevent any such interaction."

Public Security Minister Avi Dichter is monitoring the situation closely; he
arrived in the city for a visit on Friday morning.
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Sat Oct 11 03:44:11 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 18:44:11 +1000
Subject: [Dialogue] Selichot- a time of repentance
Message-ID: <48F0675B.8060500@westnet.com.au>

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From Correim at gninc.ca  Sat Oct 11 16:48:57 2008
From: Correim at gninc.ca (Cornie Reimer)
Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 16:48:57 -0500
Subject: [Dialogue] The book and CD by Nehemia Gordon
In-Reply-To: <774530.3639.qm@web51105.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
References: <774530.3639.qm@web51105.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <48F11F49.9040606@gninc.ca>

Hi to all of you
I have sat in Bible studies with Nehemia Gordon in Jerusalem as the 
teacher. He is a good teacher. But sad to say, some things turned me off 
a bit. Nehemia Gordon loved to make jokes against orthodox Judaism, and 
if i have it right, he divorced his wife because she wanted to have 
children. One thing that was interesting was that she came to his Bible 
studies and sat right next to him.

Cornie


Tracy Osborne wrote:
>
> Thanks Clyde.
>
>  
>
> I read and studied this book and perspective and was there until I was 
> given a vision of Rabbi Chaim Richman which led me to re-think 
> Nehemyah Gordon's Ka'arite teaching. I was led through Rabbi Richman 
> to study Joseph Good's perspective which led me to Ross this year and 
> to the rest of you blessed folk this year. So, I am aware of the 
> varying perspectives of Ultra Orthodox, Orthodox, Kaarite, 
> Conservative, Reform, Askenazic, Sephardic, Temani, etc. I guess these 
> are issues that our brother Judah continues to struggle with among 
> themselves.
>
>  
>
> For us of "Joseph", we seem to move among these different perspectives 
> and it doesn't really matter to Judah since we are more in the class 
> of God-fearers / Noachides.
>
>  
>
> We must follow the proverb [I don't remember which one] that goes 
> something like this:
>
> One man seems right until the other comes and gives his testimony. So, 
> hopefully I've learned to listen to all - As one of my Rabbi's stated: 
> "Be quick to hear and slow to speak".
>
>  
>
> Love & Prayers,
>
>  
>
> Tracy
>
>  
>
>  
>
>  
>
>
>
> --- On *Tue, 6/24/08, CBrown4465 at aol.com /<CBrown4465 at aol.com>/* wrote:
>
>     From: CBrown4465 at aol.com <CBrown4465 at aol.com>
>     Subject: [Dialogue] The book and CD by Nehemia Gordon
>     To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
>     Date: Tuesday, June 24, 2008, 12:47 PM
>
>     Let me recommend the book and CD by Nehemia Gordon - The Jewish
>     Yeshua verses the Greek Jesus, Ross in mentioned in the footnotes
>     for his contribution.
>      
>     Clyde
>
>
>
>     ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>     Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient
>     used cars <http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007>.
>
>     _______________________________________________
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
>   
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG. 
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.4.1/1516 - Release Date: 24/06/2008 7:53 AM
>   
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From calbfordham at gmail.com  Sat Oct 11 16:57:27 2008
From: calbfordham at gmail.com (calb fordham)
Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 17:57:27 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] The book and CD by Nehemia Gordon
In-Reply-To: <48F11F49.9040606@gninc.ca>
References: <774530.3639.qm@web51105.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
	<48F11F49.9040606@gninc.ca>
Message-ID: <c599cad60810111457o969b066s5eddc6fe79fed309@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Cornie!

Thank you for your information and he STILL makes fun of Orthodox Judaism.
We don't like that about him.  We only recommended the book because of
historical insights about paganism, not because of the author.

Enjoying YOUR book!

Chris and Amber Fordham

On Sat, Oct 11, 2008 at 5:48 PM, Cornie Reimer <Correim at gninc.ca> wrote:

> Hi to all of you
> I have sat in Bible studies with Nehemia Gordon in Jerusalem as the
> teacher. He is a good teacher. But sad to say, some things turned me off a
> bit. Nehemia Gordon loved to make jokes against orthodox Judaism, and if i
> have it right, he divorced his wife because she wanted to have children. One
> thing that was interesting was that she came to his Bible studies and sat
> right next to him.
>
> Cornie
>
>
> Tracy Osborne wrote:
>
>     Thanks Clyde.
>
>
>
> I read and studied this book and perspective and was there until I was
> given a vision of Rabbi Chaim Richman which led me to re-think Nehemyah
> Gordon's Ka'arite teaching. I was led through Rabbi Richman to study Joseph
> Good's perspective which led me to Ross this year and to the rest of you
> blessed folk this year. So, I am aware of the varying perspectives of Ultra
> Orthodox, Orthodox, Kaarite, Conservative, Reform, Askenazic, Sephardic,
> Temani, etc. I guess these are issues that our brother Judah continues to
> struggle with among themselves.
>
>
>
> For us of "Joseph", we seem to move among these different perspectives and
> it doesn't really matter to Judah since we are more in the class of
> God-fearers / Noachides.
>
>
>
> We must follow the proverb [I don't remember which one] that goes something
> like this:
>
> One man seems right until the other comes and gives his testimony. So,
> hopefully I've learned to listen to all - As one of my Rabbi's stated: "Be
> quick to hear and slow to speak".
>
>
>
> Love & Prayers,
>
>
>
> Tracy
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --- On *Tue, 6/24/08, CBrown4465 at aol.com <CBrown4465 at aol.com><CBrown4465 at aol.com>
> * wrote:
>
> From: CBrown4465 at aol.com <CBrown4465 at aol.com> <CBrown4465 at aol.com>
> Subject: [Dialogue] The book and CD by Nehemia Gordon
> To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
> Date: Tuesday, June 24, 2008, 12:47 PM
>
>  Let me recommend the book and CD by Nehemia Gordon - The Jewish Yeshua
> verses the Greek Jesus, Ross in mentioned in the footnotes for his
> contribution.
>
> Clyde
>
>
>
>  ------------------------------
> Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars<http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007>
> .
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.4.1/1516 - Release Date: 24/06/2008 7:53 AM
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
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From Correim at gninc.ca  Sat Oct 11 17:26:37 2008
From: Correim at gninc.ca (Cornie Reimer)
Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 17:26:37 -0500
Subject: [Dialogue] The book and CD by Nehemia Gordon
In-Reply-To: <c599cad60810111457o969b066s5eddc6fe79fed309@mail.gmail.com>
References: <774530.3639.qm@web51105.mail.re2.yahoo.com>	<48F11F49.9040606@gninc.ca>
	<c599cad60810111457o969b066s5eddc6fe79fed309@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <48F1281D.7020901@gninc.ca>

I Have his book too, I agree, he is likely a good scholar. And I am sure 
he means it well. I did not want be misleading here either or to be a 
gossiper. Sorry if i did that.

Cornie



calb fordham wrote:
> Hi Cornie!
>  
> Thank you for your information and he STILL makes fun of Orthodox 
> Judaism.  We don't like that about him.  We only recommended the book 
> because of historical insights about paganism, not because of the 
> author. 
>  
> Enjoying YOUR book!
>  
> Chris and Amber Fordham
>
> On Sat, Oct 11, 2008 at 5:48 PM, Cornie Reimer <Correim at gninc.ca 
> <mailto:Correim at gninc.ca>> wrote:
>
>     Hi to all of you
>     I have sat in Bible studies with Nehemia Gordon in Jerusalem as
>     the teacher. He is a good teacher. But sad to say, some things
>     turned me off a bit. Nehemia Gordon loved to make jokes against
>     orthodox Judaism, and if i have it right, he divorced his wife
>     because she wanted to have children. One thing that was
>     interesting was that she came to his Bible studies and sat right
>     next to him.
>
>     Cornie
>
>
>     Tracy Osborne wrote:
>>
>>     Thanks Clyde.
>>
>>      
>>
>>     I read and studied this book and perspective and was there until
>>     I was given a vision of Rabbi Chaim Richman which led me to
>>     re-think Nehemyah Gordon's Ka'arite teaching. I was led through
>>     Rabbi Richman to study Joseph Good's perspective which led me to
>>     Ross this year and to the rest of you blessed folk this year. So,
>>     I am aware of the varying perspectives of Ultra Orthodox,
>>     Orthodox, Kaarite, Conservative, Reform, Askenazic, Sephardic,
>>     Temani, etc. I guess these are issues that our brother Judah
>>     continues to struggle with among themselves.
>>
>>      
>>
>>     For us of "Joseph", we seem to move among these different
>>     perspectives and it doesn't really matter to Judah since we are
>>     more in the class of God-fearers / Noachides.
>>
>>      
>>
>>     We must follow the proverb [I don't remember which one] that goes
>>     something like this:
>>
>>     One man seems right until the other comes and gives his
>>     testimony. So, hopefully I've learned to listen to all - As one
>>     of my Rabbi's stated: "Be quick to hear and slow to speak".
>>
>>      
>>
>>     Love & Prayers,
>>
>>      
>>
>>     Tracy
>>
>>      
>>
>>      
>>
>>      
>>
>>
>>
>>     --- On *Tue, 6/24/08, CBrown4465 at aol.com
>>     <mailto:CBrown4465 at aol.com> /<CBrown4465 at aol.com>
>>     <mailto:CBrown4465 at aol.com>/* wrote:
>>
>>         From: CBrown4465 at aol.com <mailto:CBrown4465 at aol.com>
>>         <CBrown4465 at aol.com> <mailto:CBrown4465 at aol.com>
>>         Subject: [Dialogue] The book and CD by Nehemia Gordon
>>         To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org <mailto:dialogue at rootsoffaith.org>
>>         Date: Tuesday, June 24, 2008, 12:47 PM
>>
>>         Let me recommend the book and CD by Nehemia Gordon - The
>>         Jewish Yeshua verses the Greek Jesus, Ross in mentioned in
>>         the footnotes for his contribution.
>>          
>>         Clyde
>>
>>
>>
>>         ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>         Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for
>>         fuel-efficient used cars
>>         <http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007>.
>>
>>         _______________________________________________
>>
>>
>>     ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>     _______________________________________________
>>       
>>     ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>     No virus found in this incoming message.
>>     Checked by AVG. 
>>     Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.4.1/1516 - Release Date: 24/06/2008 7:53 AM
>>       
>
>     _______________________________________________
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
>   
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From Correim at gninc.ca  Sat Oct 11 18:47:04 2008
From: Correim at gninc.ca (Cornie Reimer)
Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 18:47:04 -0500
Subject: by Cornie going back to [Dialogue] The Old and the New
In-Reply-To: <4869742A.3020300@gninc.ca>
References: <516d73340805230522w109241e1sce4c8a3172bf6263@mail.gmail.com>	<485E5AB4.9080203@gninc.ca>	<c599cad60806301100s3c97530fk98602cc63b0aa7ce@mail.gmail.com>
	<4869742A.3020300@gninc.ca>
Message-ID: <48F13AF8.7090907@gninc.ca>

Hi Chris & Amber
I am only up to the end of June answering and deleting these e-mails, 
and also printing out those I want to collect. Here I have promised you 
if you give me time I will send you information, or even the book "The 
Noahide Code" Did you get it? If not, and if you are still interested I 
will send you a copy of it. Sorry for ALL THE TIME it took.
Cornie

Cornie Reimer wrote:
> Hi Chris & Amber
> Just give me a little time and I can give you the Noahide Nations 
> address. I think it was around $13.00 a book, with some 115 pages. 
> Just in case you will not get through to order it, I could send you 
> one. I also have a book I wrote as a  Messianic Christian, by the 
> Title "My Journey to the Sabbath". with 5 chapters. One of the 
> shortest chapters , is the Catholic version how  they chose Sunday to 
> replace Saterday. chapter 5 is my debate with Pastor DeHann. Just put 
> up as a debate. I never talked with him.
>
> Cornie
>
>
> chris fordham wrote:
>> Hey Cornie!  I would like to read this book.  Thanks for mentioning 
>> it!  Amber
>>
>> On Sun, Jun 22, 2008 at 9:59 AM, Cornie Reimer <Correim at gninc.ca 
>> <mailto:Correim at gninc.ca>> wrote:
>>
>>     Hey Brian, I have been so far behind checking my e-mails and know
>>     that I am not doing justice to not answer the thoughts you have
>>     suggested in the two following articles, that you likely have
>>     miss-understood, in the first article you write as follows:  "Your
>>     first quote from the "Noahide Code" seems regretfully only to have
>>     been included for its clout value. It is such a general statement,
>>     and without any sort of contextual back up, that it is almost
>>     self-cancelling as far as our present discussion goes."
>>
>>      And this is a repeat of what I wrote: ( I have quoted out of a
>>     book "The Noahide Code, A Guide to the Perplexed Christian"  in
>>     which  book it is high lighted how the New Testament  has been
>>     corrupted, so much so,  and I will quote: "There is no single  New
>>     Testament text that a Christian can honestly  point to and say, 
>>     This is  *the true* New Testament." (end of quote). I hope this
>>     quote will not be misunderstood as an empty statement, or not
>>     academic. But concerning Paul, I am starting to wonder if his
>>     words could have been falsified enough to bring contention to his
>>     true desire to walk and teach in truth of Torah knowledge that he
>>     likely had.) So far my quote from which you take what seems to me
>>     you may be miss-understanding this as an empty statement, or as
>>     you say: "self canceling". I realize I likely should have
>>     explained a little more what a copy righted book is saying, I did
>>     not feel free to copy  without permission, referring to the
>>     "Noahide Code", please bear with me here and I will try to explain
>>     myself as late as this comes from the time you wrote that.
>>
>>     First, I highly respect the obligation that Judah has received to
>>     safe guard and preserve the Torah as authentic Word of HaShem, the
>>     Jewish peoples wrongs included as well as the things they did
>>     right, which is irrelevant (meaning what they did right or wrong)
>>     to what I wrote this quote from "The Noahide Code" for. I want to
>>     be understood right what I meant to say, being, that I gave a
>>     wrong impression of that book. The "Noahide Code" is a book I
>>     would highly recommend to read, and can get information of it from:
>>
>>     For help with any of our online services, please email the 
>> store-owner: CustomerCare at NoahideNations.com 
>> <mailto:CustomerCare at NoahideNations.com>.
>>
>>        
>>     What I was writing about is concerning a falsehood that I have
>>     believed most of my life, that "the New Testament is concealed in
>>     the Old T. and the Old Testament is revealed in the New T." A
>>     thought that I can no longer support. And this is the main reason
>>     I quoted from "The Noahide Code". To my view the two books, the
>>     "so called Old T.and the New T.do not agree, as both being
>>     inspired by the God of Abraham Isaac and Jacob.You can take a book
>>     of Isaiah printed 1500 years later than a copy from the find in
>>     the Quamram Caves, written 1500 years apart and they will be
>>     identical. And authentic to the time it was written.Thanks to the
>>     Jewish people for having honored and preserved this blueprint for
>>     righteous and holy living. If you know Hebrew, in the original you
>>     will not find a prophecy of a virgin birth in Isaiah 7:14. Not so
>>     with the New Testament. The N.T. is falsified, together with
>>     modern translations of the Old T. To make Isaiah 7:14 an original
>>     virgin birth prophecy, of which none is to be found in the
>>     original Hebrew Torah and Tanach. This is one example only of the
>>     distortion of the New T to claim false teaching.
>>     You know that what has not been falsified by translations, like
>>     the King James for example, concerning Isaiah 7:14, where Matthew
>>     1 claims a prophecy of Jesus to be born of a virgin is supposed to
>>     have been prophesied in Isaiah 7:14. Yes I believe the
>>     translations of the Old Testament have been badly corrupted too.
>>     But you can always go and grab the zitzit of a righteous Jew and
>>     ask them what does the original say, right? But you just can not
>>     say this of the New Testament, or can you?
>>
>>     According to my limited understanding the New Testament writings,
>>     all written later, can not be trusted to have such a backup at
>>     all, and although the original writers may have been very sincere,
>>     why is it that it has not been preserved, like the Torah of Moses'
>>     time, the Old Testament has been? That is why I quoted "There is
>>     no single  New Testament text that a Christian can honestly  point
>>     to and say,  This is  *the true* New Testament." The Noahide Code
>>     is not a book to be looked down on as a mere book as you seem to
>>     say Brian "without any sort of contextual back up, that it is
>>     almost self-cancelling as far as our present discussion goes." 
>>     And the reason you made that statement very likely is my fault,
>>     because I did not explain it clear enough. This book has only 120
>>     pages, out of which 33 pages are notes taken from writers such as
>>     Bart D Ehrman, in fact 4 of these pages are the bibliography of
>>     writers the content of this book is taken from.
>>
>>     A little later you write, as you can check it out in the later
>>     part of the following article from you. ( I quote again what you
>>     write) "Any body who proposes to speak fairly on behalf of the NT,
>>     not as an inspired, infallible set of texts, but as a collection
>>     of texts that were written by people who felt that the Spirit of
>>     God had encouraged them to write, has an uphill battle to deal
>>     with an abundance of books that seem to be wanting to box the
>>     church around the ears for its manifold indiscretions."
>>
>>      Brian I know that the Noahide Code as well as many other books
>>     are not comparable to the inspired Word of HaShem given to Moses
>>     and the prophets, and Yeshuah may be included as a prophet. But
>>     what you will find in a book like "The Noahide Code" is that the
>>     author has not just made absent minded predictions out of his own
>>     head, but is very careful with facts explaining how they can find
>>     that copies written on certain skins, or papyrus, or found as one
>>     written in such a time and others earlier or later. If for example
>>     they find a text of the book of John that is older not including
>>     the story of the adulteress who was caught in the act in John 8,
>>     it was likely a story that was added later, and not originally in
>>     the book of John.
>>
>>     I just wanted you people in the dialog not to get a wrong
>>     impression of a book that I quoted a few lines from, like "The
>>     Noahide Code"just because I did not give enough description of
>>     what it is about. I do that more times, I am used to not being
>>     contested like this when I have been too much on my own. I love
>>     this challenge, if for nothing more than to be corrected where I
>>     am wrong. But at this point I do not see the writers of the New
>>     Testament as inspired of the Holy Spirit, as much so as the Holy
>>     Prophets of the Old Testament.
>>
>>     In your second article below the following one, you write as 
>> follows:
>>     "Your question 8 seems to draw some invalid conclusions. God can
>>     not be accused of giving Israel a dead thing or a false Torah,
>>     because it was Israel herself who made the covenant a dead thing,
>>     who made the Torah into a falsity. If "all of Israel" had been
>>     obedient there would be no need for something new, because it
>>     would have remained alive and true."
>>
>>     This is my take about what you seem to see in this statement. I
>>     did not mean ever, that I was accusing G-d for giving Israel a
>>     dead Covenant. But If what the New T. claims to be quoting Paul to
>>     say is divinely inspired, and I quote out of Hebr.8:6 - 8 But now
>>     hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is
>>     the mediator of a _better_ Covenant, which was established upon
>>     _better_ promises, v. 8 For if that _first Covenant had been
>>     faultless_ (he is not talking about right or wrong people but
>>     about an everlasting Covenant given to His chosen people, all of
>>     Israel, not just the Jews). Now if this scripture written in the
>>     King James New Testament is by divine inspiration, in that case
>>     the Old Testament Covenant was at fault, and G-d who gave this
>>     everlasting Covenant to His chosen people for an everlasting
>>     Covenant, must have made a bad mistake. I did not and still do not
>>     claim that He did. But both are not right, which one is? Is it the
>>     the Everlasting Covenant that G-d gave to Moses on Mount Sinai? Or
>>     could it be that there is a false teaching that Paul is supposed
>>     to have taught by divine inspiration in the not so reliable New
>>     Testament, that seems to have Christianity by the throat?
>>
>>      I am not sure what you mean Brian when you say: If "all of
>>     Israel" had been obedient there would be no need for something
>>     new, because it would have remained alive and true".It seems to me
>>     people like you under the influence of the teaching of the New
>>     T.seem to feel obligated to twist the meaning of what we clearly
>>     read there to have to be divinely inspired.  I understand the
>>     Covenant made at Mount Sinai with Moses is an everlasting Covenant
>>     with the same people, but since we, if we are a part of the exiled
>>     Ephraim, a part of Israel, Jacob's literal son's and daughters,
>>     have been deceived by such as I quoted out of Hebrew, once we will
>>     get our eye's opened to see such lies from our forefathers, the
>>     Catholic Church as an example, than and only than we will see this
>>     re-newed but same Covenant as something coming out of bondage in
>>     the flesh to a true freedom that will be pointed out to us by the
>>     coming Jewish Messiah.
>>
>>     I am not blaming anyone, I have been there, done that, I do not
>>     look down on anyone who is still caught in this trap of believing
>>     the New Testament to be divine inspired pure Word of G-d. I
>>     believe that if this New T. is inspired ( after it has been
>>     falsified) it is inspired by a false pagan god, according to my
>>     view. ( I am referring to the falsification of what could be
>>     genuine truth) I stand to be corrected.
>>
>>      As we read in the prayer for Ephraim: "Only because You have
>>     awakened us from our graves that we remember the wormwood and gall
>>     in our souls that we accumulated for centuries. Only by Your grace
>>     are we remembering Your works for us, and are aware of our bones
>>     coming together in the Valley of dry bones."
>>
>>      I am still very likely not seeing all I need to see. But I want
>>     to repent by HaShem's grace, from false teaching as it is revealed
>>     to me. Best regards.
>>
>>     Cornie.
>>
>>
>>
>>     Brian McFarlane wrote:
>>
>>     Cornie,
>>     My understanding is that Paul, working from the basis of the OT
>>     mentioning a new covenant in Jer31:31-34, sees in that "new" that
>>     which he calls "better". In Heb1:1-9 Paul quite clearly states his
>>     understanding of the relationshp between a Son and God, and then
>>     indicates that that Son is Christ Jesus. Now I know absolutely
>>     nothing of the history of the transmission of the book of Hebrews
>>     from its time of writing down to the present day but I would
>>     venture to say that any errors that have occurred  do not
>>     dramatically change the overall thrust of what the writer of the
>>     book has to offer.
>>     Your first quote from the "Noahide Code" seems regretfully only to
>>     have been included for its clout value. It is such a general
>>     statement, and without any sort of contextual back up, that it is
>>     almost self-cancelling as far as our present discussion goes. Any
>>     body who proposes to speak fairly on behalf of the NT, not as an
>>     inspired, infallible set of texts, but as a collection of texts
>>     that were written by people who felt that the Spirit of God had
>>     encouraged them to write, has an uphill battle to deal with an
>>     abundance of books that seem to be wanting to box the church
>>     around the ears for its manifold indiscretions. If I personally
>>     choose to give both testaments equal weight then I also choose not
>>     to bring into the discussion the manifold indiscretions of the
>>     Israelites throughout their history. The essence of the two
>>     revelations deals with how God graciously condescends to make
>>     Divine Love known to all of the Creator's dominion, whether or not
>>     many of those subjects are interested in what God has done for them.
>>     Brian
>>
>>     Brian McFarlane wrote:
>>>     Cornie,
>>>     Your question 8 seems to draw some invalid conclusions. God can
>>>     not be accused of giving Israel a dead thing or a false Torah,
>>>     because it was Israel herself who made the covenant a dead thing,
>>>     who made the Torah into a falsity. If "all of Israel" had been
>>>     obedient there would be no need for something new, because it
>>>     would have remained alive and true.
>>>     It may well come to pass that at the end of the scheme of things
>>>     both church and synagogue will stand under the same condemnation
>>>     as Israel as Paul wrote in Rom3:23, "For all have sinned and come
>>>     short of the glory of God."     One testament is not more 
>>> spiritual than the other. Both are
>>>     spiritual. Both, independent of the other, can bring a thirsting
>>>     soul to drink at still waters and to rest in green pastures. But
>>>     if one wants to see one testament as deficient and the other is
>>>     better, then to his eternal detriment he probably will. Ask God
>>>     to talk to you through both testaments and the Creator will. Ask
>>>     God to talk to you through the prognostications of men and the
>>>     Creator probably wont.
>>>     Brian
>>>     Brian     
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
>>>
>>>
>>>     _______________________________________________
>>>           
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
>>>
>>>
>>>     No virus found in this incoming message.
>>>     Checked by AVG.     Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 
>>> 269.24.0/1462 - Release Date: 23/05/2008 7:20 AM
>>>       
>>
>>     _______________________________________________
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>   
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>> Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.4.3/1526 - 
>> Release Date: 30/06/2008 8:43 AM
>>   
> _______________________________________________
>
>


From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sat Oct 11 23:23:43 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 21:23:43 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] Selichot- a time of repentance
In-Reply-To: <48F0675B.8060500@westnet.com.au>
References: <48F0675B.8060500@westnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <855590370810112123v38cebe8bw503e42a14ca208b1@mail.gmail.com>

Shalom v'Shavua tov Joe,

    What an amazing experience your friend  described, I can't even imagine
it!  Thanks SO much for this, and all of your posts.

    The link you sent was deeply meaningful.  I've actually listened to
"Tikun HaKlali" (also focused on Tshuva), chanted by this same Chazan.  It's
on YOUTUBE also.

     Yes, now IS the time to return to HaShem...we're not going to be
getting many more chances on our own....

     B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,
       *    Hanoch*

On Sat, Oct 11, 2008 at 1:44 AM, JOE INDOMENICO <jid at westnet.com.au> wrote:

> *Shavua Tov Chaverim,
>
> I received an email from Yan, a close friend of mine from the Gush
> expulsion who just spent Yom Kippur at the Rabbi Elboz Temple Synagogue in
> Meah Shearim the religious heart of Yerushalayim.
>
> The congregation numbered some 3000 and he told me that the walls were
> shaking from the praying, singing and the crying. The evening Kol Nidrei
> service on Erev Yom Kippur lasted 5 hours. The morning Shacharit started at
> 4am and lasted 10 hours until 2pm. There was an hour break and the afternoon
> Mincha / Neilah service commenced at 3pm and continued 2 hours past the
> termination of the fast. He described it as the most intense outcry of
> teshuva that he has ever experienced. A total of some 21 hours of inner
> spiritual outpouring.
>
> Let us prepare ourselves for Hoshanah Rabbah in the year after the
> Shmittah( Sabbatical year).
>
> The last Hoshanah Rabbah of the previous Shmittah was in 2001 when the war
> in Afghanistan started. I will elaborate on this theme as time becomes
> available.
>
> The shofar has been blown.
>
> TESHUVA..... TESHUVA....TESHUVA!!!!!!!
>
> Shalom v'Ahavah
> JOE.* http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tdMXIZbksv4&feature=related
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
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From calbfordham at gmail.com  Sat Oct 11 13:24:06 2008
From: calbfordham at gmail.com (calb fordham)
Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2008 14:24:06 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Re: Succoth Conference Update - 10/03/08
In-Reply-To: <2708030cbdd71549a445861a531ac6e1@www.imsclients.com>
References: <2708030cbdd71549a445861a531ac6e1@www.imsclients.com>
Message-ID: <c599cad60810111124t18991bf4pda40cc3ebd67a9b6@mail.gmail.com>

We were SO looking forward to coming for Succoth but we have had a family
emergency and will be out of town for two weeks with Amber's Dad.  Please
forgive us and pray we can make it next year.  Amber's brother is having
trial for armed robbery, 2nd degree burglury, bodily injury, running from
the law, drugs, etc............please pray for him as well as Amber's Dad
whom he had been living with until jailed.  Amber's Dad had a heart attack
not long ago and we spent every weekend with him for 7 months.  Now his
blood pressure is up to hypertension level and Amber feels she needs to take
care of him again for a bit.  Amber's brother has put him through A LOT
these last few months!  Please ask everyone to pray.  Thanks for
understanding!  Can't wait to see everyone again!  Hope it is soon!  Chris
and Amber Fordham

Also, continue to pray for Amber's Mom, who has two more court cases coming
up for the DUI and Hit and Run.

On Sat, Oct 4, 2008 at 12:30 AM, Roots of Faith
<bulletin at rootsoffaith.org>wrote:

>  The Roots of Faith Congregation from Saint Francisville, Louisiana
> *presents*
> Succoth 08 with Arba 4
> a Biblical Teaching Conference held during the Ancient Festival of Succoth
> at the historic Temple Sinai Synagogue
>
> The Synagogue without walls!
>
> This conference has become an annual event hosted by Ross Nichols and the
> congregation of Roots of Faith. This year, the teachers from Arba4 will
> present their topics live over the web allowing people from around the world
> to be a part of the audience. If you cannot come to us, we hope to bring
> this event to you.
>
> ARBA4 is a web site that was organized to present multi-media teachings
> about the Bible, Judaism, Gentiles, Christianity, Non-Jews, Torah, Tanak,
> New Testament, Prophecy and Current Events. http://www.ARBA4.com
> <http://www.arba4.com/>currently features, Joseph & Debbie Good, Ross K
> Nichols and Dr. Walter Oakley.
>
> In addition to the more "formal" classes we have discussed having some
> informal, but facilitated conversations.
>
> We also hope to take a live call from our friend Dr. James D. Tabor at some
> point. James will be in Jerusalem during the conference and we hope to
> arrange for a quick greeting from him.
>
> A final version of the program will be posted soon, but here are the time
> slots so that you can begin to make plans to listen in live. This is
> tentative, but is getting close to final as far as the time slots go. As
> soon as the speakers send me their topics I will determine how to plug it
> all in and re-publish. All times are Central Time Zone.
>
> Friday, October 17th
> Welcome and Erev Shabbat Fellowship at Temple Sinai Synagogue - *6 P.M.
> until*
> Ross Nichols will welcome those in attendance and those who are listening
> in live over the Internet.
> Ross will introduce the speakers; Joe Good, Debbie Good, Walter Oakley.
> *Open Mic* - The microphones will now turn to those in attendance. We will
> take some time to allow people to share what brings them to this place in
> celebration of an ancient Hebrew Festival.
> *Live Music to follow until we depart for the campground.*
>
> Saturday, October 18th
>
> 9:30 - 10:00 / Meet and Greet
> 10:00 - 11:30 / First Class
> 2:00 - 3:30 / Second Class
> 4:00 - 6:00 / Third Class
> *Live Music to follow until we depart for the campground.
> *
> Sunday, October 19th
>
> 9:30 - 10:00 / Meet and Greet
> 10:00 - 11:30 / First Class
> 2:00 - 3:30 / Second Class
> *7:00 P.M. until - Ross Nichols Sunday Shul Class on Torah Portion
> Bereshith*
>
> All classes will be webcast live and posted as podcasts as soon as
> possible.
> Individual classes or a collection of the entire conference will be offered
> as a package at a later date. Proceeds to go to Arba4 to further the
> teaching and outreach of Torah Faith to the nations.
>
> We hope that many of you will be able to spend the weekend with us, but for
> those that cannot make the trip we hope that you will listen in live.
>
> We hope and intend to set some things up that will allow you to interact
> with the speakers and those in attendance, via phone and internet - but
> details are still in the works.
>
> If you are coming to the conference and have not yet signed up on my
> website, please do so. We are getting close and I will be sending out more
> regular updates as we draw closer to the conference.
>
> If you have questions or concerns, please email me at rndavar at aol.com.
>
> Shabbat Shalom, Ross
>
> Ross K. Nichols
> www.RootsofFaith.org <http://www.rootsoffaith.org/>
>
>
> Click here to unsubscribe<http://www.imsclients.com/listmail/unsubscribe.php?M=29032&N=232&L=11&C=7f3a070e03da9e75ff738084aa750ff2>
>
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From RNDAVAR at aol.com  Sun Oct 12 00:17:35 2008
From: RNDAVAR at aol.com (RNDAVAR at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 01:17:35 EDT
Subject: [Dialogue] Succoth Program
Message-ID: <bcf.39d480b5.3622e26f@aol.com>

As promised, I am sending out the program for our upcoming Succoth  
Conference to be held at the synagogue October 17-19.
 
You will be able to listen in live.  All times are central.   I still hope 
that some of you will be able to attend.
 
I am getting excited about camping under the stars. John and Glenn checked  
out the camp site and have the keys in their possession I believe.
 
I have to work Monday, but will begin setting up camp on Tuesday.
 
Just a reminder...there will be no Sunday Shul this Sunday night as we will  
be making final preparations at the synagogue for our guests.
 
Shalom, Ross
 
Ross K.  Nichols 
_www.RootsofFaith.org_ (http://www.rootsoffaith.org/) 


**************New MapQuest Local shows what's happening at your destination.  
Dining, Movies, Events, News & more. Try it out 
(http://local.mapquest.com/?ncid=emlcntnew00000002)
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Sun Oct 12 09:43:57 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 00:43:57 +1000
Subject: [Dialogue] HOSHANA RABBA.
Message-ID: <48F20D2D.8000306@westnet.com.au>

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From eliasaph at uniteourheart.com  Sun Oct 12 10:08:10 2008
From: eliasaph at uniteourheart.com (Steve Mathe)
Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 08:08:10 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] Rabbi Greenbaum's class is on
Message-ID: <200810121508.m9CF86TU020386@mail208c25.carrierzone.com>

Hi Gang,

Just an note that R. Greenbaum's class live form Jerusalem is on now, 
at 8:00 AM Pacific time at http://www.azamra.org.  See you in the chat room.
Don't forget to join the Chaverim network too.

Steve



From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sun Oct 12 11:09:13 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 12:09:13 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] HOSHANA RABBA.
In-Reply-To: <48F20D2D.8000306@westnet.com.au>
References: <48F20D2D.8000306@westnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <855590370810120909i727c4d0cg7a55e61976a00acc@mail.gmail.com>

Wow Joe, what an amazing post...toda, achi -- great stuff!!

          B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,
              * Hanoch
*
On Sun, Oct 12, 2008 at 10:43 AM, JOE INDOMENICO <jid at westnet.com.au> wrote:

> *Shalom Chaverim,
>
> in my last post I mentioned Hoshana Rabba or the 7th day of Succot.
>
> For those of Christian background, Yeshua did not enter Yersuhalayim on the
> donkey on Palm Sunday just before Pesach as has been traditionally taught by
> the Church. In actuality, all the imagery points to the Festival of Succot.
> Hoshana means "save us now" The crowds were waving palm branches again
> pointing to the lulavs that are still waved by observant Jews to this very
> day in synagogues around the world. Another example of Christian error due
> to their lack of Torah knowledge and adherence to the festivals.
> Interpolation gone mad.
>
> So what is so significant about this 7th day of Succot or Hoshana Rabah -
> "The GREAT save us now"?
> The messianic hope of salvation "when all is lost", has been deeply
> entrenched in the Jewish psyche for the past 2500 years of gentile dominion
> over HaShem's people. The prophets spoke of the establishment of the
> "Malchut Shamayim" or the Kingdom of Heaven at the end of days. The main
> catalyst that would ignite this promised outcome would be Teshuva or the
> wholesale return to HaShem. It is intriguing that the Festival of Succot or
> the final ingathering harvest before the winter is preceded by Rosh HaShana
> and Yom Kippur , both of which are characterized by the main theme of
> Teshuva.
>
> The Rabbis teach that the month of Elul triggers the 30 day process of
> personal introspection and Teshuva. This culminates with the blasting of the
> Shofar at Rosh HaShana when the world is judged and the final 10 day
> countdown to Yom Kippur when the verdict is handed down at the Neilah
> (closing of the gates of repentance) service at the conclusion of the Day of
> Awe. This however is not the end of the matter. According to the Rabbis
> there is still a small window of merciful hope available until the sentence
> is executed. Let us say "a last minute reprieve" or an act of Divine
> Clemency .
>
> So summing up...
> ELUL ------------------------ TESHUVA.
> ROSH HASHANA---------- JUDGEMENT- SIGNED
> YOM KIPPUR --------------VERDICT -SEALED
> HOSHANA RABAH ------- SENTENCING-DELIVERED.
>
> According to the writings of the Vilna Gaon, zs'l, a sign of the Gog uMagog
> war is its breaking out on the Jewish holiday of Hoshana Rabba (the 7th day
> of the Sukkot holiday), just after the conclusion of the 7th or shmitah[agricultural sabbatical] year.
>
> The Mazishov Admor ?????"? ???'???? zs'l explains that when Moshe Rabbenu
> zs'l asked HaShem (Parshat Shemot) "??? ?? ??? ????" "Please send by the
> hand that You will send". (send someone else to Paroah). The word ??
> (please) in Gematria is 51. The Admor said 200 hundred years ago, that this
> is a clear indication that Gog uMagog will begin Hoshana Raba, 51 days after
> Rosh Chodesh Elul.
>
> The Saintly Rav Kaduri, zs'l, also said that the seven years of Gog uMagog
> begun on Hoshana Rabbah (the seventh day of the Feast of Booths) in the
> first year of a shmittah cycle, 2001, and would conclude at the end of the
> next Shmittah cycle, 5769. He said that it would be the year of the war.
> Yehoshua Meiri, explained Rabbi Kaduri's understanding of the events based
> on the calculations of the Vilna Gaon: "On Hashanah Rabba, the actual war of
> Gog and Magog will commence and will last for seven years," said Meiri.
>
> On Hoshana Raba, Divine Judgement is excuted, as it says; "...On the 7th
> day of the Succot Holiday; i.e: Hoshana Raba, the judgement of the nations
> of the world is finalized. Sentences are issued from the residence of the
> King. Judgements are aroused and executed on that day." (Zohar Vayikra 31b).
>
> The actual war of Gog uMagog started in Afghanistan, precise to the minute,
> at 9:30 p.m. on the night of Hoshana Rabba, 5761-2001, the time when the
> final judgment on the nations of the world is sealed and execution begins.
>
> It is also worth noting that it was exactly 26 days from the WTC attack to
> Hoshana Rabba. The number 26 is an allusion to Whom is making the judgment.
> The judgment is coming from Hashem directly (the numerical value of HaShem's
> name is 26).
>
> During the past 7 years since the WTC attack we have seen the judgment of
> the nations from Bali to Madrid and London, from Hurricane Katrina to  the
> Tsunami, from the earthquakes in Pakistan and China to the cyclone in
> Myanmar and lately to the Hurricanes Gustav and Ike, of which some of you
> experienced.
>
> I have recently written on Katrina and Gustav and their relationship to the
> Gerush or the Disengagement from the land HaShem bequeathed to Yisrael. At
> the time I was experiencing computer problems and was not able to elucidate
> my inner thoughts.  I would now like to concentrate on the phenomena of Ike
> and what I believe it behooves.
>
> As many of you know the path of destruction that Hurricane Ike carved
> through southern and central USA was in the shape of a shofar.
>
>  *
>
> *Whilst I was contemplating about this storm , all my thoughts were
> engrossed by the word "Ichavod" for Ike.
>
> Ichavod in Hebrew means inglorious or the glory has departed. This is a
> corruption of the name "Yocheved"( Moshe's Mother) which means the Glory of
> HaShem.
>
> Read :1 Samuel 4 where the ark was taken from Shiloh by Eli's sons Hofni
> and Pinchas into battle against the Philistines. The ark was captured and
> taken into temple of Dagon . The wife of Pinchas was pregnant and when she
> was going through the birth pangs she heard the news of the ark's capture,
> the death of Eli her father in-law from a broken neck and the death of her
> husband Pinchas and his brother Hofni. She also died during childbirth
> naming her baby son "Ichavod". Now the sons of Eli the priest in Shiloh ,
> Hofni and Pinchas did great evil in the eyes of  HaShem.
>
> Dagon was the fish god but was also attributed with the lordship over grain
> and agriculture. Agriculture was the economic and financial engine room of
> the ancient world.
>
> During the first night of the ark's placement in the temple of Dagon , the
> statue of Dagon fell on its face before the ark. In the morning the
> Philistines set the statue in its place. During the second night stay, the
> statue toppled again before the ark with head of Dagon and both the palms of
> its hands  cut off at the threshold with only the trunk of the statue
> remaining.
>
> HaShem then smote the Philistines throughout their 5 divisions with tumors.
> To cut the story short, in the end the ark was returned to the Yisraelites.
>
> Putting all the above into context, this is my conclusion:
>
> The sons of Eli did evil in the sight of HaShem by laying with the women
> that served at the doorway to the tent of meeting at Shiloh. The sons also
> extorted the people and had little regard for the sacrifices to HaShem
> showing despize.
> The sons were also guilty of fleecing the flock to aggrandize their own
> glory. Eli was guilty of favouring his sons to the desecration of HaShem's
> honour.
>
> HaShem allowed His ark to be captured  in order to punish Yisrael's
> presumptuous folly and arrogance whilst being engrossed in spiritual
> impurity and sin. At the same time he would punish the Philistines and their
> fish god Dagon for taking His ark into their temple.
>
> Now the god of the Christianized Western Civilization in the physical sense
> is Mammon or the $$$$, similar to the god of grain and agriculture of the
> ancient world. Little did I realize at the time how prophetic Hurricane
> Ichavod was in terms of the demise of the American economy and the rest of
> the world. They keep trying to prop up the economy but it keeps on crashing.Three
> years after Katrina  the people of New Orleans** are still struggling. I
> am sure that the victims of Hurricane Ike are still battling. However it is
> quite amazing how they quickly pulled out 700 billion dollars to bail out
> the loan sharks , the financial institutions and the insurance companies.
> This will be for another post.
>
> The god of the Christianized Western civilization in the spiritual sense is
> the fish god ICHTYS.
>  IOTA------------ IESOUS---------- JESUS
> CHI---------------CHRISTOS------ CHRIST
> THETA---------- THEOU---------- GOD
> UPSILON------- HUIOS----------- SON
> SIGMA---------- SOTER----------- SAVIOUR.
>
> This man made statue will keep on toppling until its eventual demise.
> Beware the plagues of HaShem !!!!
> The ark of the covenant that belongs to HaShem and is the inheritance of
> Yisrael is going home to where it belongs.
> Trying to figure out what the two milch cows that return the ark to the
> Yisraelites represent.
> Feel free to add your 2 bobs, dimes or shekels worth.
>
> Footnote for you to ponder:
> Yeshua said that he would only give the elders the sign of Yonah.
>
> In the days of the prophet Eliyahu a severe famine befell Eretz Yisrael,
> and the prophet was commanded to travel to Tzorfat, a city in the kingdom of
> Tzidon, north of Eretz Yisrael. There a Jewish widow sustained him. That
> widow actually shared her last morsel of food with Eliyahu. In this merit
> when her young son later died, the prophet Eliyahu was granted the
> miraculous power to resurrect him.
> According to the Midrash, this young boy was none other than Yonah. Yonah
> later became a disciple of Eliyahu , and in time , a prophet himself. The
> first time Yonah received the spirit of prophecy was while he attended the
> annual festivities of the water drawing in the temple during Succot. (
> remember John Chap 7 - read it).
>
> I find it interesting to read the prayer of Yonah whilst in the belly of
> the big fish.
>
>  Have we now entered the final stage?
> The date of Hoshana Raba 5769 is 21 Tishrei, October 20, 2008, in 7 days...
>
> Shalom v'Ahavah
> JOE.
> **
> *
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
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From patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com  Sun Oct 12 12:32:43 2008
From: patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com (Pat Robbins)
Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 13:32:43 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] HOSHANA RABBA.
In-Reply-To: <48F20D2D.8000306@westnet.com.au>
	<855590370810120909i727c4d0cg7a55e61976a00acc@mail.gmail.com>
References: <48F20D2D.8000306@westnet.com.au>
	<855590370810120909i727c4d0cg7a55e61976a00acc@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BLU125-DS26EF2BACBF5F36E3EFD06BA370@phx.gbl>

Yes, Joe!!!  Thank you so much for these wonderful incites you have shared with us!!!!

Love,

Pat


From: Hanoch Young 
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2008 12:09 PM
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
Subject: Re: [Dialogue] HOSHANA RABBA.


Wow Joe, what an amazing post...toda, achi -- great stuff!!

          B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,
               Hanoch


On Sun, Oct 12, 2008 at 10:43 AM, JOE INDOMENICO <jid at westnet.com.au> wrote:

  Shalom Chaverim,

  in my last post I mentioned Hoshana Rabba or the 7th day of Succot.

  For those of Christian background, Yeshua did not enter Yersuhalayim on the donkey on Palm Sunday just before Pesach as has been traditionally taught by the Church. In actuality, all the imagery points to the Festival of Succot. Hoshana means "save us now" The crowds were waving palm branches again pointing to the lulavs that are still waved by observant Jews to this very day in synagogues around the world. Another example of Christian error due to their lack of Torah knowledge and adherence to the festivals. Interpolation gone mad.

  So what is so significant about this 7th day of Succot or Hoshana Rabah - "The GREAT save us now"?
  The messianic hope of salvation "when all is lost", has been deeply entrenched in the Jewish psyche for the past 2500 years of gentile dominion over HaShem's people. The prophets spoke of the establishment of the "Malchut Shamayim" or the Kingdom of Heaven at the end of days. The main catalyst that would ignite this promised outcome would be Teshuva or the wholesale return to HaShem. It is intriguing that the Festival of Succot or the final ingathering harvest before the winter is preceded by Rosh HaShana and Yom Kippur , both of which are characterized by the main theme of Teshuva.

  The Rabbis teach that the month of Elul triggers the 30 day process of personal introspection and Teshuva. This culminates with the blasting of the Shofar at Rosh HaShana when the world is judged and the final 10 day countdown to Yom Kippur when the verdict is handed down at the Neilah (closing of the gates of repentance) service at the conclusion of the Day of Awe. This however is not the end of the matter. According to the Rabbis there is still a small window of merciful hope available until the sentence is executed. Let us say "a last minute reprieve" or an act of Divine Clemency .

  So summing up...
  ELUL ------------------------ TESHUVA.
  ROSH HASHANA---------- JUDGEMENT- SIGNED
  YOM KIPPUR --------------VERDICT -SEALED
  HOSHANA RABAH ------- SENTENCING-DELIVERED.

  According to the writings of the Vilna Gaon, zs'l, a sign of the Gog uMagog war is its breaking out on the Jewish holiday of Hoshana Rabba (the 7th day of the Sukkot holiday), just after the conclusion of the 7th or shmitah [agricultural sabbatical] year.

  The Mazishov Admor ?????"? ???'???? zs'l explains that when Moshe Rabbenu zs'l asked HaShem (Parshat Shemot) "??? ?? ??? ????" "Please send by the hand that You will send". (send someone else to Paroah). The word ?? (please) in Gematria is 51. The Admor said 200 hundred years ago, that this is a clear indication that Gog uMagog will begin Hoshana Raba, 51 days after Rosh Chodesh Elul.

  The Saintly Rav Kaduri, zs'l, also said that the seven years of Gog uMagog begun on Hoshana Rabbah (the seventh day of the Feast of Booths) in the first year of a shmittah cycle, 2001, and would conclude at the end of the next Shmittah cycle, 5769. He said that it would be the year of the war. Yehoshua Meiri, explained Rabbi Kaduri's understanding of the events based on the calculations of the Vilna Gaon: "On Hashanah Rabba, the actual war of Gog and Magog will commence and will last for seven years," said Meiri.

  On Hoshana Raba, Divine Judgement is excuted, as it says; "...On the 7th day of the Succot Holiday; i.e: Hoshana Raba, the judgement of the nations of the world is finalized. Sentences are issued from the residence of the King. Judgements are aroused and executed on that day." (Zohar Vayikra 31b).

  The actual war of Gog uMagog started in Afghanistan, precise to the minute, at 9:30 p.m. on the night of Hoshana Rabba, 5761-2001, the time when the final judgment on the nations of the world is sealed and execution begins.

  It is also worth noting that it was exactly 26 days from the WTC attack to Hoshana Rabba. The number 26 is an allusion to Whom is making the judgment. The judgment is coming from Hashem directly (the numerical value of HaShem's name is 26).

  During the past 7 years since the WTC attack we have seen the judgment of the nations from Bali to Madrid and London, from Hurricane Katrina to  the Tsunami, from the earthquakes in Pakistan and China to the cyclone in Myanmar and lately to the Hurricanes Gustav and Ike, of which some of you experienced. 

  I have recently written on Katrina and Gustav and their relationship to the Gerush or the Disengagement from the land HaShem bequeathed to Yisrael. At the time I was experiencing computer problems and was not able to elucidate my inner thoughts.  I would now like to concentrate on the phenomena of Ike and what I believe it behooves.

  As many of you know the path of destruction that Hurricane Ike carved through southern and central USA was in the shape of a shofar.

   

  Whilst I was contemplating about this storm , all my thoughts were engrossed by the word "Ichavod" for Ike. 

  Ichavod in Hebrew means inglorious or the glory has departed. This is a corruption of the name "Yocheved"( Moshe's Mother) which means the Glory of HaShem.

  Read :1 Samuel 4 where the ark was taken from Shiloh by Eli's sons Hofni and Pinchas into battle against the Philistines. The ark was captured and taken into temple of Dagon . The wife of Pinchas was pregnant and when she was going through the birth pangs she heard the news of the ark's capture, the death of Eli her father in-law from a broken neck and the death of her husband Pinchas and his brother Hofni. She also died during childbirth naming her baby son "Ichavod". Now the sons of Eli the priest in Shiloh , Hofni and Pinchas did great evil in the eyes of  HaShem.

  Dagon was the fish god but was also attributed with the lordship over grain and agriculture. Agriculture was the economic and financial engine room of the ancient world.

  During the first night of the ark's placement in the temple of Dagon , the statue of Dagon fell on its face before the ark. In the morning the Philistines set the statue in its place. During the second night stay, the statue toppled again before the ark with head of Dagon and both the palms of its hands  cut off at the threshold with only the trunk of the statue remaining.

  HaShem then smote the Philistines throughout their 5 divisions with tumors. To cut the story short, in the end the ark was returned to the Yisraelites.

  Putting all the above into context, this is my conclusion:

  The sons of Eli did evil in the sight of HaShem by laying with the women that served at the doorway to the tent of meeting at Shiloh. The sons also extorted the people and had little regard for the sacrifices to HaShem showing despize.
  The sons were also guilty of fleecing the flock to aggrandize their own glory. Eli was guilty of favouring his sons to the desecration of HaShem's honour.

  HaShem allowed His ark to be captured  in order to punish Yisrael's  presumptuous folly and arrogance whilst being engrossed in spiritual impurity and sin. At the same time he would punish the Philistines and their fish god Dagon for taking His ark into their temple. 

  Now the god of the Christianized Western Civilization in the physical sense is Mammon or the $$$$, similar to the god of grain and agriculture of the ancient world. Little did I realize at the time how prophetic Hurricane Ichavod was in terms of the demise of the American economy and the rest of the world. They keep trying to prop up the economy but it keeps on crashing.Three years after Katrina  the people of New Orleans are still struggling. I am sure that the victims of Hurricane Ike are still battling. However it is quite amazing how they quickly pulled out 700 billion dollars to bail out the loan sharks , the financial institutions and the insurance companies. 
  This will be for another post.

  The god of the Christianized Western civilization in the spiritual sense is the fish god ICHTYS.
   IOTA------------ IESOUS---------- JESUS
  CHI---------------CHRISTOS------ CHRIST
  THETA---------- THEOU---------- GOD
  UPSILON------- HUIOS----------- SON
  SIGMA---------- SOTER----------- SAVIOUR.

  This man made statue will keep on toppling until its eventual demise. Beware the plagues of HaShem !!!!
  The ark of the covenant that belongs to HaShem and is the inheritance of Yisrael is going home to where it belongs.
  Trying to figure out what the two milch cows that return the ark to the Yisraelites represent. 
  Feel free to add your 2 bobs, dimes or shekels worth.

  Footnote for you to ponder:
  Yeshua said that he would only give the elders the sign of Yonah.

  In the days of the prophet Eliyahu a severe famine befell Eretz Yisrael, and the prophet was commanded to travel to Tzorfat, a city in the kingdom of Tzidon, north of Eretz Yisrael. There a Jewish widow sustained him. That widow actually shared her last morsel of food with Eliyahu. In this merit when her young son later died, the prophet Eliyahu was granted the miraculous power to resurrect him.
  According to the Midrash, this young boy was none other than Yonah. Yonah later became a disciple of Eliyahu , and in time , a prophet himself. The first time Yonah received the spirit of prophecy was while he attended the annual festivities of the water drawing in the temple during Succot. ( remember John Chap 7 - read it).

  I find it interesting to read the prayer of Yonah whilst in the belly of the big fish.

   Have we now entered the final stage?
  The date of Hoshana Raba 5769 is 21 Tishrei, October 20, 2008, in 7 days...

  Shalom v'Ahavah
  JOE.



  _______________________________________________






--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


_______________________________________________
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From youngbarzel at aol.com  Sun Oct 12 13:11:01 2008
From: youngbarzel at aol.com (youngbarzel at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 14:11:01 -0400
Subject: PRIVATE: [Dialogue] Rabbi Greenbaum's class is on
In-Reply-To: <200810121508.m9CF86TU020386@mail208c25.carrierzone.com>
References: <200810121508.m9CF86TU020386@mail208c25.carrierzone.com>
Message-ID: <8CAFAAD04E9EC62-1240-16FA@MBLK-M16.sysops.aol.com>

Hey Achi,

????????? I just had a chance to listen in for a few minutes - Rav Greenbaum is amazing...he truly is.? I had several 'strange' experiences while davening on Yom Kippur that I'd love to discuss with you.? I repeated your beautiful tefila 12 times over the course of Yom Kippur.? I got different 'surges' of thoughts and feelings - mostly related to what the Jewish people should be doing (for Israel, for Ephraimites, etc), and aren't - and a feeling that Ephraim IS being forgiven...I have no idea if any/all of this is real or just in my imagination.? But I FELT it.....

???????? Hope you had a meaningful Yom Kippur and my best wishes for a Chag Sameach Achi....

??????? B'Ahava,
????????????? Hanoch


-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Mathe <eliasaph at uniteourheart.com>
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
Sent: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 11:08 am
Subject: [Dialogue] Rabbi Greenbaum's class is on


Hi Gang,?
?
Just an note that R. Greenbaum's class live form Jerusalem is on now, at 8:00 AM Pacific time at http://www.azamra.org. See you in the chat room.?
Don't forget to join the Chaverim network too.?
?
Steve?
?
_______________________________________________?

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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sun Oct 12 13:14:05 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 14:14:05 -0400
Subject: PRIVATE: [Dialogue] Rabbi Greenbaum's class is on
In-Reply-To: <8CAFAAD04E9EC62-1240-16FA@MBLK-M16.sysops.aol.com>
References: <200810121508.m9CF86TU020386@mail208c25.carrierzone.com>
	<8CAFAAD04E9EC62-1240-16FA@MBLK-M16.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <855590370810121114h6e3be4f2u62cfe3ab114dca74@mail.gmail.com>

My apologies to all.....this was a private note, which I sent to the list my
mistake.  Sorry folks...

         *  Hanoch
*
On Sun, Oct 12, 2008 at 2:11 PM, <youngbarzel at aol.com> wrote:

> Hey Achi,
>
>           I just had a chance to listen in for a few minutes - Rav
> Greenbaum is amazing...he truly is.  I had several 'strange' experiences
> while davening on Yom Kippur that I'd love to discuss with you.  I repeated
> your beautiful tefila 12 times over the course of Yom Kippur.  I got
> different 'surges' of thoughts and feelings - mostly related to what the
> Jewish people should be doing (for Israel, for Ephraimites, etc), and aren't
> - and a feeling that Ephraim IS being forgiven...I have no idea if any/all
> of this is real or just in my imagination.  But I *FELT *it.....
>
>          Hope you had a meaningful Yom Kippur and my best wishes for a Chag
> Sameach Achi....
>
>         B'Ahava,
>               *Hanoch
> *
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Steve Mathe <eliasaph at uniteourheart.com>
> To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
> Sent: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 11:08 am
> Subject: [Dialogue] Rabbi Greenbaum's class is on
>
> Hi Gang,
>
> Just an note that R. Greenbaum's class live form Jerusalem is on now, at
> 8:00 AM Pacific time at http://www.azamra.org. See you in the chat room.
> Don't forget to join the Chaverim network too.
>
> Steve
>
> _______________________________________________
>  ------------------------------
>
> McCain or Obama? Stay updated on coverage of the Presidential race while
> you browse - Download Now!<http://toolbar.aol.com/elections/download.html?ncid=emlweusdown00000002>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sun Oct 12 15:43:43 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 16:43:43 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Insights on Sukkot
Message-ID: <855590370810121343j33ceae6ag3545ede8cc2a6e1a@mail.gmail.com>

  by Rabbi David Aaron, Founder and Dean of Isralight
<http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?e=0018SX6tEYTH-uXH88QIZPjSwtpkzu_IuXnojCj-4VTlmYH050kvwj_jOwgxi6T-nttYTa6Bn2YDy-cI7i3MVsYeMNB2Tyusy1CvVkJuOQD9dIMIfyuFzbVow==>


*Sukkot and Simchat Torah
Celebrating Wholeness, Spontaneity and Anticipation *

<http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?e=0018SX6tEYTH-sq_gkfDtjUuhk4-u3WGJfh_8xpSjohveIZfq6CwGi1ktUbu1HhBe5Mc-OYlPtwgrVYondNmChBoIHjm2xwbGfiqfrJouT5VYRki_7xt85S9431yj-Oq6tHg4OV9MGoRG16cJiX6zESBOZQ1v_c0EkT>



*Off to a Right Start*

The holiday of Sukkot reminds us of the huts of the Israelites as they
wandered for forty years in the desert after their miraculous Exodus from
Egypt . It would stand to reason, then, that Sukkot should be celebrated
right after the holiday of Passover. However, the Talmudic sages explain
that since Passover is in the spring, living in the *sukkah* would not be
anything special. It is common to be outside during the warm months of the
year. After Yom Kippur, however, when it starts to get cold, people
generally take shelter inside. We go outside, only because G-d commands us
to do so.

Leaving our homes precisely when we are not naturally inclined to do so,
internalizes one of the important lessons of Sukkot-G-d is our only true
shelter, and we must trust in Him. We often transgress the will of G-d,
because we mistakenly think we know what is best for us, rather than
trusting in G-d. This was the mistake that Adam and Eve made when they ate
of the forbidden fruit. They thought they knew better than G-d as to what
would best serve their interests and accomplish their life goals.

Trusting G-d is a vital truth to internalize especially after the High
Holiday season, just before we return to the challenges of our everyday
lives.

There is another advantage to celebrating Sukkot at the start of autumn
rather than after Passover in the spring. Autumn is the season of the
harvest, which is the time when we are subject to the tricks of the ego. It
is too easy-after reaping the fruits of our labor-to take pride in our
accomplishment. Pride and ego make for fertile ground in which the seeds of
evil can grow; they were two reasons why Adam and Eve disobeyed the will of
G-d. Sensing the G-dliness within themselves, they aspired to become all-
powerful and all-knowing, just like G-d. Therefore, they were easily seduced
by the snake's claim that the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge would empower
them to become G-ds and allow them to determine for themselves what is good
or bad.

Therefore, on Sukkot, as we step into the new year, we protect ourselves
from returning to our wrongdoings of the past year by embracing the message
of the *sukkah*-in G-d we trust and before Him we are humbled.

*Inner Peace*

In addition to living in the *sukkah* and waving the four species, it is
customary on Sukkot to read the Book of Ecclesiastes written by King
Solomon. The Talmudic sages tell us that King Solomon was inspired to write
this book when he realized that the Temple that he built would be destroyed
in the future. Lamenting over that excruciating truth he wrote, "Futility of
futilities, of what worth is the work of man under the sun."

It seems odd to read this apparently depressing book on the holiday of
happiness. However, King Solomon's brutal confrontation with the transience
of life and our temporary accomplishments on earth actually reveals the key
to true happiness and security. He concludes, "In the end, obey the word of
G-d and do His bidding, because this is everything."

Sukkot teaches us how to find security and permanence in what seems
transient. We embrace the perishable four species and dwell in a make-shift
hut covered with biodegradable materials, as we acknowledge that happiness
and security are not based on what we possess but who we are in relationship
to G-d. When we serve G-d here and now, we infuse the finite world with
infinite meaning and connect the fleeting moment to eternity.

When you understand this truth, we will never be in a rush to get to some
other place and get to some future time, because you realize that the joy of
life is to serve G-d and there is no better time than now, and no better
place then here-so what's the rush? If not now, when?

We often do wrong and sacrifice our integrity in the present, because we are
anxious to secure our future. Sukkot, however, teaches us that we can find
security even in the temporal and transient when we focus our attention on
serving G-d here and now.

Adam and Eve also transgressed because they were impatient. They intuited
that eating the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Bad was essential
to fulfilling their purpose on earth. And they were right, but their timing
was wrong. According to the Kabbalah, G-d wanted them to eat from the Tree
of Knowledge of Good and Bad, but not then. The right time to do it would
have been on Shabbat. Had they patiently waited, trusted G-d and ate the
fruit as a humble service to Him-rather than as a rebellious act in defiance
of Him-they would have accomplished their ultimate goals. They would have
actualized their G-dliness by experiencing G-d's love and their oneness with
G-d.

Sukkot sets us off on the right foot into the new year by teaching us how to
protect ourselves from sadness and evil: trust in G-d, humble yourself
before Him and only concern yourself with fulfilling His commandments-here
and now.

*The Circle of Love*

Each morning of Sukkot, near the end of the festive prayer service, we carry
our four species, marching in a circle around the cantor (the leader of the
service), who holds a Sefer Torah, the Torah scroll.

On the last day of Sukkot, which is referred to as Hoshanah Rabah, we
encircle the Torah seven times. This number is reminiscent of the seven
times the Israelites circled the city of Jericho and the walls came tumbling
down. But the day after Hoshanah Rabah- when we celebrate the holiday of
Shemini Atzeret also called Simchat Torah-we dance in a circle around an
empty space hugging the Torah in our arms. Why?

During the seven days of Sukkot, when we circle the Torah, we remind
ourselves that Torah must be the center of our lives. If we are
self-centered, we cannot love others nor can we love G-d. To achieve true
love, we need to move ourselves out of the center and put the Torah-which
contains the will and wisdom of G-d-in the center.

Some people, however, claim that the laws of the Torah are actually
obstacles to achieving true love. They argue that the rituals, formalities
and minutiae of Torah law, interfere with experiencing a warm, personal,
individual, spontaneous and loving relationship with G-d and other people.
They believe that the commandments build walls not bridges.

This is never true as long as we remember that the laws of the Torah are the
will of G-d and express what G-d asks of us. True love means doing for your
beloved what he or she asks of you-not what you feel like doing even though
it is against his or her wishes.

But, even when you understand this basic truth, the commandments could
interfere with your loving relationship to G-d if you perform them
mindlessly. The richness of ritual depends on the measure of intention you
invest in it. Imagine that you decide to tell your beloved three times a day
that you love her. If you don't mean it at all but simply repeat like a
parrot, "I love you," then this mindless routine will become obstructive and
destructive to your love.

This is a danger only when we consider the commandments of G-d to be
peripheral of our daily lives. However, when we put the Torah in the center
of our lives and acknowledge that it is the axis upon which our lives
revolve then, over time, the Torah will actually break down the walls that
divide us and separate us from G-d. This was the message that G-d
communicated to us through the Prophet Isaiah, "It is only your wrongdoings
that separate you from Me." The Torah and its commandments, however, break
the barriers that divide us and build bonds of love.

After we succeed in making the Torah the center of our lives during Sukkot,
and the wall and barriers to love are broken down, then we celebrate the
holiday of Simchat Torah by dancing with the Torah around an empty space.

Of course, we know that there is no such thing as an empty space because
G-d's presence fills the earth- there is no place void of G-d's presence. On
Simchat Torah, we acknowledge that putting the Torah in the center of our
lives empowers us to find the true center, core and soul of our lives-G-d.

The celebrations of Sukkot and Simchat Torah prepare us to dance our way
into the upcoming year in a circle of love, embracing the natural, holding
the hand of our fellow Jew, hugging the Torah and feeling close to G-d. And
we experience all this in the very midst of our everyday lives in this
transient world.

*Rain, Rain Come Again*

Each day during the Sukkot prayer service, when we march around in a circle,
we pray that the New Year be blessed with rain. This is also an appropriate
way to celebrate our renewed relationship with G-d. What makes the prayer
for rain so special?

In Jewish tradition, G-d is described metaphorically, as desiring-and even
needing-our prayers. The Book of Genesis describes how, in the process of
creation, G-d had not sent rain which would cause vegetation to grow,
because there were no one to work the field. The Midrash explains that there
was no human being to recognize the goodness of rain and thus pray for it.
In other words, G-d needed a human being to want rain and ask for it, before
He could send it pouring down. This story captures the meaning of prayer,
the power of humanity and the nature of our relationship to G-d.

Even something as fundamental to life as rain, which seems programmed into
the nature of the universe, needs our prayers. Why? Because G-d cannot pour
blessings upon us until we want to receive those blessings.

For example, our will for health is the receptacle to receive the blessings
of well-being. Our will for livelihood is the receptacle to receive the
blessings of prosperity.

Prayer is not a passive supplication to G-d for help. Prayer is a powerful
force. Through prayer we make things happen, because we want them to happen,
and G-d, so to speak, is waiting to hear what we want. Prayer taps us into
the motor of our lives-will power. On Sukkot, as we prepare ourselves for
the adventures and challenges of the upcoming year, we need to exercise our
basic right to the power of prayer. And we need to realize that if rain
needs our prayers, all the more so does everything else in our lives.

On the last day of Sukkot, Hoshanah Rabah, after we complete the seventh
circle in our march, we put down the four species and take five separate
willow branches. We then recite more prayers for rain and sustenance, and we
hit the ground five times with the willows. As mentioned earlier, the willow
has no taste or fragrance and, therefore, represents a person who is
unlearned in Torah and does no good deeds. The message of this custom is
this: by the end of Sukkot we realize that even if we are unworthy of G-d's
favor, bereft of Torah and good deeds, His love for us is unconditional and
He will take care of us. All we have to do is ask.

Now, I bet you are wondering, "What about the beating of the willows against
the ground five times? What is that all about?"

This was a custom not found in the Torah but instituted by the prophets.
Tradition tells us that this custom is filled with much mystical meaning but
these secrets are known only to the greatest of sages. I would suggest that
topping off our Sukkot celebration in this mystical manner also teaches us
an essential lesson, necessary to carry with us into the year. After all the
explanations for the meaning behind Judaism, whether you understand the will
of G-d or not--Just Do It!

*Building the Sukkah of Faith*

When we take a bird's eye view of the holidays that inaugurate the New Year,
we see a collection of diverse images of G-d.

The predominant image of G-d on Rosh Hashanah is as King and Judge who is
writing us into a cosmic Book of Life and Death. On Yom Kippur, we encounter
G-d as a compassionate forgiving Father. Sukkot features G-d as a Lover, and
we feel close to Him and hugged by Him. And on Simchat Torah, we reach the
height of intimacy and complete union with G-d. What are we to do with all
this imagery? Are we really supposed to believe all this?

Surely all these images are only metaphors for a higher divine truth that is
beyond spoken words and conceptual images. We can only know the Divine truth
experientially. Anyone who believes that G-d is literally a King, Judge,
Father or Lover is making graven images of G-d and committing spiritual
idolatry.

What then is the meaning and value of all these metaphors?

According to Kabbalah, these conceptual metaphors are vehicles to access the
transcendental truth of G-d. These are the metaphors that can take us to the
threshold of the immediate and direct experience of G-d that is beyond all
words and concepts. Any other metaphors wouldn't even get us close to the
truth.

Our task and goal on these holy days, is to use these metaphors of King,
Father and Lover towards building our consciousness and awareness of G-d, so
that we can receive and experience G-d's guiding power, forgiveness and
love.

With every word of prayer and every detail of the holiday rituals, we are
constructing the necessary channels to bring the Divine truth into our life.
Think of these metaphors as the code number to a great combination lock. The
Torah gives us the right combination of metaphors necessary to unlock the
vault and get to the real treasure of Divine truth.

We need to believe that G-d is like a King and Judge, who stands over us and
judges us on Rosh Hashanah. We then need to believe that G-d is also like a
forgiving Father, who picks us up, supports us and forgives us on Yom
Kippur. And on Sukkot, we need to believe that G-d is like our Lover, close
to us, holding us in His loving embrace. All these images in combination
unlock the door to our intimate communion with G-d on Simchat Torah.

This is the true meaning and power of faith. Faith is not a collection of
ideas that we adopt. It is an orientation to life and to the Source of all
life-G-d. Faith is a way of seeing. Unlike the popular saying "Seeing is
believing"-the Kabbalah teaches, "Believing is seeing." In other words, the
greater our faith is in G-d, the more G-d can become manifest in our lives.
The more we believe that G-d is like a King, the more Divine power and
guidance can enter in to our lives. The more we believe that G-d is like a
compassionate Father, the more compassion and forgiveness can become
manifest in our lives. And the more we believe that G-d is like a Lover, the
more Divine love, intimacy and oneness can fill our lives.

Our major life's work is to build-with proper ideas, words and actions-a *
sukkah* of faith, a perceptual dwelling that we can take with us even in the
desert- like barren times of our lives.

The more we believe in G-d's guidance, forgiveness and love, the more we can
receive them.

*Anticipation *

The mood throughout Sukkot can be best described as the joy of anticipation
for the ultimate. Each day of the seven-day festival brings us closer to
complete intimacy with G-d, which we finally experience on Simchat Torah.

On Simchat Torah, we celebrate finishing the yearly cycle of Torah readings
and start over again from Genesis. On this great day, we dance with the
Torah in the most joyous display of affection.

While Simchat Torah is the ultimate realization of our connection with G-d,
the sense of anticipation of this union that we feel during Sukkot is even
more thrilling than the joy we actually feel on this day.

As counterintuitive as it may seem, in this and other instances, we find
that Judaism puts anticipation ahead of realization. The Midrash teaches,
for example, that when we finally get to the World to Come the angels will
ask us whether we anticipated the redemption. This is because the
anticipation for the redemption itself is considered the greatest joy.

Another example of the weight the Talmudic sages put on the joy of
anticipation can be seen in the Simchat Beit HaShoeva ceremony. This ancient
ceremony of drawing water from the earth and pouring it on the altar was the
highlight of Sukkot celebrations in Temple times. Interestingly, the sages
describe the festivities surrounding the drawing of the water for the
ceremony as the time of ultimate joy even though it was only the preparation
for pouring of the water on the altar. The anticipation of doing the mitzvah
was actually experienced as greater than the fulfillment of the actual
mitzvah. The Simchat Beit HaShoeva also expressed the joy of anticipation of
the ultimate experience of oneness with G-d that was achieved on the final
day of celebrations-on Simchat Torah, when the celebrants embraced the Torah
(which is referred metaphorically as water since its teachings are as
fundamental to life as water).

When we think about it, we see this dynamic at work in other aspects of
life. Very often people feel that their wedding was not as joyous as their
anticipation of the wedding. The best part is the planning and the dreaming,
the talking about it, the choosing of the dress, the flowers, etc. The
wedding itself can be a blur. People claim I was at my wedding; there are
photographs to prove it, but I really was not there. I remember getting out
of the taxi, and then I was gone. I was too overwhelmed to be mentally
present.

In our thinking and dreaming and hoping and planning, we feel incredible
joy. But afterward, we often find ourselves saying, "It could have been a
little more this, a little more that...."

This is one of the reasons why the water drawing ceremony-Simchat Beit
HaShoeva-was the height of joy, because it stimulated our anticipation of
achieving complete intimacy with G-d on Simchat Torah.

The Talmud teaches that G-d gave Himself to us in writing. In other words,
the Torah embodies the presence of G-d. When we dance on Simchat Torah
hugging the Torah, it is as if we are dancing and hugging G-d. And since the
Torah is the will and wisdom of G-d when we learn the Torah we are
completely one with G-d.

*Rabbi David Aaron
Author of Endless Light, Seeing G-d, The Secret Life of G-d, Inviting
G-d Inand Living
A Joyous Life*
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sun Oct 12 15:48:55 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 16:48:55 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Rav Binny on Sukkot
Message-ID: <855590370810121348h73cd6c63v1912e04496e7d3c9@mail.gmail.com>

  Small Tastings of Torah, Judaism and Spirituality
by Rav Binny Freedman, Director


*Sukkot*
<http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?e=0018SX6tEYTH-tCtoCN8owdg8sjdXL141jGQEmw3kiSva2kverCOrZVlS7CDvRggTG919Lfg-dYxEJp2WO46n4OqCFhw0dIH2J7mwC05l16PlC-0BttOLjs4KYGQbzh9m_XpICwUiqfQVVPvIzIUqy6yDJGZTaNgzN4>



 *A number of years ago, I met a wealthy businessman named Yaakov (not his
real name...) from Caracas who was spending Pesach with his family at a
hotel in Florida. Over the course of the festival, we struck up a
friendship, and I discovered he was a Holocaust survivor who had been first
in the Janowska road camp and later in Auschwitz. Towards the end of the
week I summoned up the nerve to ask him if there was anything in particular
that stood out in his mind as the reason he had survived. Without
hesitation, he responded: "It was one mitzvah; the sukkos (festival holiday
of Sukkoth, the feast of the tabernacles.) I spent in Auschwitz.

I guess my face must have registered surprise, because he immediately
explained. When he arrived in Auschwitz in the middle of his thirteenth
winter, one of the Kapos (barracks captains, often even more cruel than the
Nazis... ) took a liking to him and arranged for him to be in charge of the
daily rations to be given out to the prisoners at the end of the day. It was
a job that would save his life. He spent the days in a small shed attached
to the large barracks, responsible for dividing up the bread and soup to be
given out to each inmate at the end of the day. In addition to having access
to food he was also often put into difficult situations having to respond to
prisoners desperate for food....

One day, while preparing the rations in the dark winter night, he heard
banging on the door of the shed, and opened it up to discover a man he knew
to be a great Torah scholar and one of the eminent Rabbis of his area before
the war, standing in the snow.

Before he could turn the man away (sure that he wanted scraps of bread), the
man stepped into the shed, telling Yaakov he needed a favor.

"You know tonight is the first night of the festival of Sukkos, and I need
two whole loaves of bread before you cut them up... so I can fulfill the
special custom of making the ("Hamotzi'") blessing over two whole loaves
(known as Lechem Mishnah...) in the sukkah."

"I was in shock", recalled Yaakov, at the request. Not only was he asking
for two whole loaves of bread, but he was even planning somehow on
fulfilling the mitzvah of having a 'meal' in the Sukkah!"

"You have to understand", he explained, a whole loaf of bread in Auschwitz
was like a million dollars today. Can you imagine someone walking in off the
street and asking for a million dollars? Even though he promised he would
only take a bite, (the equivalent of his own ration) and then return the
loaves to me, giving away those loaves would effectively mean I was risking
my life."

Even more intriguing however, was how on earth this Rabbi had managed to
build a sukkah (a booth built to specific halachic specifications...) in
Auschwitz- Birkenau.

As it turned out, that summer and fall of 1944 the Nazis were bringing
hundreds of thousands of Jews (including the remaining 400,000 Jews of
Hungary) in a last-ditch effort to complete the 'final solution' before the
war would end.

In the twisted organizational logic of the lager camps world, the Nazis
needed to have additional barracks to hold the new prisoners for labor until
they could be exterminated. As such, prisoners were dismantling tiers of
bunks in the barracks (prisoners there literally began sleeping in piles of
bodies on the floor of the barracks) while rows of bunks were being
reconstructed in the central parade ground.

Seeing the rows and rows of bunks outdoors and realizing the festival of
Sukkot was coming, this rabbi had managed to secure some schach (plant
shrubbery) and place it atop some of the boards of the semi-constructed
bunks beneath the open sky in such a way as to construct a minimally kosher
sukkah (booth) for the festival. However, the mitzvah of living in the
sukkah can only be fulfilled by either sleeping (which was out of the
question) or eating in the sukkah, which was his aim.

Seeing the hesitation on the boy's face, and desperate to fulfill this
mitzvah against all the odds, the rabbi begged him for the loaves, if only
for a few minutes.

"I will give you these loaves", said the boy (Yaakov) but only on condition
you take me with you to fulfill the mitzvah of the sukkah."

The rabbi, shocked by the impetuous response began to attempt to dissuade
the boy from this condition. He would be risking his life by walking outside
after curfew, and again for carrying two whole loaves of bread and of course
for attempting to sit in a sukkah. But nothing he could say would dissuade
the boy, so together the two of them, and old Rabbi and a student, risked
their lives and sat, for a few brief moments, in a sukkah in Auschwitz.

(As an interesting post-script, 'Yaakov' told me that many years later he
was in Chicago on business and got stuck there for Shabbat whereupon his
host took him to the Tish of a great Rebbe, who turned out to be this same
Rabbi, who happened to decide to tell this very story that very same
night...).*

What does it mean to sit in a *Sukkah* (booth)? What are we meant to be
thinking and feeling? And why would two men decide to risk their lives, just
to sit in a *sukkah* in Auschwitz?

One of the things that distinguish the festival of Sukkot from the other
festivals is the ambiguity concerning the nature of the historical
underpinnings of this festival. After all, *Pesach* (Passover) commemorates
the Jews' exodus from Egypt, and Shavuot commemorates the giving of the
Torah at Mount Sinai. But what exactly are we commemorating on Sukkot?

The Torah (*Vayikra* (Leviticus) 23:43) explains:

*" ...Le'maan yedu' doroteichem ki ba'Sukkot hoshavti et B'nei Yisrael
be'hotzi' otam me'eretz mitzrayim."
"...In order that your (future) generations might know that I (G-d) made the
children of Israel dwell in Sukkot when I took them out of Egypt."*

In other words, the Torah commands us to spend a week living and eating in
temporary booths (*sukkot) *to commemorate the fact that we dwelled in these
same *sukkot *for forty years in the desert. One wonders why this is so
important. So the Jews built booths to protect them from the sun in the
desert; why does that warrant a week long celebration? After all, we don't
spend a week wearing old clothes, even though the Jews had to wear clothes
in the desert, so why the special celebration of sukkot?

And for that matter, why is this festival celebrated specifically at this
time of year? Passover commemorates an event (the Exodus from Egypt) that
occurred on the exact date the festival is celebrated, as is true in the
case of the festivals of Shavuot, Rosh Hashanah, and Yom Kippur. But why are
we celebrating sukkot *now*?

And one especially wonders about this celebration when considering the fact
that there does not seem to have been any major miracle; unlike the falling
of the Manna and the miraculous well of Miriam, we just built sukkot. So why
the celebration? After all, we don't have a festival to commemorate the
rocks Moshe hit in trying to bring forth water; why not have a 'rock-
week'festival!

Interestingly, the Talmud ( Tractate *Sukkah* 11a) ) does tell us of an
interesting difference of opinion between Rabbi Eliezer and Rabbi Akiva, as
to what these 'Sukkot' mentioned in the Torah really were: Actual Sukkot
(booths) or the Clouds of Glory (*Ananei Kavod*) mentioned elsewhere in the
Torah....

While the opinion that these were indeed the Clouds of Glory (which somehow
miraculously protected the Jews from their enemies and caused their clothes
never to wear out etc...) would go along way to explaining our questions,
what of the opinion of Rabbi Akiva that the Jews lived in actual booths in
the desert (Clouds of Glory not withstanding....)? What is it that we are
celebrating?

Indeed the language of the afore-mentioned verse does not even suggest that
Hashem (G-d) built these Sukkoth, just that he allowed them to dwell in
them.

The *Sefat Emet *(in his commentary on the Torah, 5655) suggests that on Yom
Kippur we attempt to recapture the world as it was before we sinned. When
Adam and Eve were first created, Hashem placed them (us) in the Garden of
Eden which was the world as it could be. However, due to our inevitable
mistakes we were forced to leave the Garden of Eden and venture out into the
world as it had become: a world more distant from G-d. And ever since that
time we are attempting to perfect this world and rectify our mistakes to
recapture the world as it could be: the world of the Garden of Eden.

Indeed, Yom Kippur, which culminates ten days of *teshuvah *(repentance, or
literally 'returning', from he root '*shuv*' to return) is the day when we
attempt to turn back the clock and become the person we were meant to be *
before* the mistakes we have made. Hence Yom Kippur falls on the anniversary
of the day when the Jews were given the second set of tablets (given after
the first tablets were destroyed in the debacle of the Golden calf when the
first tablets were destroyed...) because it is the day when we are given the
opportunity to go back to the way life could be.

But if Yom Kippur remains just one special day of the year, when we let go
of the world and come close to Hashem, then we have missed the point. The
real challenge of the Sukkah is whether we can bring a little bit of Yom
Kippur with us back into the world.

Indeed *Rav Moshe Feinstein *(in his *Darash Moshe*) suggests that
essentially, this world is an illusion. We see a physical world of natural
order where materialsim rules and the bigger house means the better man. So
we spend a week in the Sukkah to remind us that all we own and all the
things we think we have are really an illusion; reality is the world of the
Garden of Eden; the world of ethics and love, of closeness to Hashem and
Torah.

This was precisely what the forty years spent by the Jewish people in the
desert was all about. After the mistakes that they made (with the Golden
calf and the sin of the spies) the Jews spent 40 years in the desert
remembering that the world is a passing illusion, and that if G-d is the
source of all reality, then G-d is reality, an experience easier to have in
the desert.

This then, perhaps, is the nature of our celebration of the festival of
Sukkot. When we sit in the sukkah, particularly immediately after the
experience of Yom Kipppur, we are embracing the idea that what we have is
not who we are, and attempting to make the lessons of Yom Kippur real in the
grind and routine of the every day.

And if two Jews can disconnect from the nightmare illusion all around them,
and succeed in connecting to reality, even in Auschwitz, the perhaps we can
tap into a small fraction of that strength to do the same in our every day
as well.

May we be blessed to succeed in taking a little bit of Yom Kippur with us on
our journey this year....

*Wishing you all a Chag Sameach a joy-filled holiday of Sukkot,*

Rav Binny Freedman

For more of Rav Binny's *Tastings of Torah*, click here.
<http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?e=0018SX6tEYTH-t5heQj0CtUzHayQWRFjkpOWgypeKclSM_sywfITAZTZoue-lqezy6MTwjbs2-0IrJ-sv5ab58J_C4KMTggayfRCZ6kE3AQ9uIa_f-LbaCycbsM35-StLwuoY5yUd1JkTyrLlsZNqeOf0QBQhi_Z7qx>

Back to top <http://webmail.aol.com/39155/aol/en-us/Suite.aspx#topofpage>
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sun Oct 12 19:56:29 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 17:56:29 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] Yes, Muslims on the March...in New York!
Message-ID: <855590370810121756j24f78151ied72a562da2d9008@mail.gmail.com>

   wow...watch the first few minutes...watch Muslims confront counter-demo,
and the cops wimp out like cowards... time to wake up - we are about to lose
this war...the Muslims see us (the whole Western world) for what it is -
brazen cowards... and it's only 7 years after 9/11...and they march in
NYC... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9nTrscmkfU

    Send this to everyone you can....
                   *Hanoch*
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From eliasaph at uniteourheart.com  Sun Oct 12 23:44:06 2008
From: eliasaph at uniteourheart.com (Steve Mathe)
Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2008 21:44:06 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] meteor, a sign of things to come?  
Message-ID: <200810130444.m9D4i5sr013868@mail208c25.carrierzone.com>


A sign of things to 
come?  http://blog.wired.com/wiredscience/2008/10/asteroid-explod.html

http://www.spacedaily.com/Deep_Impact.html



From chattertonw at bellsouth.net  Mon Oct 13 07:30:30 2008
From: chattertonw at bellsouth.net (chattertonw at bellsouth.net)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 12:30:30 +0000
Subject: [Dialogue] FW: Ezra Update
Message-ID: <101320081230.6267.48F33F6600025B5D0000187B22216128369B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>

I am reminded of Hezekiah, when Isaiah came to him with the pronouncement of his death, and how he turned his face to the wall and implored for his life... Yeshua taught that if any two could touch and agree in prayer, it shall be done of His Father... I ask that not two, but 10 times 2 touch and agree with me for the life of this precious on in HaSHeM's sight...

Thank you,

Glenn

>From my mother.
We talked to Keith tonight.  The dr.'s are sending Ezra home tomorrow.  They have stabilized his breathing and will send him home with more ozygen.  They don't intend to give him any more chemo, so basicly they are sending him home to die,even tho they haven't said that... love, Mom  
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From patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com  Mon Oct 13 08:31:27 2008
From: patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com (Pat Robbins)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 09:31:27 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] FW: Ezra Update
In-Reply-To: <101320081230.6267.48F33F6600025B5D0000187B22216128369B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>
References: <101320081230.6267.48F33F6600025B5D0000187B22216128369B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>
Message-ID: <BLU125-DS3F8CC46E3C6CEA49CF71BBA360@phx.gbl>

AGREED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  MAY HASHEM GRANT US THE LIFE OF PRECIOUS EZRA.


From: chattertonw at bellsouth.net 
Sent: Monday, October 13, 2008 8:30 AM
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
Subject: [Dialogue] FW: Ezra Update


I am reminded of Hezekiah, when Isaiah came to him with the pronouncement of his death, and how he turned his face to the wall and implored for his life... Yeshua taught that if any two could touch and agree in prayer, it shall be done of His Father... I ask that not two, but 10 times 2 touch and agree with me for the life of this precious on in HaSHeM's sight...

Thank you,

Glenn

>From my mother.
  We talked to Keith tonight.  The dr.'s are sending Ezra home tomorrow.  They have stabilized his breathing and will send him home with more ozygen.  They don't intend to give him any more chemo, so basicly they are sending him home to die,even tho they haven't said that... love, Mom  


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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From patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com  Mon Oct 13 08:36:35 2008
From: patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com (Pat Robbins)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 09:36:35 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Muslims march/HOSHANA RABBAH
In-Reply-To: <855590370810121756j24f78151ied72a562da2d9008@mail.gmail.com>
References: <855590370810121756j24f78151ied72a562da2d9008@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BLU125-DS685C808D4D55266B5BD67BA360@phx.gbl>

My comment concerns a separate, but related issue.  Our world is being inundated by threats on a grand scale.  We need Mashiach NOW for sure, and this coming Hoshana Rabbah may be more meaningful than ever for us.  However, we also need to be aware of certain patterns of history.  

As the world falls into chaos, it becomes more amenable to trading freedom for "protection."   If history tells us our future, then a man will arise to whom we will give our freedom in exchange for his security.  When Nimrod arose in the ancient world, people gladly accepted his yoke, and even worshipped him as a god.  He prospered the people, and surrounded their cities with walls.  He boldly went forth and fought the beasts of prey that were threatening mankind.  G-d called him a "mighty hunter before the L-RD," but this was not a compliment.  HaShem looks for shepherds who will lay their lives down for His flock, not hunters who kill and eat of it.  David, the anointed of G-d, was a shepherd.  Nimrod was a hunter.  G-d called our father, Abraham, out of Nimrod's legacy, just as He calls to us today that we not be deceived by the Hunter, but look for and follow His Shepherd.

Until Mashiach comes, we have to be aware of the even more insidious dangers we face from the growing threats of economic breakdown and bloodthirsty jihadists, who greedily seek world domination.  The greater threat may be one who will arise to calm the raging seas, but is not the Anointed of G-d.  Despots arise out of chaos.

Pat   


From: Hanoch Young 
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2008 8:56 PM
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
Subject: [Dialogue] Yes, Muslims on the March...in New York!


   wow...watch the first few minutes...watch Muslims confront counter-demo, and the cops wimp out like cowards... time to wake up - we are about to lose this war...the Muslims see us (the whole Western world) for what it is - brazen cowards... and it's only 7 years after 9/11...and they march in NYC... 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9nTrscmkfU 

    Send this to everyone you can....
                   Hanoch


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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Mon Oct 13 09:37:55 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 10:37:55 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Chag Sameach L'Kulchem (to all)
Message-ID: <855590370810130737u7d2c64f8vc4cb0055efa47c70@mail.gmail.com>

     The Lekarev Report
   *14 Tishrei 5769
* *October 13, 2008
*  Shalom v' Chag Sameach Succot

As one whom his mother comforts, so will I comfort you; and you shall be
comforted in Jerusalem.

Isaiah 65:13
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Mon Oct 13 09:56:16 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 10:56:16 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] The dealing away of the Temple Mount...
Message-ID: <855590370810130756j8edb11bg9189abafe74ea5f0@mail.gmail.com>

*Palestinian leader, Islamist chief discuss Temple Mount takeover
Conspirators seek to solidify control over Judaism's holiest site
*Posted: October 05, 2008
8:37 pm Eastern

By Aaron Klein
?(c) 2008 WorldNetDaily

JERUSALEM - Meeting with an Islamist leader here, the Palestinian
Authority's chief negotiator this past weekend discussed ways to
solidify Islamic control over the Temple Mount and block Jews from
purchasing real estate in areas surrounding the holy site, according
to a source involved in the talks.

The Palestinian Maan news agency quoted chief Palestinian negotiator
Ahmed Qurei as saying there can be no agreement with Israel unless it
forfeits Jerusalem, and that postponing an agreement on the issue
will only provide the Jewish state more time to "Judaize" the city.

"The Palestinian Authority will not negotiate and will not sign on
any agreement with Israel that does not include Jerusalem," Qurei
reportedly said during a meeting with Raed Salah, chief of the
Islamic Movement in Israel, Sheikh Raed Salah, whose organization
seeks for Islam to takeover the Temple Mount.

"The Palestinian leadership is decisive (in its stance) not to
negotiate and conclude matters with the Israelis without Jerusalem,"
Queri said. "The postponement of the discussion of this issue is
aimed at continuing the Israeli plans to Judaize the holy city,
especially the Al-Aksa mosque."

A source involved in the talks told WND that Queri and Salah also
discussed ways to solidify PA control over the Mount and to purchase
strategic real estate surrounding the holy site.

The sources said Queri and Salah also discussed ways for the PA to
compete with Jordan for more control over the Temple Mount.

Jordan continues to maintain a major influence over the Temple Mount.
Sheik Azzam Khateeb, who was installed in February 2007 as the new
manager of the Waqf, is known to be close to the Jordanian monarchy.
The previous Waqf manager, Sheik Adnon Husseini, was loyal to
Palestinian Authority although toward the end of his rein, he seemed
to be warming to Jordan.

In a gesture to Jordan, in January 2006, Israel granted Jordan
permission to replace the main podium in the Al Aqsa Mosque from
which Islamic preachers deliver their sermons. The podium, which was
partially funded by Saudi Arabia, is considered one of the most
important stands in the Muslim world. Muslims now believe it marks
the "exact spot" Muhammad went up to heaven to receive revelations
from Allah.

The new stand bears the emblem of the Jordanian kingdom. It replaced
a 1,000-year-old podium believed to have been shipped to Jerusalem by
the Islamic conqueror Saladin.

That stand was destroyed in 1969, when an Australian tourist set fire
to the Al Aqsa Mosque.

In recent years, Jordan quietly has been purchasing real estate
surrounding the Temple Mount in Jerusalem in hopes of gaining more
control over the area accessing the holy site, according to
Palestinian and Israeli officials speaking to WND.

The officials disclosed the Jordanian kingdom in 2006 and 2007 used
shell companies to purchase several apartments and shops located at
key peripheral sections of the Temple Mount. The shell companies at
times presented themselves as acting on behalf of the Waqf custodians
of the Temple Mount, according to information obtained.

The officials said Jordan also set up a commission to use the shell
companies to petition mostly Arab landowners adjacent to eastern
sections of the Temple Mount to sell their properties. They said
profits from sales at any purchased shops would be reinvested to buy
more real estate near the Mount and in eastern Jerusalem
neighborhoods.

The report the PA is looking to purchase real estate near the Mount
follows a WND exclusive article in January quoting informed sources
stating the PA recently established an intelligence apparatus in
Jerusalem to clamp down on Israeli Arabs selling property to Jews in
strategic areas of the city.

A contingent of Jewish groups, including an organization called
Ateret Kohanim, work to strengthen the Jewish presence in Jerusalem
by purchasing properties from Arabs, primarily in eastern
neighborhoods, including in Jerusalem's Old City. Some of the
purchased properties were formerly Jewish until Jews fled during Arab
riots in the early 1900s.

The Temple Mount is the holiest site in Judaism. The First Jewish
Temple was built there by King Solomon in the 10th century B.C. It
was destroyed by the Babylonians in 586 B.C. The Second Temple was
rebuilt in 515 B.C. after Jerusalem was freed from Babylonian
captivity. That temple was destroyed by the Roman Empire in A.D. 70.
Each temple stood for a period of about four centuries.

The Jewish Temple was the center of religious Jewish worship. It
housed the Holy of Holies, which contained the Ark of the Covenant
and was said to be the area upon which God's shechina or "presence"
dwelt. All Jewish holidays centered on worship at the Temple. The
Jewish Temple served as the primary location for the offering of
sacrifices and was the main gathering place for the Jewish people.

According to the Talmud, the world was created from the foundation
stone of the Temple Mount. The site is believed to be the biblical
Mount Moriah, the location where Abraham fulfilled God's test to see
if he would be willing to sacrifice his son Isaac.

Jewish tradition holds Mashiach, or the Jewish Messiah, will return
and rebuild the third and final Temple on the Mount in Jerusalem.

The Kotel, or Western Wall, is the one part of the Temple Mount that
survived the destruction of the Second Temple by the Romans and
stands today in Jerusalem.

Throughout all notorious Jewish exiles, thorough documentation shows
the Jews never gave up their hope of returning to Jerusalem and
re-establishing their Temple. To this day Jews worldwide pray facing
the Western Wall, while Muslims turn their backs away from the Temple
Mount and pray toward Mecca.

The Al Aqsa Mosque was constructed around A.D. 709 to serve as a
shrine near another shrine, the Dome of the Rock, which was built by
an Islamic caliph.

About 100 years ago, the Dome of the Rock in Jerusalem became
associated with the place Muslims came to believe Muhammad ascended
to heaven. Jerusalem, however, is not mentioned in the Quran.

Islamic tradition states Muhammad took a journey in a single night
from "a sacred mosque" - believed to be in Mecca in southern Saudi
Arabia - to "the farthest mosque," and from a rock there ascended to
heaven to receive revelations from Allah that became part of the
Quran.

Palestinians today claim exclusivity over the Temple Mount, and
Palestinian leaders routinely deny Jewish historic connection to the
site, but historically, Muslims did not claim the Al Aqsa Mosque as
their third holiest site and admitted the Jewish Temples existed.

According to research by Israeli author Shmuel Berkovits, Islam
previously disregarded Jerusalem. He points out in his book "How
Dreadful Is this Place!" that Muhammad was said to loathe Jerusalem
and what it stood for. Berkovits wrote that Muhammad made a point of
eliminating pagan sites of worship, and sanctifying only one place -
the Kaaba in Mecca - to signify the unity of God.

As late as the 14th century, Islamic scholar Taqi al-Din Ibn
Taymiyya, whose writings influenced the Wahhabi movement in Arabia,
ruled that sacred Islamic sites are to be found only in the Arabian
Peninsula, and that "in Jerusalem, there is not a place one calls
sacred, and the same holds true for the tombs of Hebron."

It wasn't until the late 19th century - incidentally when Jews
started immigrating to Palestine - that some Muslim scholars began
claiming Muhammad tied his horse to the Western Wall and associated
Muhammad's purported night journey with the Temple Mount.

A guide to the Temple Mount by the Supreme Muslim Council in
Jerusalem published in 1925 listed the Mount as the site of Solomon's
Temple. The Temple Institute acquired a copy of the official 1925
"Guide Book to Al-Haram Al-Sharif," which states on page 4, "Its
identity with the site of Solomon's Temple is beyond dispute. This,
too, is the spot, according to universal belief, on which 'David
built there an altar unto the Lord.'"
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Mon Oct 13 10:04:56 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 11:04:56 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Yes, pogroms in Israel...
Message-ID: <855590370810130804k54c2a02arad2b377df2bd3d4@mail.gmail.com>

This will continue to be played down by the Israeli government...they will
not admit that the "Israeli Arabs" (a contradiction in terms) would not be
loyal to Israel.  You can take the Jew out of Galut (exile), but you can't
necessarily take the Galut (mentality) out of the Jew...
             *Hanoch*
**
  Update on Akko Riots

Israeli President Shimon Peres arrived in the northern Israeli city of Akko
this morning, accompanied by Chief Rabbi Yona Metzger and Chief Sephardic
Rabbi Shlomo Amar.

The three met with Akko Mayor Shimon Lankry, Akko's Chief Rabbi Yosef Yashar
and the head of the city's mosque, Sheik Samir Assi, as well as with MK Abas
Zkoor (United Arab List-Ta'al) and Jewish and Arab community leaders,
following the recent riots which have plagued Akko's streets and seen 68
people arrested.

"Words can be deadly and public figures must be careful about what they say,
especially at a time like this," said Peres.

More information has been forthcoming since the sketchy reports of the first
day.

According to an eyewitness report published by YNET
http://www.ynet.co.il/articles/0,7340,L-3607155,00.html<http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?e=001m3vENB0gIIWdX955lh9B2Zv8KxZAmKKnttNgjvIhKagb27C-Gorj16IHyqmCTdoS_PjjG4n1DBzRWiSgfXyoJQHgccJ2l2v9mA04kL9NU8e5JSUMDjbpPs2MbcXAcjYMdAHnov0eluy2JQCob9I-H4NPOy_YjfcO0PGwPkz2s1M=>,
Arabs carried out a planned attack against their Jewish neighbors on Yom
Kippur.

The witness, who said he was standing in the main square of the Jewish
neighborhood of Akko, a city with many Muslim residents, when a taxi driven
by an Arab entered the neighborhood Yom Kippur evening at high speed with
music blaring and almost ran down children in the street.  Surrounded by
angry Jewish residents, he parked his car, cursed them, and entered a
building, where he targeted residents with objects pitched from the seventh
floor.

Soon after, a busload of Arabs bearing truncheons, axes and knives  crying:
"Death to the Jews" and "Allah  u Akbar" cut a swathe through the crowd of
peaceful, fasting Jews, uprooting trees and street lights, smashing car and
store windows, and destroying everything in their path.  Jewish residents,
who were fasting and unarmed, fled, taking shelter in nearby buildings.
When the police arrived (some reported Akko police only had Arab policemen
on duty and they were slow to respond, but this isn't confirmed)  and
finally arrested a few of the rioters, several said that this had been a
planned attack which had nothing to do with the specific incident with the
cab driver. Arab residents said some of the rioters were not residents of
Akko, but had come in from outside several days before.  There is now a
curfew on the city.

Akko residents, who came under attack during the Lebanon War said that the
destruction to their city was far worse than anything that happened during
the war.  Some Israeli reporters are trying to portray this as an escalation
of tensions following an "accident,"  claiming that Arab residents feared
the driver had had an innocent accident and was lynched by Jewish residents.

Notably, eyewitness reports and police testimony so far show a different
picture.
  Hamas: 'We Will Liberate Akko'

Hamas, which violently overthrew Fatah and took control of Gaza last year,
now threatens to take control of the Israeli Galilee city of Akko.

The terrorist organization held a mass march in the Gaza city of Jebalya on
Saturday night, expressing solidarity with the Arab residents of Akko in
their struggle against the "Zionist conquerors."

The  main speaker, Hamas party whip in the Palestinian Authority legislature
Mushir Al-Masri, fired up the masses with his promise that, "The moment of
victory is coming closer, and the day will soon come when soldiers of Hamas
and the Al-Kassam Brigades will liberate Akko, with the help of Allah."

"The enemy will be crushed on the walls of Akko," Al-Masri railed, "just
like the other invaders in past history. The normalization and the
negotiations will never cause us to forget even one inch of our stolen land
of Palestine."

Are they simply trying to 'ride a wave'?  Considering the eyewitness reports
above and the discrepancy between police reports and local witnesses, the
situation bears scrutiny and careful attention.
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Mon Oct 13 10:15:55 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 11:15:55 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Choosing your weapon
Message-ID: <855590370810130815x74223269t4e9ffab91d88d6a2@mail.gmail.com>

I adore Rav Lazer Brody, and have gained so much strength in my Emuna
(faith) from his teachings.  However, in this case, I have to politely, and
respectfully disagree with him.  Wouldn't you be better off with BOTH
weapons?!?  One in each hand...

               * Hanoch*
**
 Choose your weapon<http://lazerbrody.typepad.com/lazer_beams/2008/10/choose_your_wea.html>

This guy's assembling his weapon...

[image: Assembling_m16]<http://lazerbrody.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/assembling_m16.jpg>
*US soldier assembling an M-16 rifle*

*...*and this guy is assembling his weapon:

[image: Lazerlulav]<http://lazerbrody.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/lazerlulav.jpg>
*Lazer in his Succa binding his lulav*

"Some with chariots, some with horses, but we shall call out in the name of
Hashem, our G-d!" *(Psalms 20:8)*

**

**

Monday, 13 October 2008 at 12:01 AM in Jewish
holidays<http://lazerbrody.typepad.com/lazer_beams/jewish_holidays/>
| Permalink<http://lazerbrody.typepad.com/lazer_beams/2008/10/choose_your_wea.html>
| TrackBack (0)<http://lazerbrody.typepad.com/lazer_beams/2008/10/choose_your_wea.html#trackback>
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From betty_m_eddy at yahoo.com  Tue Oct 14 11:20:12 2008
From: betty_m_eddy at yahoo.com (Betty Eddy)
Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2008 09:20:12 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Dialogue] Conference
Message-ID: <994344.11401.qm@web30402.mail.mud.yahoo.com>





I am looking for someone to share the ride from Houston to
the Conference.? I am also in need of a woman? (this can be someone else) to share my room at Plantation
Village. It has 2 queen sized beds and is on the first floor. Please contact me
at 713-459-7222 or email me at betty_m_eddy at yahoo.com.



Betty Eddy
  
      
   


      
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Wed Oct 15 05:03:24 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 20:03:24 +1000
Subject: [Dialogue] DEBATE: RABBI v CHRISTIAN.
Message-ID: <48F5BFEC.80903@westnet.com.au>

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From patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com  Wed Oct 15 14:45:09 2008
From: patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com (Pat Robbins)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 15:45:09 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] DEBATE: RABBI v CHRISTIAN.
In-Reply-To: <48F5BFEC.80903@westnet.com.au>
References: <48F5BFEC.80903@westnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <BLU125-DS751127B6C0D2FCC3B212BBA300@phx.gbl>

Awesome!!!!  Thank you, Joe.  I didn't intend to stop everything and listen for so long, but this was quite compelling and I'm so glad I spent the time to hear it.

Hag Sameach,

Pat


From: JOE INDOMENICO 
Sent: Wednesday, October 15, 2008 6:03 AM
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
Subject: [Dialogue] DEBATE: RABBI v CHRISTIAN.


Chag Succot Sameach.

I hope you all had a wonderfully blessed time for the Succot holiday.

Personally, we spent a beautiful day with our Jewish brothers and sisters under the Succah at Dror's house. We had some special Usphizin (guests) , Ran and his beautiful wife Dana and baby son Yonatan who also come from Gush Katif to visit us from Yisrael.

Just on a side note, Sarita's father was one of the founders of Neve Dekelim and other settlements in the Gush. What makes this such a tragic story is that her family was expelled from the Yamit settlement in the Sinai in 1982. Sarita was only 14 at the time. Her father vowed that he would actively engage in the establishment of settlement communities in the Gush. Then the tragedy of 2005 and the Gerush. Sarita's mother passed away after the Sinai expulsion from breast cancer.
The pain is still evident in Sarita's eyes. I can only empathize and only just begin to understand Sarita's misery of having been twice expelled from her community, once as a teenage daughter and once as a mature mother of 3 children.
Her resilience and emunah in HaShem are extraordinary and inspiring.

The Ellay Sinai families send their best regards to you all.

I would like to forward to you a two part debate between a Rabbi and a Christian. I hope you will find it of interest.
Rabbi Mizrachi is an Israeli. Please take this into consideration. He is very much in your face and does not mince his words.
A characteristic that I personally love,being Sicilian, but some of you might find confronting. No apologies. Worth the watch.

Part 1 ....... http://divineinformation.com/downloads/2007_11_07_rav_mizrachi_the_debate_part_1.wmv
Part 2....... http://divineinformation.com/downloads/2007_11_07_rav_mizrachi_the_debate_part_2.wmv

Chag Sameach to all the delegates and speakers at the Succot Conference at the Synagogue without walls.
I pray that it will be a huge success. I will be with y'all in spirit from the land down under.

Shalom v'Ahavah
JOE.



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From tposborne77 at yahoo.com  Wed Oct 15 14:53:09 2008
From: tposborne77 at yahoo.com (Tracy Osborne)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 12:53:09 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Dialogue] Zechut Avot
Message-ID: <177183.40312.qm@web51102.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Quite and interesting article to consider, written by an Orthodox Jewish Rabbi and his student. See the link provided to read the entire paper.
?
__________________________________________
?
Zechut Avot - The Merit of Our Fathers
?
Question: What do you call a religion that maintains that salvation depends upon the sacrifice of a beloved son centuries ago? What do you call a religion whose adherents believe that their sins are expiated because someone long ago offered himself up to be sacrificed? 
?
Answer: ?Judaism?. 


http://www.betemunah.org/merit.html


      
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Wed Oct 15 15:53:36 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 06:53:36 +1000
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] Zechut Avot]
Message-ID: <48F65850.9050102@westnet.com.au>

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Subject: [Dialogue] Zechut Avot
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From tposborne77 at yahoo.com  Wed Oct 15 16:14:12 2008
From: tposborne77 at yahoo.com (Tracy Osborne)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 14:14:12 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] Zechut Avot]
Message-ID: <268737.34090.qm@web51112.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Shalom Joe,
?
Here's his info. I've only met him online and coversed a few times. Quite an amazing writer. 
http://www.betemunah.org/autobio.html
?
Ahavah v'Tefillot,
?
Tracy


----- Original Message ----
From: JOE INDOMENICO <jid at westnet.com.au>
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
Sent: Wednesday, October 15, 2008 4:53:36 PM
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] Zechut Avot]

Shalom Tracy,

todah for sending this link. I will spend the time to read it in depth over the weekend.

Could you tell us more about the author.

The theme reminded me of a Jewish Midrash.

Our Sages relate the following scene which will take place in the future: 
R' Shmuel, the son of Nachmani, said in the name of Rav Yonatan: "What does the verse mean, You are our father, for Abraham did not know us and Israel did not recognize us. You [G-d], our Father, Redeemer, forever is Your Name. [Isaiah 63:16]. In the future, God will say to Abraham, 'Your children have sinned against me.' And Abraham will say in front of Him, 'Master of the Universe, wipe them out for of the sanctification of Your Name.' God will say, 'Perhaps Jacob, who had experienced difficulty raising his children, will ask for mercy for the Jewish people.' G-d will say to him, 'Your children have sinned against Me.' Jacob will say in front of Him, 'Master of the Universe, wipe them out for the sanctification of Your Name.' God will say, 'The old man has no reason, and the young one has no advice." God will then say to Isaac, 'Your children have sinned against me.' He will say in front of Him, 'Master of the Universe, my children? My children, and
 not Your children? When the Jews said, We will do and we will listen, You called them my first-born son, and now You call them my children, and not Your children? Besides, how much did they sin? How many years are the years of a man's life'seventy? Subtract [the first] 20, for which a person is not punished, you are left with 50. Subtract 25, which are evenings, and you are left with 25. Subtract 12-1/2 which a person uses to pray, to eat, and answer nature's call, and you are left with 12-1/2. If You can tolerate all of this, good; if not, then let us split it, half on You and half on me. If you will say that all of the years of their sins are on me, remember that I sacrificed my soul in front of you (for you).'" [Shabbat 89b]
In this amazing passage, we are told that in the future, neither Abraham nor Jacob will stand in defense of the Jews who have sinned. That will be Isaac's role. Isaac will engage God in negotiations reminiscent of Abraham's plea for the cities Sodom and Gomorrah. Isaac will not tolerate the Jews' being punished. He will argue, negotiate, and finally pull out his trump card: in the merit of his being willing to sacrifice himself, God must forgive the people. Why do the Sages expect Isaac to display more kindness than his father Abraham, whose very nature was kindness?
Apparently the trait of kindness which is acquired is stronger than the trait of kindness which comes naturally. So we discern that Isaac did descend the mountain. He did develop the trait of kindness and when he did he surpassed even Abraham himself. Such is the merit of a trait acquired. Isaac did not acquire this trait easily, but the Talmud tells us that the entire Jewish people will be saved on its merit.

Shalom v'Ahavah
JOE.




-----Inline Message Follows-----


Quite and interesting article to consider, written by an Orthodox Jewish Rabbi and his student. See the link provided to read the entire paper.
?
__________________________________________
?
Zechut Avot - The Merit of Our Fathers
?
Question: What do you call a religion that maintains that salvation depends upon the sacrifice of a beloved son centuries ago? What do you call a religion whose adherents believe that their sins are expiated because someone long ago offered himself up to be sacrificed? 
?
Answer: ?Judaism?. 


http://www.betemunah.org/merit.html



      
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Wed Oct 15 16:32:14 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 07:32:14 +1000
Subject: [Fwd: Re: [Fwd: [Dialogue] Zechut Avot]]
Message-ID: <48F6615E.3070205@westnet.com.au>

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From kimalvarado3265 at gmail.com  Wed Oct 15 20:33:50 2008
From: kimalvarado3265 at gmail.com (kim alvarado)
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2008 20:33:50 -0500
Subject: [Dialogue] Re: Succoth Conference Update - 10/03/08
In-Reply-To: <c599cad60810111124t18991bf4pda40cc3ebd67a9b6@mail.gmail.com>
References: <2708030cbdd71549a445861a531ac6e1@www.imsclients.com>
	<c599cad60810111124t18991bf4pda40cc3ebd67a9b6@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1c8dbb6e0810151833n50f8e04cu45a214301841f657@mail.gmail.com>

Just got this...will be praying for you, Amber, and her family.

Kim

On Sat, Oct 11, 2008 at 1:24 PM, calb fordham <calbfordham at gmail.com> wrote:

> We were SO looking forward to coming for Succoth but we have had a family
> emergency and will be out of town for two weeks with Amber's Dad.  Please
> forgive us and pray we can make it next year.  Amber's brother is having
> trial for armed robbery, 2nd degree burglury, bodily injury, running from
> the law, drugs, etc............please pray for him as well as Amber's Dad
> whom he had been living with until jailed.  Amber's Dad had a heart attack
> not long ago and we spent every weekend with him for 7 months.  Now his
> blood pressure is up to hypertension level and Amber feels she needs to take
> care of him again for a bit.  Amber's brother has put him through A LOT
> these last few months!  Please ask everyone to pray.  Thanks for
> understanding!  Can't wait to see everyone again!  Hope it is soon!  Chris
> and Amber Fordham
>
> Also, continue to pray for Amber's Mom, who has two more court cases coming
> up for the DUI and Hit and Run.
>
> On Sat, Oct 4, 2008 at 12:30 AM, Roots of Faith <bulletin at rootsoffaith.org
> > wrote:
>
>>  The Roots of Faith Congregation from Saint Francisville, Louisiana
>> *presents*
>> Succoth 08 with Arba 4
>> a Biblical Teaching Conference held during the Ancient Festival of Succoth
>> at the historic Temple Sinai Synagogue
>>
>> The Synagogue without walls!
>>
>> This conference has become an annual event hosted by Ross Nichols and the
>> congregation of Roots of Faith. This year, the teachers from Arba4 will
>> present their topics live over the web allowing people from around the world
>> to be a part of the audience. If you cannot come to us, we hope to bring
>> this event to you.
>>
>> ARBA4 is a web site that was organized to present multi-media teachings
>> about the Bible, Judaism, Gentiles, Christianity, Non-Jews, Torah, Tanak,
>> New Testament, Prophecy and Current Events. http://www.ARBA4.com
>> <http://www.arba4.com/>currently features, Joseph & Debbie Good, Ross K
>> Nichols and Dr. Walter Oakley.
>>
>> In addition to the more "formal" classes we have discussed having some
>> informal, but facilitated conversations.
>>
>> We also hope to take a live call from our friend Dr. James D. Tabor at
>> some point. James will be in Jerusalem during the conference and we hope to
>> arrange for a quick greeting from him.
>>
>> A final version of the program will be posted soon, but here are the time
>> slots so that you can begin to make plans to listen in live. This is
>> tentative, but is getting close to final as far as the time slots go. As
>> soon as the speakers send me their topics I will determine how to plug it
>> all in and re-publish. All times are Central Time Zone.
>>
>> Friday, October 17th
>> Welcome and Erev Shabbat Fellowship at Temple Sinai Synagogue - *6 P.M.
>> until*
>> Ross Nichols will welcome those in attendance and those who are listening
>> in live over the Internet.
>> Ross will introduce the speakers; Joe Good, Debbie Good, Walter Oakley.
>> *Open Mic* - The microphones will now turn to those in attendance. We
>> will take some time to allow people to share what brings them to this place
>> in celebration of an ancient Hebrew Festival.
>> *Live Music to follow until we depart for the campground.*
>>
>> Saturday, October 18th
>>
>> 9:30 - 10:00 / Meet and Greet
>> 10:00 - 11:30 / First Class
>> 2:00 - 3:30 / Second Class
>> 4:00 - 6:00 / Third Class
>> *Live Music to follow until we depart for the campground.
>> *
>> Sunday, October 19th
>>
>> 9:30 - 10:00 / Meet and Greet
>> 10:00 - 11:30 / First Class
>> 2:00 - 3:30 / Second Class
>> *7:00 P.M. until - Ross Nichols Sunday Shul Class on Torah Portion
>> Bereshith*
>>
>> All classes will be webcast live and posted as podcasts as soon as
>> possible.
>> Individual classes or a collection of the entire conference will be
>> offered as a package at a later date. Proceeds to go to Arba4 to further the
>> teaching and outreach of Torah Faith to the nations.
>>
>> We hope that many of you will be able to spend the weekend with us, but
>> for those that cannot make the trip we hope that you will listen in live.
>>
>> We hope and intend to set some things up that will allow you to interact
>> with the speakers and those in attendance, via phone and internet - but
>> details are still in the works.
>>
>> If you are coming to the conference and have not yet signed up on my
>> website, please do so. We are getting close and I will be sending out more
>> regular updates as we draw closer to the conference.
>>
>> If you have questions or concerns, please email me at rndavar at aol.com.
>>
>> Shabbat Shalom, Ross
>>
>> Ross K. Nichols
>> www.RootsofFaith.org <http://www.rootsoffaith.org/>
>>
>>
>> Click here to unsubscribe<http://www.imsclients.com/listmail/unsubscribe.php?M=29032&N=232&L=11&C=7f3a070e03da9e75ff738084aa750ff2>
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
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From j.h.lusk234 at sbcglobal.net  Thu Oct 16 04:52:48 2008
From: j.h.lusk234 at sbcglobal.net (Helen Lusk)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 02:52:48 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Dialogue] DEBATE: RABBI v CHRISTIAN.
In-Reply-To: <BLU125-DS751127B6C0D2FCC3B212BBA300@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <952374.8197.qm@web82505.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Thanks, Joe. I watched both and it reminded me somewhat of Rabbi Tovia Singer from? NY who is on Israel World News radio.
?
Kind regards,
?
Helen

--- On Wed, 10/15/08, Pat Robbins <patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com> wrote:

From: Pat Robbins <patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Dialogue] DEBATE: RABBI v CHRISTIAN.
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
Date: Wednesday, October 15, 2008, 3:45 PM



Awesome!!!!? Thank you, Joe.? I didn't intend to stop everything and listen for so long, but this was quite compelling and I'm so glad I spent the time to hear it.
?
Hag Sameach,
?
Pat




From: JOE INDOMENICO 
Sent: Wednesday, October 15, 2008 6:03 AM
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
Subject: [Dialogue] DEBATE: RABBI v CHRISTIAN.

Chag Succot Sameach.

I hope you all had a wonderfully blessed time for the Succot holiday.

Personally, we spent a beautiful day with our Jewish brothers and sisters under the Succah at Dror's house. We had some special Usphizin (guests) , Ran and his beautiful wife Dana and baby son Yonatan who also come from Gush Katif to visit us from Yisrael.

Just on a side note, Sarita's father was one of the founders of Neve Dekelim and other settlements in the Gush. What makes this such a tragic story is that her family was expelled from the Yamit settlement in the Sinai in 1982. Sarita was only 14 at the time. Her father vowed that he would actively engage in the establishment of settlement communities in the Gush. Then the tragedy of 2005 and the Gerush. Sarita's mother passed away after the Sinai expulsion from breast cancer.
The pain is still evident in Sarita's eyes. I can only empathize and only just begin to understand Sarita's misery of having been twice expelled from her community, once as a teenage daughter and once as a mature mother of 3 children.
Her resilience and emunah in HaShem are extraordinary and inspiring.

The Ellay Sinai families send their best regards to you all.

I would like to forward to you a two part debate between a Rabbi and a Christian. I hope you will find it of interest.
Rabbi Mizrachi is an Israeli. Please take this into consideration. He is very much in your face and does not mince his words.
A characteristic that I personally love,being Sicilian, but some of you might find confronting. No apologies. Worth the watch.

Part 1 ....... http://divineinformation.com/downloads/2007_11_07_rav_mizrachi_the_debate_part_1.wmv
Part 2....... http://divineinformation.com/downloads/2007_11_07_rav_mizrachi_the_debate_part_2.wmv

Chag Sameach to all the delegates and speakers at the Succot Conference at the Synagogue without walls.
I pray that it will be a huge success. I will be with y'all in spirit from the land down under.

Shalom v'Ahavah
JOE.




_______________________________________________
_______________________________________________
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Thu Oct 16 15:36:21 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2008 16:36:21 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] What 1 person can do...fascinating
Message-ID: <855590370810161336u4d4bc48ai1c9e2ffce16da573@mail.gmail.com>

Don Quixote de la Shomron 16 Tishrei 5769, 15 October 08 03:04
by by Shmuel Neumann

(IsraelNN.com) It is not the destination but the path chosen that defines
the individual. The path I have chosen is a simple one. It is the one that
is straight. Yet this apparently straight path has not been a short or
direct one and has led to interesting places.

When I first visited Israel, I rented a car and traveled the length and
breadth of it, and fell in love with the Shomron. I found a land dealer and
bought two parcels of land. Years later, when Binyamin Netanyahu was on the
verge of giving away land which included one of the pieces I bought, I came
to Israel to join others to protest and attempt to block the giveaway. I
went to Kedumim, where other land owners gathered and toured land that we
bought before TV cameras. After it was over, I was interviewed on Israeli TV
and it was aired the night after Yom Kippur.

We then made Aliyah to a settlement near the lost land and I found myself
writing articles for Arutz Sheva, and becoming a spokesperson for Judea,
Samaria and Gaza espousing our inalienable right to all of the Holy Land. I
shamelessly created *www.yesha.homestead.com* and set in motion a loosely
knit grassroots movement of like-minded individuals.

Not giving up on the land handed over to the Palestinian Authority, I sought
to register my ownership in the PA land registry. After investing enormous
time and money, I finally succeeded in registering it. Along the way, I
established relationships with Palestinians who sought to leave the country.
As my wife is a US attorney, we began helping them get visas. As they needed
money, I *post facto* became a land dealer. I got a real estate license and
made connections with the Arab seller and Jews who were interested in
buying. We then established Assisted Emigration Services (*
www.emigrations.net*) to help Palestinians out.

It turned out that the major stumbling block of Palestinians selling their
homes and land is the Israeli government, which prevents property transfers
from Palestinians to Jews. I approached the newly established Sanhedrin to
create a land registry under Jewish law and administered by Jewish religious
courts, and they asked me to work on it. After bringing in all the experts
in the field that we knew, I created *www.beit-din,com* and *
www.property-registry.com*. When they got enough money to get the database
and firewall set up, this program would have become functional. However,
they ran out of money and this site became defunct.

One of the members of the Sanhedrin, Meir Halevi had previously asked that I
draft a number of humanitarian business plans. Together with a friend,
Joseph Friedlander, I drafted a mega-plan to restore the Dead Sea with
contiguous electricity and desalinated water by a passive system of water
tunnels from under the Mediterranean (-20m) straight down to the Dead Sea
(-400m). (*www.emigrations.net/deadsea*). This led to other plans that
addressed global warming, alternative energy, greening the desert, and
making the Negev and Dead Sea regions habitable. The other humanitarian
plans were education and health innovation plans. While these plans are
being considered by the World Bank, and the Dead Sea Plan and Oil Shale Plan
are before the chief scientist of the Israeli Ministry of Infrastructure,
they are all still dormant.

In the meantime, Joseph and I hope, finances permitting, to attempt to file
a patent for a specialized tunneler capable of exploiting deep deposits of
oil, gas or water. This technology can also drill a 100-kilometer tunnel
from the Mediterranean to the Dead Sea. This research led to connections
with a former KGB prisoner, a Jewish scientist, Dr. Alexander Bolonkin. He
has, during discussions with Joseph, come up with new methods of protecting
Sderot and border communities from rockets (see *
http://aps.arxiv.org/pdf/0802.1871* and *ttp://aps.arxiv.org/pdf/0802.0315*).
This in turn led to the possibility of constructing inflatable
mega-balloons, artificial mountains that can harvest more water than the
Nile River from otherwise passing rainclouds, analogous to the way the Rocky
Mountains capture water that otherwise would pass over the western United
States (see *http://aps.arxiv.org/pdf/0801.4820*).

Finances willing, we hope to assemble a coalition of responsible parties
whose orientation will be favorable toward providing the water and security
necessary to make the Jewish settlement on the land a successful and
enduring one.

Have you ever considered why a "two-state solution" is so very important for
America and the secular Israelis? I think that it is nothing short of an
attempt to deny G-d's existence. The single undisputed miracle of the
twentieth century is the return of the Jews to the Holy Land as prophesied.
>From the ashes of concentration camps a vibrant people were resurrected. The
Jews obtaining Jerusalem and the rest of the Holy Land makes it too clear
that this is Divine providence. Usurping Jerusalem, Judea and Samaria from
the Jewish land is an attempt to demonstrate that Biblical prophesy is not
viable.

I believe that the Almighty keeps his promises and He promised all of the
land, not part of it as an everlasting inheritance. After the return of the
Jews, the Almighty also promised peace. Even secular Jews have a Passover
Seder in which they declare, "In every generation they will rise up to
destroy us and the Holy One will save us." Peace cannot be achieved,
according to Jewish dogma, by negotiation, but by the messiah. Until then,
it is only temporary respite of attacks that can be hoped for.

The road I have traveled is paved with hardship, but I am just a simple Jew
trying to fulfill the Torah. Settling the land and helping Gentiles to leave
it are commandments like any other commandment. I am one simple Jew tilting
at windmills, dreaming the impossible dream and fighting overwhelming
malevolent forces.

Since my Aliyah nine years ago, the straight road that the Almighty put me
on has been wondrous, despite the fact that not one of the projects led to
any final destination. What lies ahead, only G-d knows, but I am grateful
that I have had the privilege to live in Israel, in the Shomron, and now in
Jerusalem.

Despite all the hardships, attacks and war, despite the lame duck Israeli
government, I still love this country - with all its challenges.
 www.IsraelNationalNews.com <http://www.israelnationalnews.com/>
(c) Copyright IsraelNationalNews.com
Subscribe to the free Daily Israel Report - sub.israelnn.com
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From bkgivin at charter.net  Sat Oct 18 10:29:14 2008
From: bkgivin at charter.net (Betty Givin)
Date: Sat, 18 Oct 2008 10:29:14 -0500
Subject: [Dialogue] SUKKOTH GREETINGS!
Message-ID: <DC3A84BA5C82412ABA55C2E0751F6E15@bettylaptop>

Dear brothers and sisters,

 

Just had to send you Sukkoth greetings and let you know how much I wish I
could have been there with all of you.  I can picture you all gathered
together at the lovely campground and quaint little synagogue and can see
myself among you.  I am there with you in  spirit as I know are many others
of us who were unable to attend.

 

I have had all of you in my heart and mind and pray that you will have a
blessed time of learning and growing and sharing the love that HaShem has
given all of us for one another, and the love that we have for Him.

 

We are still working 72-84 hours a week, so on Sabbath, I have been
literally crashing; but I want to try to check in more often.

 

Love and miss you all and Shabbat Shalom, Hag Sameach!

 

Elisheva

 

 

 

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From carlson_john at bellsouth.net  Sat Oct 18 19:42:04 2008
From: carlson_john at bellsouth.net (carlson_john at bellsouth.net)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 00:42:04 +0000
Subject: [Dialogue] SUKKOTH GREETINGS!
In-Reply-To: <DC3A84BA5C82412ABA55C2E0751F6E15@bettylaptop>
Message-ID: <101920080042.24353.48FA825B000DC54400005F2122218675169B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF02080106A102019C049D0E0C@att.net>

Hey Elisheva,

Good to see you here again.  We miss you too, maybe next year in Jerusalem!

Shabbat Shalom sister.

--
John C. 

"Be excellent to each other!" 
Bill and Ted 


-------------- Original message from "Betty Givin" <bkgivin at charter.net>: -------------- 


Dear brothers and sisters,
 
Just had to send you Sukkoth greetings and let you know how much I wish I could have been there with all of you.  I can picture you all gathered together at the lovely campground and quaint little synagogue and can see myself among you.  I am there with you in  spirit as I know are many others of us who were unable to attend.
 
I have had all of you in my heart and mind and pray that you will have a blessed time of learning and growing and sharing the love that HaShem has given all of us for one another, and the love that we have for Him.
 
We are still working 72-84 hours a week, so on Sabbath, I have been literally crashing; but I want to try to check in more often.
 
Love and miss you all and Shabbat Shalom, Hag Sameach!
 
Elisheva
 
 
 
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Sun Oct 19 01:03:54 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 16:03:54 +1000
Subject: [Dialogue] The Temple Institute: Hakhel 5769 on the Temple Mount
Message-ID: <48FACDCA.4070305@westnet.com.au>

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From rndavar at aol.com  Sun Oct 19 01:33:25 2008
From: rndavar at aol.com (Ross Nichols)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 06:33:25 +0000
Subject: [Dialogue] The Temple Institute: Hakhel 5769 on the Temple Mount
Message-ID: <1167928741-1224397940-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1203527180-@bxe130.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>

Yes, it was amazing. Joseph Good received the news while standing in the old Temple Sinai synagogue in St Francisville. I wondered how many people had even heard this "late breaking news". Glad you were able to listen in! We are settling in for the night at our campground. The weather is cool but nice here. 

Shalom, Ross
------Original Message------
From: Joe Indomenico
Sender: dialogue-bounces at rootsoffaith.org
To: Dialogue List
ReplyTo: Dialogue List
Sent: Oct 19, 2008 1:03 AM
Subject: [Dialogue] The Temple Institute: Hakhel 5769 on the Temple Mount

Shavua Tov and Chag Succot Sameach,
 
 I have just finished hearing the incredible news that was shared by Joe Good on Friday evening at the Succot Conference at the synagogue without walls. Just incredible!!!!!!
 
 For this to have happened "The Hakel" together with the inauguration of the "Kiyor Ha Nechoset" for the washing of the priests and not to mention the sounding of the Silver Trumpets is of epic miraculous proportions. Baruch HaShem!!!!!
 
 I am forwarding two articles ( amazing the media silence) to give you all a perspective on this amazing event.
 
 Shalom v'Ahavah
 JOE.
 http://www.templeinstitute.org/hakhel-on-the-temple-mount-5769.htm <http://www.templeinstitute.org/hakhel-on-the-temple-mount-5769.htm> 
 http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/127978 <http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/127978> 
 

Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T

From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sun Oct 19 12:34:58 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 13:34:58 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Parshat Bereshit
Message-ID: <855590370810191034u332fcd32nb6a3628b59862e4c@mail.gmail.com>

Shalom L'Kulchem,

     As we approach the end of the Sukkot Holiday, our thoughts already
begin to turn to Parshat Bereishit - the start of the annual cycle of Torah
readings.  Here's something to consider below:

     Chag Sameach!

           * Hanoch*
**

No 1245: 26 Tishrei 5769 (25 October 2008)



OPENING THE PARSHA



Why Were the Stories of Bereishit Written? - by Rabbi Yehoshua Shapira, Rosh
Yeshivat Ramat Gan



The book of Bereishit is full of exciting material. Even mature adults might
be fascinated by the story of Adam or by the mystery of the stolen goblet
which was found in Binyamin's bag. This is true even though we have read
these passages many times and have studied the many commentaries. It might
be more difficult to become deeply attached to other passages in the Torah,
such as the laws of different types of watchmen in the portion of Mishpatim,
which are most suitable for those with a legal mind, or the many details in
the portion of Ki Teitzei. This might indeed require that a person have a
halachic "sense" in order for it to be interesting when repeated very year.



But all of this did not impress Rabbi Yitzchak, as quoted by Rashi, who
asked the following famous question: "The Torah should have started with the
laws of 'This month is for you' [Shemot 12:2], which is the first mitzva
that was given to Bnei Yisrael. Why did it start with Bereishit?" This
statement leads us to a deeper question: What is the Torah in essence? Is it
the mitzvot, which indeed begin with the verse, "This month is for you"? Is
the most important facet the rebukes such as those which appear in the book
of Devarim? Could it be that what is most important is the adventures of our
ancestors as related in Bereishit?



The truth, as we can see, is that the Torah is a combination of all the
above elements. We must still analyze the different sections in order to
determine the role that each of them plays, so that we can understand why
the Torah begins with Bereishit. A story does not make any direct demands on
us. It does not contain detailed instructions about how to live a better
life. It involves not only righteous people but also evil ones such as Eisav
and Yishmael. And this is the reason that Bereishit contains elements which
do not appear in more explicit passages of the Torah.



In his introduction to his fables, Rabbi Nachman of Breslev wrote that since
the Torah did not have the proper effect he had no choice but to tell
stories. A story works in a roundabout way. It makes no attempt to introduce
something new and give a detailed message, rather it operates on the basic
assumptions deep within our consciousness. And because of this, with its
ambiguous language, it can have a deeper and more meaningful effect. The
events which happened to our ancestors symbolize the depths of the processes
which the offspring will experience during subsequent history. They give the
observance of the mitzvot meaning even in times of crisis and difficulty
which will happen to the offspring.



As far as we are concerned, this is especially relevant with respect to
Eretz Yisrael. Our attachment to the land is the very essence of the story
of our lives, much more than it is a specific commandment. This, Rabbi
Yitzchak says, is the key point of all the stories in the Torah. The holy
patriarchs, the expulsion of Hagar, the stealing of Yitzchak's blessings,
and the sale of Yosef by his brothers ? all of these elements are the
threads out of which the great link between the nation, the land, and the
Almighty is woven. With respect to this living absolute truth, the mitzva of
living in the land is but one junction in the basic Divine assumption stated
in the following verse, quoted by Rabbi Yitzchak: "He told his nation about
the power of His actions, in order to give them a heritage among the
nations" [Tehillim 111:6].
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From RNDAVAR at aol.com  Mon Oct 20 09:25:43 2008
From: RNDAVAR at aol.com (RNDAVAR at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 10:25:43 EDT
Subject: [Dialogue] Yosef Painting
Message-ID: <c01.4b57b0b8.362deee7@aol.com>

Many of you know Betty Eddy. She is part of our synagogue without walls.  
Some of you may not know that she is a remarkable artist. During Succoth last  
year she informed me that she wanted to make something for the our  synagogue.  
She wanted me to give her an idea of what to paint but I just  never got 
around to it. (I want make that mistake again:)
 
Well, Betty came to the conference this year with a most beautiful  painting. 
I absolutely LOVE this painting! It was the perfect gift and I would  even 
say it was inspired. It is now proudly displayed on the wall at Temple  Sinai. 
 
You can follow the link below to see this most incredible painting. You can  
have one of these as well. She has 8 X 10 as well as 14 X 20 available on her  
web site art gallery.  They are very reasonably priced I might add.
 
Everyone who longs for the day when Joseph will reveal himself to his  
brothers ought to have at least one copy of this painting.  Check it  out!
 
_Click here:  Joseph print_ 
(http://bettyeddy.com/art/flags.prints/joseph.html)  
 
Ross K.  Nichols 
_www.RootsofFaith.org_ (http://www.rootsoffaith.org/) 


**************New MapQuest Local shows what's happening at your destination.  
Dining, Movies, Events, News & more. Try it out 
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From RNDAVAR at aol.com  Mon Oct 20 09:32:10 2008
From: RNDAVAR at aol.com (RNDAVAR at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 10:32:10 EDT
Subject: [Dialogue] Re: [UILIST] Yosef Painting
Message-ID: <d5f.38627553.362df06a@aol.com>

Slight correction to my last email.  
 
I said "I want make that mistake again."  I meant to  say I won't make that 
mistake again".
 
I "wanted" to get this out before Bridget and Ty see  it:)
 
At any rate, I should also add that there are several other wonderful  
paintings on her site.
 
At some point in the next couple of days I will write some things on the  
conference.  We had a blast! In fact we still have more time at the  campground.
 
Ross K.  Nichols 
_www.RootsofFaith.org_ (http://www.rootsoffaith.org/) 


**************New MapQuest Local shows what's happening at your destination.  
Dining, Movies, Events, News & more. Try it out 
(http://local.mapquest.com/?ncid=emlcntnew00000002)
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From chattertonw at bellsouth.net  Tue Oct 21 07:59:19 2008
From: chattertonw at bellsouth.net (chattertonw at bellsouth.net)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 12:59:19 +0000
Subject: [Dialogue] Ezra Chatterton
Message-ID: <102120081259.9083.48FDD227000A68310000237B22230682329B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>

All,

Early this morning Ezra returned his spirit to The Father. He was at home, and his parents were with him, reading to him from The Word. Rhonda and I will be seeking HaSHeM's direction as to travel arrangements to California this week.

I want to thank all of you so much for your prayers and well wishes. May HaSHeM receive all the glory, and His will be done. I ask for continued prayer support for Micah (dad) and Elizebeth (mom), and Keith (my brother, Ezra's grandfather) and Christine (grandmother) during this difficult time.

Thank you again,

Glenn
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From correim at gninc.ca  Tue Oct 21 15:12:54 2008
From: correim at gninc.ca (Cornie Reimer)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 15:12:54 -0500
Subject: [Dialogue] Parshat Re'eh's Haftara
In-Reply-To: <BLU125-DS7F8DD265BE37ABCCCE6B8BA5A0@phx.gbl>
References: <ca6.329a51f2.35e8a996@aol.com>	<48BB49C8.4080400@gninc.ca><BLU125-DS64E8DED9A08BD6484470ABA5A0@phx.gbl>	<48C43383.1050605@gninc.ca>
	<BLU125-DS7F8DD265BE37ABCCCE6B8BA5A0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <48FE37C6.8050403@gninc.ca>

Pat, Joe, Steve, Hannoch, and all who may be interested. This is getting 
a bit of a long procession, but it reflects back to about a month and a 
half ago. Now an update on that: Truly I feel unworthy of what a 
privilege I had this last weekend. I had heard through the grapevine 
already that Jamie would like to come over to see his grandparents!!

Jamie is now on his own final choice, moved to a foster home in Winkler, 
about 1/2 an hour drive from his parents, and taking grade 10, and 
possibly in the same year if things go as he plans, he may take grade 
11.  (of course that means Hashem is the real planner) The Holdeman 
church allows only grade 9. His foster parents are from a Charismatic 
church, where he, the husband is the Pastor. It seems like they treat 
Jamie very well. Of course they expect him to go to their church, and he 
does.

I sold him my lap top computer for 30.00 just so he can feel he bought 
it. Now for the first time he is more permanently on the internet, and 
finally we can converse again which was so abruptly cut off  the first 
time.  And Baruch Hashem, I was granted the opportunity to introduce him 
him to the Sukkot holidays. To which I myself was quite green. I have a 
camera with which we can make short video's. I had improvised a simple 
Sukka in our back yard, in which Baruch Hashem I could share with him an 
experience of these festival  holiday's, with photo's I had taken years 
ago on a messianic Sukkot holiday season with a group of some 10 other 
people.  He could even hear the Shofar sounding in a CD. And we made 
some very interesting short video's which I was so sorry to find that I 
likely do not have them properly stored in the computer, and they seem 
to be lost. In one of them Jamie, for the first time in his life 
practiced playing "Mary had a Little Lamb"on my old accordion. We need 
to keep in mind, Jamie is coming out of prison, and even as he is coming 
out, prison is not necessarily all out of him. ( we had no musical 
instruments). But for a 16 year old, I am so amazed at the interest he 
is showing  as a seeker of truth.

I don't think it was a coincidence that I got  some books in the mail 
the very day I went to pick up Jamie. He stayed at our place for 2 
nights. One of the books I just got was titled "THE LOST PRINCESS" 
referring to emuna as the lost princess. Very good reading from Rabbi 
Shalom Arush. The first night before retiring he asked for some Jewish 
music CD's he was hungering for spiritual food, so, I just threw in this 
booklet of some 130 pages, with some CD's I had not even read the book 
myself till two days later. In the morning to my dismay that book was 
lying on my desk in my office. Thinking it likely was not reading of his 
choice, because surely he would not have read it through yet. But when I 
casually mentioned what he thought of that book he told me he had read 
it right through. I felt so unworthy to be the Sukkot host to such a 
hungering heart, it was painful, as I am so much of an infant in these 
matters myself. I will send you some photo's Hashem willing, where you 
can see some sun-beam reflecting from his otherwise so sober face. He is 
very quiet too, but taking it all in as if this is really a new world to 
him! And it was he himself who chose this way, as unpopular as it is 
around here, and really all over the world yet. He has a brilliant mind, 
studying in school is easy for him, but bodily he is under constant 
medication for his ailing kidney's. And also is well acquainted with 
pain from birth. Having had failing kidney's from before he was born.

He loves and is very respectful toward his grandmother too, who in turn 
would like to see Jamie to become a Christian, and Jamie realized the 
caution we needed to practice while he was with us, because after all, 
my dear wife and I live in two very different worlds. And we could not 
afford to disrespect her being in the same home. Jamie understood, and 
did a very good job of entertaining her as well. But in all I see this 
as a miracle again!!!!!!!!!

I will close now, I would have enjoyed being with all of you at the 
conference, maybe next year! O in the world to come.

Cornie



Pat Robbins wrote:
> TRULY THIS IS A MIRACLE, CORNIE!!!!!!  Thank you for sharing this 
> wonderful news with us!  BARUCH HASHEM for His great Loving-Kindness, 
> Mercy and Grace!!!!!\
>  
> I'll keep praying for dear Jamie, and for you too.
>  
> Love,
>  
> Pat
>
> *From:* Cornie Reimer
> *Sent:* Sunday, September 07, 2008 4:03 PM
> *To:* dialogue at rootsoffaith.org <mailto:dialogue at rootsoffaith.org>
> *Subject:* Re: [Dialogue] Parshat Re'eh's Haftara
>
>
> Pat, there is nothing to forgive you, I burst into tears when I read 
> your part below, directed to me, it just hit some cord in my heart, I 
> was so glad to hear such encouraging words concerning Cody and my 
> grandson Jamie. I will follow up on this and especially concerning 
> Jamie. But first, and this is to all of you dear ones, Joe for one so 
> special to my heart, from the other side of this globe. Truly I am so 
> awed, I do not find words to express what is going on in my heart!!!!!
>
> Let's just get down to earth a bit, I hope this won't get too long. I 
> am still living in a community where it seems so quiet. It seems like 
> life could just go on as usual, it seems like it would be so easy to 
> just take life for granted. That is one side of my life.
>
> BUT THAT WOULD JUST BE IMPOSSIBLE ANYMORE!!!!! Life can not go on as 
> usual. It is the month of Alul in 2008, ( I am a little mixed up what 
> year it is on the Jewish calendar year). I just finished watching the 
> 9 hr. movie "Against All Odds, Israel Survives" I just  went over  
> "Wake up Bnei  Israel" for the second time since it was sent by Joe, 
> and now sent by Betty as a reminder. What a mighty God we serve!!!! No 
> word's can describe it. I feel I should be doing something  in return 
> for what He is wooing me on. Will I be able to do justice in Techuva 
> to fill in that little consignment He has given me? Or have I even 
> been counted worthy of any consignment for the sake of Bnei Israel, my 
> family, or what ever? Maybe to Jamie. In my former influence I am 
> tempted to feel like a worm that can seemingly do so little, (yet a 
> worm can transform into a magnificent, Monarch Butterfly and migrate 
> to Mexico and land on the same hectar its great grandparents left to 
> come to the north that same spring) .
>
> As I mentioned earlier,  having watched "Against all Odds" in the 
> miracles of Israel in the past  60 or so years, I realized that Hashem 
> uses total unbelieving Jewish people to perform some of these 
> astounding miracles. And of course that makes an impression on their 
> heart as a result. I imagine that is precisely what He is doing with 
> me. He has formed me in my mothers womb, I am the clay, He is the 
> Potter. What He wants to do with this lump of clay is up to Him. 
> Fortunately not up to me. Although I can still choose to do what is 
> right, or whar is the wrong way.
>
> Do miracles happen to us too? Absolutely! Some times I take it for 
> granted at the time it happens. And here is an example of what I mean. 
> I have shared  some of what is going on with Jamie in the past, how he 
> left home at the age of 15,  quite strong in rebellion against his dad 
> and the local Mennonite church. He got taken into a home which he took 
> for granted was a Jewish setting in that home because they kept the 
> Sabbath, (they had left the Worldwide Church of God, still very strong 
> on the pagan virgin birth of the man, or prophet Yeshua.) I was 
> invited into that home one Sabbath in the 3 short weeks of his stay 
> there, while he was still there and tried so hard  to serve their 
> interests as compelling real it came to him that they where of the 
> same faith he had been rebelling against, although a totally different 
> church. But now he finally could get into the Internet, (which was 
> banned from him, if he did not have a business that needed it it's 
> use) And they helped him to get his own e-mail address, and for a week 
> or two, him and me could start to have e-mails flowing back and forth. 
> This was all stopped short again when he rebelled against these 
> people's control system, and was not allowed to stay with them any 
> longer, so he reluctantly went back to the Mennonite home he had 
> stayed with before. They took him in very reluctantly as well, because 
> of Jamie's rebellion against their church. I am still not up to the 
> miracle I wanted to share but it is coming, and may not seem to be 
> much of a miracle, but it was to me.
>
> Jamie's dad Ruben, (our youngest son, with a serious Bi-polar problem 
> , anger etc.) set up some very stern rules for Jamie to abide by 
> before he would be excepted to come back home. One of them, no 
> Internet in his computer. Jamie has been controlled and boxed in all 
> his life and finds it very difficult to make his own decisions. But 
> now Child and Family Services have already been involved for a while 
> since Ruben has had such bouts with anger and depression, especially 
> against Jamie, and because of his rough struggles in this area, Ruben 
> got expelled from the church, (he is out of the box to a point too, 
> but is still very religiously inclined in favor of the church) But 
> since he voluntarily turned himself in to a mental institute for 3 
> weeks, so they could find out how best they could help him. It was so 
> helpful for Ruben to a point that he excepted a challenge  to  run in 
> a  30 mile  bicycle  Marathon for a fund raiser  for this institute. 
> And Jamie,  already a month ahead of the event, agreed, to support his 
> dad, he would go with him in this Marathon. The day of the event was 
> this last Saturday (Shabbat) . I had a strong feeling that I should be 
> there to support my son. And since it had been going so rough between 
> the two the last while, I did not expect Jamie to be there. And for 
> one reason being he likely would not be fit to go on such a testing 
> Marathon, because of his health challenge with his kidney replaced etc..
>
> Now here is the miracle as I see it. Ruben and his wife Millie had to 
> have a meeting with the Child and Family support group, the day before 
> the Marathon, concerning the out come with Jamie. If Jamie would be 
> willing to go on his parents rules, he could go home, if not, Child 
> and Family Services would find a foster home for him. Jamie's sister 
> Stephenie was staying at our place Friday for the night on the 
> condition that I would take her along in the morning, where her 
> parents would meet us half way to the Marathon, still a half hour 
> drive from there. And low and behold Jamie was going to go on the 
> Marathon with his Dad after all, (and he told me later he had done it 
> for his dad) and he was along with them. Since they had 2 bikes along, 
> so they did not all have room on their van. And they allowed Jamie 
> alone to come with me!!!! Yuhoo!!!!And for the next limited half hour 
> we had all to ourself !!! We got to talk about serious matters that 
> had happened in the mean time. Which was the first time since I last 
> talked with him about a month ago we could share. They could have sent 
> along one of his sisters too, who both are church members already, and 
> we could not have had this privacy. But it did not happen. This was 
> the miracle. Jamie told me he had chosen to go to a foster home, but 
> it had been a very hard decision for him to make. And he told me 
> freely he was literally scarred of what would become of it. I told him 
> he likely made a good choice, and it did not matter if he even 
> sometimes would fail to make right choices, but he would gradually 
> learn to make right choices.
>
> I had the privilege to share with him that I had shared his struggle 
> with you people, and that he might be surprised how many people were 
> praying for him. He is grateful for that. Jamie did not share with me 
> about his faith, which seems to be badly shaken again. But he told me 
> on his own without me asking him, that he was not going to start with 
> drugs. Again, he was quite dejected though when he just could not make 
> the run with his bike, and had to be brought in with one of their 
> truck's. Ruben had stayed behind just waiting for his son again and 
> again, but after Jamie had to give it up and had take a truck  ride to 
> the barbecue. Ruben his dad made it, not nearly the last on this 30 
> mile run. There were over 100 bikes in all part taking, with a 
> barbecue and music festival in the end. I was very glad to have gone 
> to be with my son and grandson and the whole family through this all. 
> But I felt awfully sorry for Jamie, as he felt so dejected for a 
> while, and now the uncertainty of his future, where he will end up 
> having to stay. They would not for anything allow him to come and stay 
> with us his grandparents, and I am afraid Mary's health would not 
> allow it either. But I have a feeling he is in the hands of his maker. 
> And the end will turn out good. And we will see that it was all for 
> the good, Baruch Hashem. Sorry it got so long. I am going to read 
> Psalm 91 Thank you Pat, and all of you for your prayers.
>
> Cornie
>
>
>
> Pat Robbins wrote:
>> Please forgive me, Cornie.  I have only just now seen this email from 
>> you.  As I read it, I just kept hoping that somehow Jamie will get to 
>> talk to Cody (maybe they will get to talk on the internet), 
>> because I feel Cody could be an encouragement to him, and I know he 
>> would love to help if he can.  I will continue to pray for your dear 
>> grandson.  I can tell you from firsthand experience that HaSHem will 
>> work in Jamie's life in absolutely miraculous ways if he'll just keep 
>> seeking after Him. It continually amazes me to watch as He works in 
>> my nephew's life.  He has only been in Israel a couple of weeks now, 
>> and HaSHem is already opening incredible doors .  He was approached 
>> on the street and asked if he would be willing to do a commercial for 
>> Israel's version of a CNN-type, all-news network, called Israel World 
>> News.  He told the girl who asked him that he would love to do it, 
>> and has now already made a couple of spot commercials for them, which 
>> he is very excited about doing because he wrote me that,  "The plan 
>> is to reach 300 million to bring the truth to the world.  The idea is 
>> to call out the politicians on their scandals and bring a Zionist 
>> point of view to fight anti-Semitic propaganda around the world."  
>>  
>> This is HaSHem's doing. Cody is a stranger in the Land and this 
>> opportunity literally came to him!  He didn't even have to look 
>> for it.  What I'm trying to say is that though I worried so much over 
>> the years about his trying to make it on his own with his belief in 
>> the One G-d of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, HE WAS NEVER REALLY 
>> ALONE!!!!  G-d was leading him every step of the way, and He will 
>> lead Jamie too.  Try not to be too grieved over the difficulties you 
>> are seeing Jamie have to face.  Just keep praying, and we will keep 
>> praying too.  Our G-d is awesome!!!
>>  
>> I pray Psalm 91 over Cody, and I have him pray it over himself as 
>> well.  And now I'm praying it over Jamie.
>>  
>> CHAZAK, CHAZAK, DEAR FRIEND!!!!!  May HaSHem strengthen us all.
>>  
>> Love,
>>  
>> Pat   
>>  
>>  
>>  
>>  
>>  
>>  
>>  
>>
>> *From:* Cornie Reimer <mailto:correim at gninc.ca>
>> *Sent:* Sunday, August 31, 2008 9:47 PM
>> *To:* dialogue at rootsoffaith.org <mailto:dialogue at rootsoffaith.org>
>> *Subject:* Re: [Dialogue] Parshat Re'eh's Haftara
>>
>> My dear brothers and sisters
>> I woke up storm tossed and afflicted too, as it were. It is the time 
>> of Alul, for real even for an old man like me, one of no apparent 
>> significance at all, that is, if I were to hold on to what I have 
>> been made to believe for most of my entire life. I normally should 
>> sleep another 3 or 4 hours in order to be able to go to work at 7 in 
>> the morning. But since I found such a storm brewing in my mind. I 
>> decided to put my ear phones on and listen to the last part of a CD 
>> from Rabbi Lazer Brody called "Pleased yo meet you"! I had heard it a 
>> couple of times but had always fallen asleep before I heard it all. 
>> What I heard this time was brought to my attention that it is 
>> advisable to ask Hashem for advice about everything we face in life, 
>> if we desire His blessings on it.
>>
>> So instead of falling asleep again, the burden became heavier, so I 
>> was prompted to read the weekly (not the daily one) writing from 
>> Rabbi Abrahan Greenbaum. Which again prompted me to go to Joshua 8, 
>> referring to Joshua leading , to Israel's totally destroying every 
>> soul of their enemy in Ai, and burning the city. And it referred and 
>> led to all of Israel being gathered on the 2 mountains to hear the 
>> blessings and the curses, according to their choice, just before 
>> entering into the promised land. Now this was no child's play. To 
>> receive the blessings, always upon their choices, they would need to 
>> heed the advice of Hashem.
>>
>> I wonder if He hears my cry? In other words, am I heeding His advice 
>> when He clearly speaks to me? Or am I crusted over with a hard shell 
>> of Mennonitism yet, that Hashem can not get through to me? I lately 
>> shared about the case with my grandson Jamie, there was such a 
>> response from the group praying for Jamie. I felt comforted just to 
>> know that it did not rest on my prayers alone. I have since talked 
>> twice to Jamie's used to be host Cohen, for those 3 weeks, and have 
>> not had the chance to talk with Jamie himself. But what I have heard 
>> from Cohen, that German couple with whom Jamie was staying. And 
>> really he didn't have hardly anything good to say about Jamie. When 
>> or what I'm reading between the lines, is a little different than 
>> what he is saying though. Now , let's keep in mind, these people are 
>> Sabbath keepers, and have left a church of a couple of million 
>> members, but he does not want to reveal the name of that church.  It 
>> seems quite obvious though that could hardly be any other than the 
>> World Wide Church of God, the adventists. Very nice people, he is 
>> quite open too, but very easily seems to believe that demonic power 
>> is involved. So when Jamie had some Lazer Brody material brought into 
>> their house, they saw demons on the walls, so that stuff had to leave 
>> the house. He also confirmed quite clearly that Jamie was demon 
>> influenced, yet he did not turn against me for being the instigator 
>> of that Jewish material. Before Jamie left from their house he had 
>> told Cohen, (that is his first name) that he, Jamie was not Jewish 
>> minded anymore. I just find it a very hard to hear this being said 
>> about Jamie. When it is quite obvious that Jamie will have found 
>> himself short changed, thinking he was finally coming into a Jewish 
>> relations by staying with these people. Only to find they were 
>> Christians too. But I am so glad to have this consolation that some 
>> of you prayer wariours are or have been praying for him. Please don't 
>> quit!
>>
>> And Joe, when we talked you suggested that I should not try to lead 
>> Jamie, but just walk beside him, and allow him to make his own 
>> choices, but to let him know that I'll be there when he needs me. 
>> Beautiful advice. I realize it is OK even if he makes some wrong 
>> choices. And that really is all I did with Jamie, I allowed him to 
>> make choices. But seems like what took years to build up any interest 
>> in the chosen people of God for one like Jamie, can  in one stroke 
>> all be destroyed by these different, but well meaning Christians.  
>>
>> I do realize that for Jamie to find his way through this maze will 
>> take a miracle. His heart seems to be a bit hardened by what he has 
>> been through. 
>>
>> Cornie
>>
>>
>>    
>>
>>
>> YoungBarzel at aol.com wrote:
>>>
>>> Re-Counting the Prophets - Rabbi Pinchas Frankel 
>>> <http://www.ou.org/torah/frankel/haftarot/intro.htm>
>>>
>>> *Haftarah of Parshat **Re'eh **- 5760*
>>>
>>> *"Afflicted and Storm-Tossed One, and Not Comforted" 
>>> (Yeshayahu 54:11) *
>>>
>>> The Haftarah of Re'eh is the third of the "Haftarot of Consolation," 
>>> in the series of seven such Haftarot.  Both the Ashkenazic 
>>> <http://www.ou.org/about/judaism/a.htm#ashkenaz> and Sefardic 
>>> <http://www.ou.org/about/judaism/s.htm#sefard> communities take this 
>>> Haftarah from the Book of Yeshayahu, beginning with "Perek"/Chapter 
>>> 54, Verse 11, through (and including) Chapter 55, Verse 5.
>>>
>>> *Introduction *
>>>
>>> In the conversation that Avudraham constructs from these Haftarot, 
>>> among HaShem, His Prophets and the People of Israel, this is the one 
>>> in which the People of Israel complains that it is not comforted, 
>>> because it is receiving the consolation indirectly, from the 
>>> Prophets, rather than from HaShem.  Next week, the Master of the 
>>> Universe gets into the act, when He says, "I, even I (using the 
>>> unusual form 'Anochi) am the One Who comforts you" (Yeshayahu 
>>> 51:12).  But in truth, HaShem already has declared Himself to be the 
>>> "Menachem," the Comforter, in this Haftarah, where He says in the 
>>> first "Passuk" (54:11),
>>>
>>> "Behold, I ('Anochi') will set your stones in fair colors," 
>>> and again in "Passuk" (54:16), 
>>>
>>> "Behold, it is I ("Anochi") Who created the blacksmith, 
>>> Who blows fire on the coals, 
>>> And brings forth a weapon for his work, 
>>> And I ("Anochi") created the destroyer to undo him."  
>>>
>>> *The Haftarah - Translation and Commentary * 
>>>
>>> *Yeshayahu 54:11*
>>>
>>> "O afflicted and storm-tossed one,
>>> And not comforted,
>>> Behold, I will set your stones in fair colors,
>>> And lay your foundations with sapphires."  
>>>
>>> All the commentators relate this promise of comfort to 
>>> Yerushalayim.  Targum Yonatan says, "?the walls about which the 
>>> nations of the world said that you would never be comforted, HaShem 
>>> says, "I will lay its foundation with diamonds." **
>>>
>>> *Yeshayahu 54:12 *
>>>
>>> "And I will make your pinnacles of rubies,
>>> And your gates of iridescent diamonds;
>>> And all your borders of precious stone."  
>>>
>>> I will return to the City of Jerusalem, once a beautiful "wonder of 
>>> the world," its aspect of physical beauty.  But that's not all. **
>>>
>>> *Yeshayahu 54:13*
>>>
>>> "And all your children shall be taught by HaShem,
>>> And great will be the peace of your children."
>>>
>>> The situation will be the *opposite* of that described by Yirmiyahu 
>>> in the Haftarah of Parshat Masei (Yirmiyahu 2:8), the Second of the 
>>> "Haftarot of Punishment,"  
>>>
>>> "The Priests did not ask, 'Where is HaShem?'
>>> And the "scholars" of Torah did not know me?"
>>>
>>> RADAK points out that this idea *is like that* stated by Yirmiyahu,  
>>>
>>> "No longer will one person have to teach another, because everybody 
>>> will know Me, from children to adults."
>>>
>>> And this "Passuk" is also the source of the following Talmudic 
>>> statement (Masechet <http://www.ou.org/about/judaism/m.htm#masechet> 
>>> Berachot 64a), "Rabbi Elazar said in the name of Rabbi Chanina, 
>>> '*Torah scholars increase peace in the world,'* as it is said, 'And 
>>> all your children will be taught by  HaShem, and great will be the 
>>> peace of your children;' do not read 'your children' (banayich), but 
>>> 'your builders' (bonayich)." **
>>>
>>> *Yeshayahu 54:14*
>>>
>>> "In righteousness shall you be established -
>>> Stay far away from oppression,
>>> Then you will have no reason to fear,
>>> Or to feel terror,
>>> For they will not approach you."  
>>>
>>> You will once again be the City described in Yeshayahu 1:21 as "full 
>>> of Justice, in which Righteousness would lodge?" **
>>>
>>> *Yeshayahu 54:15-17*
>>>
>>> "Behold, they may gather together,
>>> But not be sent by Me,
>>> Whoever conspires against you will fall."
>>>
>>> "Behold, I have created the blacksmith,
>>> Who blows fire on the coals,
>>> Who brings forth a weapon for his work,
>>> But I have created the destroyer to undo him."  
>>>
>>> "No weapon made to attack you will succeed,
>>> And every tongue that speaks against you shall fail;
>>> This is the heritage of the servants of the L-rd
>>> And their just reward from Me,
>>> Says HaShem."  
>>>
>>> HaShem says, "I am the One Who brought against you enemies whose aim 
>>> was to  destroy you, such as Sancheriv and Nevuchadnezzar, because I 
>>> used them to punish  you when you rebelled against Me.  But now, 
>>> your enemies have no authorization from  Me.  They are Gog and 
>>> Magog, who will fight against you immediately prior to the  Coming 
>>> of the Mashiach, and be defeated by you.  And when they attack you 
>>> in the  Halls of "Diplomacy" (such as the UN, Oslo or Wye (Why 
>>> indeed?)), with false speech,  where you will find "Long has my soul 
>>> dwelt with those who hate peace; I am for peace - but when I speak, 
>>> they are plotting for war" ("Tehillim"/Psalms 120:7), I will help 
>>> you defeat them there as well."
>>>
>>> The following chapter in Yeshayahu is dedicated to two great themes: 
>>> Torah and Teshuvah 
>>> <http://www.ou.org/about/judaism/tw.htm#teshuvah>, Repentance.  The 
>>> first five P'sukim, that are part of our Haftarah, deal with Torah, 
>>> the precious gift from HaShem to us and, through us, to humanity at 
>>> large.  The rest of the Perek deals with Teshuvah and, 
>>> appropriately, is read as the Haftarah on a "Taanit Tzibbur," a 
>>> Public Fast Day, the purpose of which is the arousal of feelings of 
>>> Repentance.
>>>
>>> *Yeshayahu 55:1*
>>>
>>> "Ho, everyone who is thirsty, come for water;
>>> And he that has no money,
>>> Come, buy and eat,
>>> Come buy wine and milk
>>> Without money and without price."
>>>
>>> "Mayim," the "Drink of Life," means here and in many other 
>>> locations, the Torah.  Here, Yeshayahu points to our priceless 
>>> possession, the Torah.  
>>>
>>> The Torah, for our People, is as vital as is water.  We are destined 
>>> to be Teachers of Torah to the world, who ultimately will seek it 
>>> and value it as they do food and drink.
>>>
>>> *Yeshayahu 55:2*  
>>>
>>> "Why do you spend your money on that which is not bread?
>>> And you expend effort to purchase 
>>> That which does not satisfy?
>>> Listen carefully to Me and eat that which is good,
>>> And let your soul delight in richness!"
>>>
>>> RADAK understands this Passuk as strongly advocating the study of 
>>> Torah, which is called "good" in the verse, "for I have given you a 
>>> *good teaching*; do not forsake My Torah!" ("Mishlei"/Proverbs 4:2)
>>>
>>> And further, that the part of the Passuk that speaks of delighting 
>>> the soul also speaks of the Torah, and is referring to the 
>>> World-to-Come, for just as something that is fat and rich delights 
>>> the body, so is the Torah a delight for the soul.
>>>
>>> *Yeshayahu 55:3*
>>>
>>> "Incline your ear, and come to Me,
>>> Hear, and your soul shall live,
>>> And I will make an everlasting covenant with you,
>>> Like the everlasting kindnesses I have shown to David." 
>>>
>>> RADAK understands this Passuk as referring to the time of the 
>>> Mashiach, when the everlasting kindness that HaShem showed to David 
>>> will be revealed in the person of the Mashiach, who will be a 
>>> descendant of the House of David.
>>>
>>> Metzudat David also understands the Passuk to mean "Obey Me, and you 
>>> will merit to be brought back to life at the time of the Mashiach."
>>>
>>> *Yeshayahu 55:4*
>>>
>>> "Behold I have given him as a witness to the nations,
>>> A prince and a commander for the nations."  
>>>
>>> RADAK again relates this Passuk to the Mashiach, whose greatness 
>>> will compel the nations of the world to accept him as their commander.
>>>
>>> *Yeshayahu 55:5*
>>>
>>> "Behold you shall call a nation that you did not know,
>>> And a nation who did not know of you
>>> Will now run to you;
>>> Because HaShem your G-d,
>>> The Holy One of Israel,
>>> Has glorified you."
>>>
>>> Metzudat David explains that just as I have fulfilled My kindness 
>>> with David, will I fulfill My Promise of Kindness to you.  And this 
>>> will be manifested in that nations from the ends of the earth will 
>>> come and do your bidding, because they sense in your behavior the 
>>> special quality of holiness, implanted in you by the Presence in 
>>> your midst of the Holy One of Israel.
>>>
>>> *Rabbi Pinchas Frankel*
>>>
>>> /Rabbi Frankel is an Educational C //oordinator at the OU /
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> It's only a deal if it's where /you/ want to go. Find your travel 
>>> deal *here* 
>>> <http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv00050000000047>.
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>   
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> _______________________________________________
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>   
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> _______________________________________________
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
>   

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From patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com  Tue Oct 21 17:05:20 2008
From: patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com (Pat Robbins)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 18:05:20 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Ezra Chatterton
In-Reply-To: <102120081259.9083.48FDD227000A68310000237B22230682329B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>
References: <102120081259.9083.48FDD227000A68310000237B22230682329B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>
Message-ID: <BLU125-DS479012361B8AB98087A51BA2E0@phx.gbl>

Glenn, I'm so sorry to hear this news, and will be praying for your family.  Thank you for having shared your precious Ezra with us, and for having given us the privilege to pray with you during his brave and gallant struggle.

Pat  


From: chattertonw at bellsouth.net 
Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 8:59 AM
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
Subject: [Dialogue] Ezra Chatterton


All,

Early this morning Ezra returned his spirit to The Father. He was at home, and his parents were with him, reading to him from The Word. Rhonda and I will be seeking HaSHeM's direction as to travel arrangements to California this week.

I want to thank all of you so much for your prayers and well wishes. May HaSHeM receive all the glory, and His will be done. I ask for continued prayer support for Micah (dad) and Elizebeth (mom), and Keith (my brother, Ezra's grandfather) and Christine (grandmother) during this difficult time.

Thank you again,

Glenn


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


_______________________________________________
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From tposborne77 at yahoo.com  Tue Oct 21 17:47:58 2008
From: tposborne77 at yahoo.com (Tracy Osborne)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 15:47:58 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Dialogue] Ezra Chatterton
Message-ID: <357251.5377.qm@web51109.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

So sad for you and your family. May HaShem comfort and strengthen all in the midst of your grief.

Tracy




________________________________
From: "chattertonw at bellsouth.net" <chattertonw at bellsouth.net>
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
Sent: Tuesday, October 21, 2008 8:59:19 AM
Subject: [Dialogue] Ezra Chatterton


All,

Early this morning Ezra returned his spirit to The Father. He was at home, and his parents were with him, reading to him from The Word. Rhonda and I will be seeking HaSHeM's direction as to travel arrangements to California this week.

I want to thank all of you so much for your prayers and well wishes. May HaSHeM receive all the glory, and His will be done. I ask for continued prayer support for Micah (dad) and Elizebeth (mom), and Keith (my brother, Ezra's grandfather) and?Christine (grandmother) during this difficult time.

Thank you again,

Glenn

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 
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From jamesdtabor at earthlink.net  Tue Oct 21 19:43:41 2008
From: jamesdtabor at earthlink.net (James Tabor)
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 20:43:41 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Ezra Chatterton
In-Reply-To: <102120081259.9083.48FDD227000A68310000237B22230682329B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>
References: <102120081259.9083.48FDD227000A68310000237B22230682329B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>
Message-ID: <7F4FA044-FB6A-411B-8E7B-9AFA131990B5@earthlink.net>

So sorry to hear this...

Love to all,

James


On Oct 21, 2008, at 8:59 AM, chattertonw at bellsouth.net wrote:

> All,
>
> Early this morning Ezra returned his spirit to The Father. He was at  
> home, and his parents were with him, reading to him from The Word.  
> Rhonda and I will be seeking HaSHeM's direction as to travel  
> arrangements to California this week.
>
> I want to thank all of you so much for your prayers and well wishes.  
> May HaSHeM receive all the glory, and His will be done. I ask for  
> continued prayer support for Micah (dad) and Elizebeth (mom), and  
> Keith (my brother, Ezra's grandfather) and Christine (grandmother)  
> during this difficult time.
>
> Thank you again,
>
> Glenn
> _______________________________________________



From jid at westnet.com.au  Tue Oct 21 20:07:52 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2008 11:07:52 +1000
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] Ezra Chatterton]
Message-ID: <48FE7CE8.8080605@westnet.com.au>

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From: chattertonw at bellsouth.net
Subject: [Dialogue] Ezra Chatterton
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2008 12:59:19 +0000
Size: 6293
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From j.h.lusk234 at sbcglobal.net  Wed Oct 22 04:19:46 2008
From: j.h.lusk234 at sbcglobal.net (Helen Lusk)
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2008 02:19:46 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Dialogue] Ezra Chatterton
In-Reply-To: <102120081259.9083.48FDD227000A68310000237B22230682329B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>
Message-ID: <770225.8093.qm@web82505.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

So sad to hear the news of Ezra's passing. My heart felt sympathy goes out to the entire family and pray that Hashem will comfort you all. May this all turn out for something?good in the end. Psalm 23 is so fitting at time like these.
?
KInd regards,
Helen

--- On Tue, 10/21/08, chattertonw at bellsouth.net <chattertonw at bellsouth.net> wrote:

From: chattertonw at bellsouth.net <chattertonw at bellsouth.net>
Subject: [Dialogue] Ezra Chatterton
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
Date: Tuesday, October 21, 2008, 8:59 AM



All,
?
Early this morning Ezra returned his spirit to The Father. He was at home, and his parents were with him, reading to him from The Word. Rhonda and I will be seeking HaSHeM's direction as to travel arrangements to California this week.
?
I want to thank all of you so much for your prayers and well wishes. May HaSHeM receive all the glory, and His will be done. I ask for continued prayer support for Micah (dad) and Elizebeth (mom), and Keith (my brother, Ezra's grandfather) and?Christine (grandmother) during this difficult time.
?
Thank you again,
?
Glenn_______________________________________________
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Wed Oct 22 15:45:25 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2008 06:45:25 +1000
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] Parshat Bereshit]
Message-ID: <48FF90E5.2090102@westnet.com.au>

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From: "Hanoch Young" <youngbarzel at gmail.com>
Subject: [Dialogue] Parshat Bereshit
Date: Sun, 19 Oct 2008 13:34:58 -0400
Size: 17160
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Wed Oct 22 20:14:12 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2008 18:14:12 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] What is Israel waiting for?? Nuke Iran NOW!
Message-ID: <855590370810221814l17579c6ej8fd74852dc55d44d@mail.gmail.com>

Hijacked Iranian Ship was a Dirty Bomb Meant for Israel on Yom Kippur

- Oct 20, 2008
Pat Dollard


On August 21st, 2008, the MV Iran Deyant, 44,458 dead weight bulk carrier
was heading towards the Suez Canal. As it was passing the Horn of Africa,
about 80 miles southeast of al-Makalla in Yemen, the ship was surrounded by
speedboats filled with members of a gang of Somalian pirates who grab
suitable commercial ships and hold them and their cargos and crews for
ransom. The captain was defenseless against the 40 pirates armed with AK-47s
and rocket-propelled grenades blocking his passage. He had little choice
other than to turn his ship over to them.

What the pirates were not banking on, however, was that this was no ordinary
ship.

The MV Iran Deyanat is owned and operated by the Islamic Republic of Iran
Shipping Lines (IRISL) - a state-owned company run by the Iranian military
that was sanctioned by the U.S. Department of the Treasury on September 10,
shortly after the ship's hijacking.

According to the U.S. Government, the company regularly falsifies shipping
documents in order to hide the identity of end users, uses generic terms to
describe shipments to avoid the attention of shipping authorities, and
employs the use of cover entities to circumvent United Nations sanctions to
facilitate weapons proliferation for the Iranian Ministry of Defense. The MV
Iran Deyanat departed Nanjing, China, July 28, and, according to its
manifest, planned to sail to Rotterdam, where it would offload 42,500 tons
of iron ore and "industrial products" purchased by an unidentified " German
client". The ship has a crew of 29 men, including a Pakistani captain, an
Iranian engineer, 13 other Iranians, 3 Indians, 2 Filipinos, and 10 Eastern
Europeans, stated to be Albanians.

The MV Iran Deyanat was brought to Eyl, a sleepy fishing village in
northeastern Somalia, and was secured by a larger gang of pirates - 50
onboard and 50 onshore. The Somali pirates attempted to inspect the ship's
seven cargo containers but the containers were locked. The crew claimed that
they did not have the "access codes" and could not open them. Pirates have
stated they were unable to open the hold without causing extensive damage to
the ship, and threatened to blow it up. The Iranian ship's captain and the
engineer were contacted by cell phone and demanded to disclose the actual
nature of the mysterious "powdered cargo" but the captain and his officers
were very evasive.

Initially they said that the cargo contained "crude oil" but then claimed it
contained "minerals." Following this initial rebuff, the pirates broke open
one of the containers and discovered it to be filled with packets of what
they said was "a powdery fine sandy soil" ?.

Within a period of three days, those pirates who had boarded the ship and
opened the cargo container with its gritty sand-like contents, all developed
strange health complications, to include serious skin burns and loss of
hair. And within two weeks, sixteen of the pirates subsequently died, either
on the ship or on shore.

News about the illness and the toxic cargo quickly reached Garowe, seat of
the government for the autonomous region of Puntland. Angered over the wave
of piracy and suspicious about the Iranian ship, authorities dispatched a
delegation led by Minister of Minerals and Oil Hassan Allore Osman to
investigate the situation on September 4. and they witnessed some of the
deaths due to exposure to 'something on that ship.'

The Somali pirates initially set the ship's ransom at $2 million and the
Iranian government provided $200,000 to a local broker "to facilitate the
exchange." The $2 million dollar ransom agreement, which was supposedly
secured on September 6th, never took place for reasons unknown. After
September 10th, sanctions on IRISL were applied specifically because the
company was said to be engaged in illicit operations on behalf of the
Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps.

Serious negotiations were broken off completely. Iranian authorities
subsequently denied that it agreed to the price nor had paid any money to
the pirates. Nevertheless, after sanctions were applied to IRISL on
September 10, Osman says, the Iranians told the pirates that the deal was
off.

"They told the pirates that they could not come because of the presence of
the U.S. Navy." The region is patrolled by the multinational Combined
Taskforce 150, which includes ships from the U.S. Navy's Fifth Fleet.
Subsequently, it was disclosed that the U.S. government had offered to pay
$7 million to the pirates to "receive entry permission and search the
vessel." Officials in the Pentagon and the Department of State have
consistently refused to comment on the situation.

The exact nature of the cargo remains officially a mystery but officials in
Puntland and Baidoa are convinced the ship was carrying weapons to Eritrea
for Islamist insurgents. "We cannot inspect the cargo yet," Osman said, "but
we are sure that it is weapons."

The US Navy (and the French and the Russians) have been hove to off the
coast of Eyl, going anywhere once released, it will be seized once it gets
to sea. The specific clauses that have been approved in both the UN and in
Congress would allow the US Navy to seize the ship under the suspicion
clause. The claims that there are weapons onboard, and the possibility there
might be chemical weapons, has insured there is at the very minimum, an
inspection of the ship by outside authority will be mandated. At this
writing, the MV Iran Deyanat is at anchor, watched closely by American,
French and Russian naval units.

Although American intelligence and government sources are maintaining a
strictly observed silence, the same does not apply to the Russians and so it
is that we learn the real story of the MV Iran Deyanat. She was an enormous
floating dirty bomb, intended to detonate after exiting the Suez Canal at
the eastern end of the Mediterranean and in proximity to the coastal cities
of Israel. The entire cargo of radioactive sand, obtained by Iran from China
(the latter buys desperately needed oil from the former) and sealed in
containers which, when the charges on the ship are set off after the crew
took to the boats, will be blasted high into the air where prevailing winds
will push the highly dangerous and radioactive cloud ashore.

*Given the large number of deaths from the questing Somali pirates, it
should be obvious that when the contents of the ship's locked cargo
containers finally descended onto the land, the death toll would be
enormous. This ship was nothing more nor less than the long-anticipated
Iranian attack on Israel. Not the expected rocket attacks (which could be
intercepted by the Israelis) but an even more deadly and unexpected attack
by sea.. It is very interesting to note that the Israeli government has in
the past few weeks, been loudly demanding that the United States establish a
naval blockade of Iran.

The reason for this blockade would be to prevent any more Iranian ships with
deadly cargos from attacking either Israel or other targets from the sea.*





3965 W. 83rd. Street #292 Shawnee Mission, KS 66208 I Phone: 913.648.0022 I
Fax: 913.648.7997
This site is designed for standards compliant browsers. If your browser is
not standards compliant, download one
here<http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/>
.
Website copyright (c) 2006. Unity Coalition for Israel.
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Thu Oct 23 01:24:13 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2008 23:24:13 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] Ezra Chatterton
In-Reply-To: <357251.5377.qm@web51109.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
References: <357251.5377.qm@web51109.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <855590370810222324m5f54f135ubc4c30e9acd273da@mail.gmail.com>

Glenn,

     I am so sorry to hear this news.  May the entire family be comforted by
HaShem, as HE does for the mourners of Tzion & Yerushalayim.

              *  Hanoch
*
On Tue, Oct 21, 2008 at 3:47 PM, Tracy Osborne <tposborne77 at yahoo.com>wrote:

>  So sad for you and your family. May HaShem comfort and strengthen all in
> the midst of your grief.
>
> Tracy
>
>  ------------------------------
> *From:* "chattertonw at bellsouth.net" <chattertonw at bellsouth.net>
> *To:* dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
> *Sent:* Tuesday, October 21, 2008 8:59:19 AM
> *Subject:* [Dialogue] Ezra Chatterton
>
> All,
>
> Early this morning Ezra returned his spirit to The Father. He was at home,
> and his parents were with him, reading to him from The Word. Rhonda and I
> will be seeking HaSHeM's direction as to travel arrangements to California
> this week.
>
> I want to thank all of you so much for your prayers and well wishes. May
> HaSHeM receive all the glory, and His will be done. I ask for continued
> prayer support for Micah (dad) and Elizebeth (mom), and Keith (my brother,
> Ezra's grandfather) and Christine (grandmother) during this difficult time.
>
> Thank you again,
>
> Glenn
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Thu Oct 23 01:47:32 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2008 23:47:32 -0700
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] Parshat Bereshit]
In-Reply-To: <48FF90E5.2090102@westnet.com.au>
References: <48FF90E5.2090102@westnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <855590370810222347m146b8311p7ae560109c1313f3@mail.gmail.com>

Shalom Joe,

    I hope you enjoyed the Chagim; you know - it's going to seem weird next
week, without a holiday!

     Thanks very much for sharing what you did - I had never heard that
about David and Goliath before - very interesting...I'm going to have to sit
and study that a bit this coming Shabbat (which is all of about 38 hours, or
so, from now, LOL).

     Take care and keep those posts coming!  :-)

     B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,
                 *   Hanoch*



2008/10/22 JOE INDOMENICO <jid at westnet.com.au>

> *Shalom Hanoch,
>
> this is a very interesting point that you have raised.
> I too have pondered  these issues over the years especially during the
> period of Simchat Torah.
> Sefer Bereshit underlines the unity of HaShem, His nation and His land.
>
> There is an interesting confrontation in 1 Samuel 17 between David and
> Goliath which I have always found fascinating:
>
> **?*  ????????? ??????? ????????, ??????????-??? ?????????
> ????????-???????? ???-???????? ????????? ????? ???????? ???????? ??????-???
> ?????????????--????????? ???????; ??????????, ???-??????????????. *40* And
> he took his staff in his hand, and chose him *five smooth stones* out of
> the brook, and put them in the shepherd's bag which he had, even in his
> scrip; and his sling was in his hand; and he drew near to the Philistine.
> *
> My personal belief is that these five stones represent the 5 books of the
> Torah. Notice that they are smooth by the action of running (living) water
> over them.
>
> Now, which stone did David choose to overcome and kill Goliath?
>
> *  *??*  ??????????? ?????? ???-????? ???-????????, ????????? ???????
> ????? ??????????, ??????? ???-??????????????, ???-???????; ???????????
> ??????? ??????????, ????????? ???-??????? ???????. *49* And David put his
> hand in his bag, and took thence *a stone, *and slung it, and smote the
> Philistine in his forehead; and the stone sank into his forehead, and he
> fell upon his face to the earth.  *?*  ?????????? ??????
> ???-?????????????? ????????? ?????????, ??????? ???-??????????????
> ???????????; ???????, ???? ??????-??????. *50* So David prevailed over the
> Philistine with a sling *and with a stone, *and smote the Philistine, and
> slew him; but there was no sword in the hand of David.
>
>
> *My belief is that the stone that delivered the knock out blow was the
> book of Bereshit
> **
> **There is a Midrash that explains that in the future there will be a
> controversy that Yisrael ( David ) stole the land from the surrounding
> nations and will be accused and confronted by the world ( Goliath ). The
> Holy One, blessed be He will explain that it is written in the foundational
> book of his Word that the ownership of Eretz Yisrael is His and He has the
> right to bequeath it to His people at the expense of the surrounding 7
> Canaanite nations.
> Mashiach ben David will utter these words of the Holy One , blessed be He.
>
> There is another Midrash that asks the question ," why is the first letter
> of the Torah a "B" and not an "A" ?
> In the first sentence there are 3 cryptic letters , the Aleph ( first
> letter), the Mem (middle letter of the Hebrew alphabet), and the Tav ( the
> last letter). Aleph, Mem, Tav spells "EMET" ( TRUTH) in Hebrew.
> So the Rabbis deduce that the beginning of HaShem's word is TRUTH.
>
> So the Torah begins with Bereshit at the expense of Shemot (Exodus) for the
> sake of Truth of HaShem's Name, the Truth of the election of His nation and
> the Truth of the election of His land.
>
> This is the Achdut of Sefer Bereshit.
>
> I hope you all had a joyous Simchat Torah.
> May we all have a wonderful new re-beginning as we embark on our quest for
> EMET.
>
> Shalom v'Ahavah
> JOE.
> *
>
>  Shalom L'Kulchem,
>
>      As we approach the end of the Sukkot Holiday, our thoughts already
> begin to turn to Parshat Bereishit - the start of the annual cycle of Torah
> readings.  Here's something to consider below:
>
>      Chag Sameach!
>
>            * Hanoch*
> **
>
> No 1245: 26 Tishrei 5769 (25 October 2008)
>
>
>
> OPENING THE PARSHA
>
>
>
> Why Were the Stories of Bereishit Written? - by Rabbi Yehoshua Shapira,
> Rosh Yeshivat Ramat Gan
>
>
>
> The book of Bereishit is full of exciting material. Even mature adults
> might be fascinated by the story of Adam or by the mystery of the stolen
> goblet which was found in Binyamin's bag. This is true even though we have
> read these passages many times and have studied the many commentaries. It
> might be more difficult to become deeply attached to other passages in the
> Torah, such as the laws of different types of watchmen in the portion of
> Mishpatim, which are most suitable for those with a legal mind, or the many
> details in the portion of Ki Teitzei. This might indeed require that a
> person have a halachic "sense" in order for it to be interesting when
> repeated very year.
>
>
>
> But all of this did not impress Rabbi Yitzchak, as quoted by Rashi, who
> asked the following famous question: "The Torah should have started with the
> laws of 'This month is for you' [Shemot 12:2], which is the first mitzva
> that was given to Bnei Yisrael. Why did it start with Bereishit?" This
> statement leads us to a deeper question: What is the Torah in essence? Is it
> the mitzvot, which indeed begin with the verse, "This month is for you"? Is
> the most important facet the rebukes such as those which appear in the book
> of Devarim? Could it be that what is most important is the adventures of our
> ancestors as related in Bereishit?
>
>
>
> The truth, as we can see, is that the Torah is a combination of all the
> above elements. We must still analyze the different sections in order to
> determine the role that each of them plays, so that we can understand why
> the Torah begins with Bereishit. A story does not make any direct demands on
> us. It does not contain detailed instructions about how to live a better
> life. It involves not only righteous people but also evil ones such as Eisav
> and Yishmael. And this is the reason that Bereishit contains elements which
> do not appear in more explicit passages of the Torah.
>
>
>
> In his introduction to his fables, Rabbi Nachman of Breslev wrote that
> since the Torah did not have the proper effect he had no choice but to tell
> stories. A story works in a roundabout way. It makes no attempt to introduce
> something new and give a detailed message, rather it operates on the basic
> assumptions deep within our consciousness. And because of this, with its
> ambiguous language, it can have a deeper and more meaningful effect. The
> events which happened to our ancestors symbolize the depths of the processes
> which the offspring will experience during subsequent history. They give the
> observance of the mitzvot meaning even in times of crisis and difficulty
> which will happen to the offspring.
>
>
>
> As far as we are concerned, this is especially relevant with respect to
> Eretz Yisrael. Our attachment to the land is the very essence of the story
> of our lives, much more than it is a specific commandment. This, Rabbi
> Yitzchak says, is the key point of all the stories in the Torah. The holy
> patriarchs, the expulsion of Hagar, the stealing of Yitzchak's blessings,
> and the sale of Yosef by his brothers ? all of these elements are the
> threads out of which the great link between the nation, the land, and the
> Almighty is woven. With respect to this living absolute truth, the mitzva of
> living in the land is but one junction in the basic Divine assumption stated
> in the following verse, quoted by Rabbi Yitzchak: "He told his nation about
> the power of His actions, in order to give them a heritage among the
> nations" [Tehillim 111:6].
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
> Version: 8.0.173 / Virus Database: 270.8.1/1732 - Release Date: 10/18/2008
> 6:01 PM
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
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From creechmargie at yahoo.com  Thu Oct 23 05:50:23 2008
From: creechmargie at yahoo.com (Margie Creech)
Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2008 03:50:23 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Dialogue] What is Israel waiting for?? Nuke Iran NOW!
In-Reply-To: <855590370810221814l17579c6ej8fd74852dc55d44d@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <687938.66953.qm@web58502.mail.re3.yahoo.com>

I agree!? The longer they wait the more dangerous the situation becomes.? Praise be to Hashem as He watches over Israel!? 

--- On Wed, 10/22/08, Hanoch Young <youngbarzel at gmail.com> wrote:

From: Hanoch Young <youngbarzel at gmail.com>
Subject: [Dialogue] What is Israel waiting for?? Nuke Iran NOW!
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
Date: Wednesday, October 22, 2008, 8:14 PM


Hijacked Iranian Ship was a Dirty Bomb Meant for Israel on Yom Kippur 
- Oct 20, 2008 
Pat Dollard 


On August 21st, 2008, the MV Iran Deyant, 44,458 dead weight bulk carrier was heading towards the Suez Canal. As it was passing the Horn of Africa, about 80 miles southeast of al-Makalla in Yemen, the ship was surrounded by speedboats filled with members of a gang of Somalian pirates who grab suitable commercial ships and hold them and their cargos and crews for ransom. The captain was defenseless against the 40 pirates armed with AK-47s and rocket-propelled grenades blocking his passage. He had little choice other than to turn his ship over to them.

What the pirates were not banking on, however, was that this was no ordinary ship.

The MV Iran Deyanat is owned and operated by the Islamic Republic of Iran Shipping Lines (IRISL) - a state-owned company run by the Iranian military that was sanctioned by the U.S. Department of the Treasury on September 10, shortly after the ship's hijacking. 

According to the U.S. Government, the company regularly falsifies shipping documents in order to hide the identity of end users, uses generic terms to describe shipments to avoid the attention of shipping authorities, and employs the use of cover entities to circumvent United Nations sanctions to facilitate weapons proliferation for the Iranian Ministry of Defense. The MV Iran Deyanat departed Nanjing, China, July 28, and, according to its manifest, planned to sail to Rotterdam, where it would offload 42,500 tons of iron ore and "industrial products" purchased by an unidentified " German client". The ship has a crew of 29 men, including a Pakistani captain, an Iranian engineer, 13 other Iranians, 3 Indians, 2 Filipinos, and 10 Eastern Europeans, stated to be Albanians.

The MV Iran Deyanat was brought to Eyl, a sleepy fishing village in northeastern Somalia, and was secured by a larger gang of pirates - 50 onboard and 50 onshore. The Somali pirates attempted to inspect the ship's seven cargo containers but the containers were locked. The crew claimed that they did not have the "access codes" and could not open them. Pirates have stated they were unable to open the hold without causing extensive damage to the ship, and threatened to blow it up. The Iranian ship's captain and the engineer were contacted by cell phone and demanded to disclose the actual nature of the mysterious "powdered cargo" but the captain and his officers were very evasive.

Initially they said that the cargo contained "crude oil" but then claimed it contained "minerals." Following this initial rebuff, the pirates broke open one of the containers and discovered it to be filled with packets of what they said was "a powdery fine sandy soil" ?.

Within a period of three days, those pirates who had boarded the ship and opened the cargo container with its gritty sand-like contents, all developed strange health complications, to include serious skin burns and loss of hair. And within two weeks, sixteen of the pirates subsequently died, either on the ship or on shore.

News about the illness and the toxic cargo quickly reached Garowe, seat of the government for the autonomous region of Puntland. Angered over the wave of piracy and suspicious about the Iranian ship, authorities dispatched a delegation led by Minister of Minerals and Oil Hassan Allore Osman to investigate the situation on September 4. and they witnessed some of the deaths due to exposure to 'something on that ship.' 

The Somali pirates initially set the ship's ransom at $2 million and the Iranian government provided $200,000 to a local broker "to facilitate the exchange." The $2 million dollar ransom agreement, which was supposedly secured on September 6th, never took place for reasons unknown. After September 10th, sanctions on IRISL were applied specifically because the company was said to be engaged in illicit operations on behalf of the Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps.

Serious negotiations were broken off completely. Iranian authorities subsequently denied that it agreed to the price nor had paid any money to the pirates. Nevertheless, after sanctions were applied to IRISL on September 10, Osman says, the Iranians told the pirates that the deal was off.

"They told the pirates that they could not come because of the presence of the U.S. Navy." The region is patrolled by the multinational Combined Taskforce 150, which includes ships from the U.S. Navy's Fifth Fleet. Subsequently, it was disclosed that the U.S. government had offered to pay $7 million to the pirates to "receive entry permission and search the vessel." Officials in the Pentagon and the Department of State have consistently refused to comment on the situation. 

The exact nature of the cargo remains officially a mystery but officials in Puntland and Baidoa are convinced the ship was carrying weapons to Eritrea for Islamist insurgents. "We cannot inspect the cargo yet," Osman said, "but we are sure that it is weapons." 

The US Navy (and the French and the Russians) have been hove to off the coast of Eyl, going anywhere once released, it will be seized once it gets to sea. The specific clauses that have been approved in both the UN and in Congress would allow the US Navy to seize the ship under the suspicion clause. The claims that there are weapons onboard, and the possibility there might be chemical weapons, has insured there is at the very minimum, an inspection of the ship by outside authority will be mandated. At this writing, the MV Iran Deyanat is at anchor, watched closely by American, French and Russian naval units.

Although American intelligence and government sources are maintaining a strictly observed silence, the same does not apply to the Russians and so it is that we learn the real story of the MV Iran Deyanat. She was an enormous floating dirty bomb, intended to detonate after exiting the Suez Canal at the eastern end of the Mediterranean and in proximity to the coastal cities of Israel. The entire cargo of radioactive sand, obtained by Iran from China (the latter buys desperately needed oil from the former) and sealed in containers which, when the charges on the ship are set off after the crew took to the boats, will be blasted high into the air where prevailing winds will push the highly dangerous and radioactive cloud ashore.

Given the large number of deaths from the questing Somali pirates, it should be obvious that when the contents of the ship's locked cargo containers finally descended onto the land, the death toll would be enormous. This ship was nothing more nor less than the long-anticipated Iranian attack on Israel. Not the expected rocket attacks (which could be intercepted by the Israelis) but an even more deadly and unexpected attack by sea.. It is very interesting to note that the Israeli government has in the past few weeks, been loudly demanding that the United States establish a naval blockade of Iran.

The reason for this blockade would be to prevent any more Iranian ships with deadly cargos from attacking either Israel or other targets from the sea.






3965 W. 83rd. Street #292 Shawnee Mission, KS 66208 I Phone: 913.648.0022 I Fax: 913.648.7997
This site is designed for standards compliant browsers. If your browser is not standards compliant, download one here.
Website copyright ? 2006. Unity Coalition for Israel. _______________________________________________



      
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Thu Oct 23 07:21:14 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2008 22:21:14 +1000
Subject: [Dialogue] Four Corners - Mortgage Meltdown
Message-ID: <49006C3A.5080900@westnet.com.au>

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From jid at westnet.com.au  Thu Oct 23 07:33:31 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2008 22:33:31 +1000
Subject: [Dialogue] [Fwd: wow !!!]
Message-ID: <49006F1B.4030708@westnet.com.au>

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From jid at westnet.com.au  Thu Oct 23 07:48:14 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2008 22:48:14 +1000
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] What is Israel waiting for?? Nuke Iran NOW!]
Message-ID: <4900728E.8040300@westnet.com.au>

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Subject: [Dialogue] What is Israel waiting for?? Nuke Iran NOW!
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2008 18:14:12 -0700
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Thu Oct 23 08:04:14 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2008 23:04:14 +1000
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] Yosef Painting]
Message-ID: <4900764E.5090507@westnet.com.au>

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Subject: [Dialogue] Yosef Painting
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2008 10:25:43 EDT
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Thu Oct 23 11:48:12 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2008 12:48:12 -0400
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] Yosef Painting]
In-Reply-To: <4900764E.5090507@westnet.com.au>
References: <4900764E.5090507@westnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <855590370810230948r108f51f1y50fc7c4dbb279e7@mail.gmail.com>

Once again, I have to agree totally with Joe; Betty, it is a beautiful
painting, and I loved the pomegranates!   One of these days, when I'm next
in Louisiana, I'll make sure to stop by the synagogue to be able to
appreciate it in person!

B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,

          *  Hanoch
*
On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 9:04 AM, JOE INDOMENICO <jid at westnet.com.au> wrote:

> *SIMPLY BEAUTIFUL & INSPIRING , BETTY !!!!!!!
>
> Would love to hear in your own words about the symbology if you have the
> time.
>
> Shalom v'Ahavah
> JOE.
> *
>
>  Many of you know Betty Eddy. She is part of our synagogue without walls.
> Some of you may not know that she is a remarkable artist. During Succoth
> last year she informed me that she wanted to make something for the our
> synagogue.  She wanted me to give her an idea of what to paint but I just
> never got around to it. (I want make that mistake again:)
>
> Well, Betty came to the conference this year with a most beautiful
> painting. I absolutely LOVE this painting! It was the perfect gift and I
> would even say it was inspired. It is now proudly displayed on the wall at
> Temple Sinai.
>
> You can follow the link below to see this most incredible painting. You can
> have one of these as well. She has 8 X 10 as well as 14 X 20 available on
> her web site art gallery.  They are very reasonably priced I might add.
>
> Everyone who longs for the day when Joseph will reveal himself to his
> brothers ought to have at least one copy of this painting.  Check it out!
>
> Click here: Joseph print<http://bettyeddy.com/art/flags.prints/joseph.html>
>
> *Ross K. Nichols *
> www.RootsofFaith.org <http://www.rootsoffaith.org/>
>
>
>
>
>  ------------------------------
> New *MapQuest Local* shows what's happening at your destination. Dining,
> Movies, Events, News & more. Try it out!
> <http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1211031713x1200669822/aol?redir=http://local.mapquest.com/?ncid=emlcntnew00000002>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
> Version: 8.0.173 / Virus Database: 270.8.2/1735 - Release Date: 10/20/2008
> 2:52 PM
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
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From betty_m_eddy at yahoo.com  Thu Oct 23 16:25:26 2008
From: betty_m_eddy at yahoo.com (Betty Eddy)
Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2008 14:25:26 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] Yosef Painting]
In-Reply-To: <855590370810230948r108f51f1y50fc7c4dbb279e7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <197522.18275.qm@web30405.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Thank you all for your kind words about the painting.

Betty Eddy
  
      
   

--- On Thu, 10/23/08, Hanoch Young <youngbarzel at gmail.com> wrote:
From: Hanoch Young <youngbarzel at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Fwd: [Dialogue] Yosef Painting]
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
Date: Thursday, October 23, 2008, 11:48 AM

Once again, I have to agree totally with Joe; Betty, it is a beautiful painting, and I loved the pomegranates!?? One of these days, when I'm next in Louisiana, I'll make sure to stop by the synagogue to be able to appreciate it in person!

?
B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,
?
??????????? Hanoch


On Thu, Oct 23, 2008 at 9:04 AM, JOE INDOMENICO <jid at westnet.com.au> wrote:


SIMPLY BEAUTIFUL & INSPIRING , BETTY !!!!!!!

Would love to hear in your own words about the symbology if you have the time.

Shalom v'Ahavah

JOE.



Many of you know Betty Eddy. She is part of our synagogue without walls. Some of you may not know that she is a remarkable artist. During Succoth last year she informed me that she wanted to make something for the our synagogue.? She wanted me to give her an idea of what to paint but I just never got around to it. (I want make that mistake again:)

?
Well, Betty came to the conference this year with a most beautiful painting. I absolutely LOVE this painting! It was the perfect gift and I would even say it was inspired. It is now proudly displayed on the wall at Temple Sinai. 

?
You can follow the link below to see this most incredible painting. You can have one of these as well. She has 8 X 10 as well as 14 X 20 available on her web site art gallery.? They are very reasonably priced I might add.

?
Everyone who longs for the day when?Joseph will reveal himself to his brothers ought to have at least one?copy of this painting.? Check it out!
?
Click here: Joseph print 
?
Ross K. Nichols 
www.RootsofFaith.org







New MapQuest Local shows what's happening at your destination. Dining, Movies, Events, News & more. Try it out! 

_______________________________________________


No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
Version: 8.0.173 / Virus Database: 270.8.2/1735 - Release Date: 10/20/2008 2:52 PM


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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Fri Oct 24 10:52:11 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 11:52:11 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Our land - occupied by Arabs
Message-ID: <855590370810240852x4074dddesdb1d71b938e864b@mail.gmail.com>

A sane voice in an insane atmosphere....
            Click here: Our land, occupied by
Arabs<http://samsonblinded.org/blog/our-land-occupied-by-arabs.htm>

 Shabbat Shalom,
             *Hanoch*
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Fri Oct 24 10:59:40 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 11:59:40 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Seeking after G-d?
Message-ID: <855590370810240859w2bb30ca0oac1f3a1169b20166@mail.gmail.com>

     The Lekarev Report
   *24 Tishrei 5769
* *October 23, 2008
*  Shalom

Hashem looked from heaven upon the children of men, to see if there were any
man of understanding, that seeks after G-d.

Psalm 14:2
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From betty_m_eddy at yahoo.com  Fri Oct 24 11:30:03 2008
From: betty_m_eddy at yahoo.com (Betty Eddy)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 09:30:03 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] Yosef Painting]
In-Reply-To: <4900764E.5090507@westnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <562855.26067.qm@web30403.mail.mud.yahoo.com>





Joseph

?

Joseph is a fruitful bough, a fruitful bough by a
well; His branches run over the wall. The archers have bitterly grieved him,
Shot at him and hated him. But his bow remained in strength, and the arms of
his hands were made strong by the hands of the Mighty God of Jacob (From there
is the Shepherd, the Stone of Israel), by the God of your father who will help
you, and by the Almighty who will bless you with blessings of heaven above, blessings
of the deep that lies beneath, Blessings of the breasts and of the womb. The
blessings of your father have excelled the blessings of my ancestors, Up to the
utmost bound of the everlasting hills. They shall be on the head of Joseph, And
on the crown of the head of him who was separate from his brothers.

?

And of Joseph he said: "Blessed of the LORD is
his land, with the precious things of heaven, with the dew, And the deep lying
beneath, with the precious fruits of the sun, with the precious produce of the
months, with the best things of the ancient mountains, with the precious things
of the everlasting hills, with the precious things of the earth and its
fullness, and the favor of Him who dwelt in the bush. Let the blessing come 'on
the head of Joseph, and on the crown of the head of him who was separate from
his brothers.' His glory is like a firstborn bull, and his horns like the horns
of the wild ox; Together with them He shall push the peoples to the ends of the
earth; They are the ten thousands of Ephraim, And they are the thousands of
Manasseh."

?

The image of a sheaf of wheat comes from Joseph's
dream, where the brother's sheaves bow to his (Bereshit 37:5-8). It also
relates to his interpretation of Pharaoh's dream about the seven stalks of
grain (Bereshit 41:22-24) and the subsequent accumulation, while the grand
Vizier of Egypt, of grain during the seven good years as it is narrated in
Bereshit 41:48-49.


Betty Eddy
  
      
   

--- On Thu, 10/23/08, JOE INDOMENICO <jid at westnet.com.au> wrote:
From: JOE INDOMENICO <jid at westnet.com.au>
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] Yosef Painting]
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
Date: Thursday, October 23, 2008, 8:04 AM




SIMPLY BEAUTIFUL & INSPIRING , BETTY
!!!!!!!



Would love to hear in your own words about the symbology if you have
the time.



Shalom v'Ahavah

JOE.


 
_______________________________________________



      
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Fri Oct 24 15:28:17 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 13:28:17 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] For Bereshiet, 5769
Message-ID: <855590370810241328t78eb0b55sfac8e4f2f4548571@mail.gmail.com>

This was written by Rav Nachman Kahana, one of the truly great Rabbis and
Jewish leaders of our time (and the brother of my teacher, Rav Meir Kahane,
May G-d Avenge His Blood).  Yes, he spells his last name differently in
English - not a typo.
      Shabbat Shalom,
                    * Hanoch*
**

BS"D Succot and Parashat Bereshiet 5769

Part One

We have just concluded the festivals of Succot and Sh'mini Atzeret whose
core theme is water; for on these days HaShem adjudicates the quantity and
distribution of rain in the world. Water is the lifeline for all peoples,
but especially for us, from giving life, to hygiene, to netilat yadayim to
providing purity through the mikveh. The importance of water to our very
existence is underscored in the first verse of the Torah, which informs us
that "the spirit of God was hovering over the waters", which in essence is
saying that water preceded even light (which might present a problem for
physicists).

Water has played a conspicuous role in our history in many fascinating ways,
and even one which reflects strongly on our present condition.

The Book of Shoftim (Judges chapter 7) relates that HaShem commanded Gideon
to bring his army of ten thousand to a river bed, and there reduce the
number significantly through a test. Those who would take the water into
their hands and draw it up to their lips are suited to be in the Jewish army
of HaShem; those who bow to drink the water would be rejected.

Three hundred soldiers passed the test, 9700 failed and were sent home. And
it was these 300 soldiers who defeated the entire Midianite army.

HaShem is bringing the Jewish communities in galut to the river bed of their
future. There will be many who will prostrate themselves before the reality
of their existence and remain in galut and eventually vanish. But there will
be some who will take the future into their hands and return to the
"Promised Land".

Every week, for the last six years, without missing even one (I believe), I
have written variations on the same theme - the time has arrived to return
home to Eretz Yisrael. But in the light of current events, when shortly the
Jews will be blamed for everything wrong from Wall Street to Main Street,
there is no more need for me to tell you. The writing is clearly on the wall
- swim or sink, live on in the land of our fathers or disappear into
oblivion; be part of the next chapter in the eternal book of our people or
be a footnote in Jewish history.

So, for now, I will try to direct my messages to my brothers in Eretz
Yisrael concerning matters of relevance to us, and how we should prepare for
the new age which is descending upon us.

During the days of Succot there were, according to a conservative estimate,
over a million people at the Kotel at various times. Indeed, whenever I came
there the Kotel plaza was filled with Jews. Totally committed Dati people
together with less observant ones; soldiers from all the services and ranks
as well as starry-eyed Christian tourists from Eastern Europe, who never
imagined that the remnant of what their fathers and grandfathers had
perpetrated were capable of creating.

There was the traditional "birkat ha'kohanim" ceremony on Thursday morning,
when more than one hundred thousand people stood shoulder to shoulder to
receive the kohanic blessing in unison from hundreds of kohanim, with many
more people in the late afternoon for the once-in-seven-year ceremony of
Ha'kel. In both ceremonies there were moments of absolute quiet. I did not
see the people during "birkat kohanim" because I was under my talit as were
hundreds of other kohanim, but I felt surrounded with the energy created by
the concentrated silence of kavana of the awesome number Jews before me.

On my way home, it dawned upon me the unbridgeable difference between the
two Wall Streets of the world - the one in New York City and the other which
is adjacent to the Western Wall. The former represents gluttony, greed,
desire, voracity, avarice, covetousness, rapacity, lustfulness, salacity,
lechery and prurience.

The Kotel represents the extreme opposite. Our rabbis informed us that the
Western Wall was erected through the sole contributions of kind and labor of
the poor and humble of Yerushalayim; and it is for this reason that the
Kotel has stood the ravages of time and many enemies.

Humility, modesty, decorum and austerity are some of the qualities which the
torah seeks to indelibly implant into our consciousness. This is the message
of the modest structure - succa - we call home for seven days and nights and
which we must carry with us until the following succot.

Part Two

The timing of current events vis a vis each week's parasha is incredible,
almost to the point that if you tell a talmid chacham (a real one who even
knows chumash) the major thrust of the week's events, he could tell you to a
great degree of accuracy the week's parasha.

The major "outrage" of this week was the announcement that the Pope will not
visit our country unless Yad Ve'Shem changes the caption in its exhibit,
which tells the truth regarding Eugenio Pacelli's (Pope Pious the 12) moral
bankruptcy when he knew that Catholics and other Christians of Europe were
turning our people into soap.

I, for one, will sleep very peacefully even if the present Pope remains in
Italy. But I would hope that his conscience does not permit him to sleep
well, if only because of his inexcusable defense of the "Silent Pope".

One might claim that these things happened over 60 years ago and should be
left to historians to dispute the role of Picelli during the Shoah.

Except for one verse in our parasha. HaShem calls out to Kayin (Cain) after
murdering his brother Hevel (Abel):
*

??? ??? ???? ????? ??? ?? ?????

The call of your brother's blood screams out to me from the ground
*

The call of the blood of 6 million Jews, including one and a half million
young children, calls out to HaShem for retribution. And as Rashi explains,
not only the blood of Hevel calls out, but also that of his descendants who
would not be born. Our six million would have become in time 100 million,
and their collective blood calls out for retribution.

Another Pope, John Paul 2, was not from the worst of Popes. He did not, like
many of his predecessors, call for burning Jews at the stake, or organize
crusades which decimated the Jews of Europe or auto de fes, or forced
disputations, which if the rabbi succeeded then the local Jewish population
was expelled and their property confiscated, and if the rabbi did not
succeed then too the local Jewish population was expelled and their property
confiscated. He proclaimed on his visit to Eretz Yisrael in the year 2000,
"We remember, but not... as an incentive to hatred."

As with most things, I disagree with him even on this. The Torah commands us
with regard to Amalek not to forget and not to forgive, but wait for the
opportunity to punish the evil doers of history. Pay up time will surely
arrive. Perhaps that is what underlies what we seeing now.

It would be appropriate, because there are still survivors who could
appreciate the mighty arm of HaShem's justice.

Shabbat Shalom Nachman Kahana

__._,_.___ Messages in this topic
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From chattertonw at bellsouth.net  Fri Oct 24 16:05:22 2008
From: chattertonw at bellsouth.net (chattertonw at bellsouth.net)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 21:05:22 +0000
Subject: [Dialogue] A Father's Tribute to Ezra
Message-ID: <102420082105.20964.49023891000BB146000051E422230647629B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>

All,

Many thanks for all the prayers, thoughts and words of encouragement during this difficult time.

Here is a link to an article in the Orange County Register. I hope it helps you know this amazing boy a little better.

Glenn

http://gaming.freedomblogging.com/2008/10/24/a-fathers-tribute-to-ezra-the-world-of-warcraft-fan-with-brain-cancer/856/
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From shdennis at rogers.com  Fri Oct 24 16:45:16 2008
From: shdennis at rogers.com (Stephen & Sharon)
Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2008 18:45:16 -0300
Subject: [Dialogue] A Father's Tribute to Ezra
In-Reply-To: <102420082105.20964.49023891000BB146000051E422230647629B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>
References: <102420082105.20964.49023891000BB146000051E422230647629B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>
Message-ID: <0BCDADB0700C453D90DCDCB51E7FB815@Beeblebrox>

Glenn,

I truly feel for you all as you experience the loss and emptiness of life without young Ezra.  May HaShem comfort you all with a sense of peace and even purpose at this confusing and deeply sad time.

Sharon 
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: chattertonw at bellsouth.net 
  To: Dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
  Sent: Friday, October 24, 2008 6:05 PM
  Subject: [Dialogue] A Father's Tribute to Ezra


  All,

  Many thanks for all the prayers, thoughts and words of encouragement during this difficult time.

  Here is a link to an article in the Orange County Register. I hope it helps you know this amazing boy a little better.

  Glenn

  http://gaming.freedomblogging.com/2008/10/24/a-fathers-tribute-to-ezra-the-world-of-warcraft-fan-with-brain-cancer/856/


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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From jid at westnet.com.au  Sat Oct 25 17:06:55 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 08:06:55 +1000
Subject: [Dialogue] Bereshit - Moshav Band
Message-ID: <4903987F.5000902@westnet.com.au>

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From jid at westnet.com.au  Sat Oct 25 17:13:41 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 08:13:41 +1000
Subject: [Dialogue] The Weekly Torah Portion With Rabbi David Marcus -
	Bereshit
Message-ID: <49039A15.2040004@westnet.com.au>

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From jid at westnet.com.au  Sat Oct 25 17:24:09 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 08:24:09 +1000
Subject: [Dialogue] Parsha Bereshit with Rabbi Riskin
Message-ID: <49039C89.1050305@westnet.com.au>

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From kimalvarado3265 at gmail.com  Sat Oct 25 18:49:21 2008
From: kimalvarado3265 at gmail.com (kim alvarado)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 18:49:21 -0500
Subject: [Dialogue] A Father's Tribute to Ezra
In-Reply-To: <0BCDADB0700C453D90DCDCB51E7FB815@Beeblebrox>
References: <102420082105.20964.49023891000BB146000051E422230647629B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>
	<0BCDADB0700C453D90DCDCB51E7FB815@Beeblebrox>
Message-ID: <1c8dbb6e0810251649p4e67b75fy61746f1ff6c93e44@mail.gmail.com>

Glenn,

I am saddened to hear this news.  My prayers are with you and your family.

Kim

On Fri, Oct 24, 2008 at 4:45 PM, Stephen & Sharon <shdennis at rogers.com>wrote:

>  Glenn,
>
> I truly feel for you all as you experience the loss and emptiness of life
> without young Ezra.  May HaShem comfort you all with a sense of peace and
> even purpose at this confusing and deeply sad time.
>
> Sharon
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* chattertonw at bellsouth.net
> *To:* Dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
> *Sent:* Friday, October 24, 2008 6:05 PM
> *Subject:* [Dialogue] A Father's Tribute to Ezra
>
> All,
>
> Many thanks for all the prayers, thoughts and words of encouragement during
> this difficult time.
>
> Here is a link to an article in the Orange County Register. I hope it helps
> you know this amazing boy a little better.
>
> Glenn
>
>
> http://gaming.freedomblogging.com/2008/10/24/a-fathers-tribute-to-ezra-the-world-of-warcraft-fan-with-brain-cancer/856/
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
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From j.h.lusk234 at sbcglobal.net  Sat Oct 25 20:49:14 2008
From: j.h.lusk234 at sbcglobal.net (Helen Lusk)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 18:49:14 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Dialogue] The Weekly Torah Portion With Rabbi David Marcus -
	Bereshit
In-Reply-To: <49039A15.2040004@westnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <326540.77952.qm@web82502.mail.mud.yahoo.com>


Wonderful.. Joe. Thanks for sharing a reminder to get down to basics: Hashem .Torah,, Israel and the land. ,May we learn more as we start again from Bereshit,,beginnings.
?
Kind regards,
?
?
Helen.
--- On Sat, 10/25/08, JOE INDOMENICO <jid at westnet.com.au> wrote:

From: JOE INDOMENICO <jid at westnet.com.au>
Subject: [Dialogue] The Weekly Torah Portion With Rabbi David Marcus - Bereshit
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
Date: Saturday, October 25, 2008, 6:13 PM


Shavuah Tov Chaverim,

May this be the beginning of the beginning of the GEULAH (REDEMPTION) and the MALCHUT SHAMAYIM ( KINGDOM OF HEAVEN).
May HIS HOLY NAME be blessed forever.
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=F92lw8hnJvQ

Shalom v'Ahavah
JOE.
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From j.h.lusk234 at sbcglobal.net  Sat Oct 25 21:00:10 2008
From: j.h.lusk234 at sbcglobal.net (Helen Lusk)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 19:00:10 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Dialogue] Parsha Bereshit with Rabbi Riskin
In-Reply-To: <49039C89.1050305@westnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <300413.59394.qm@web82505.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Amen and Amen! Thank you for sharing. How this article/video encourages the convictions we hold fast to.
?
Kind regards,
?
Helen

--- On Sat, 10/25/08, JOE INDOMENICO <jid at westnet.com.au> wrote:

From: JOE INDOMENICO <jid at westnet.com.au>
Subject: [Dialogue] Parsha Bereshit with Rabbi Riskin
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
Date: Saturday, October 25, 2008, 6:24 PM


Shavua Tov Chaverim,

some food for thought (no pun intended)

Shalom v'Ahavah
JOE.
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=BLuCs1kg6zU _______________________________________________
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From eliasaph at uniteourheart.com  Sat Oct 25 21:57:25 2008
From: eliasaph at uniteourheart.com (Steve Mathe)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 19:57:25 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] Weeping and rejoicing at Joseph's tomb on Oct 23rd
Message-ID: <200810260257.m9Q2vPnL004485@mail383c25.carrierzone.com>

Friends,

Here is something that will make you weep and make you 
rejoice.....  there are some of Judah who remember and love 
Joseph.... all this means that the collective consciousness of Israel 
is being influenced to the better by such acts, and we all benefit 
from such valiant acts.... truly we are in the end of days and these 
are signs thereof..... yes there are terrible events yet to 
come...... the trends in the world indicate that .... and am not 
polly-annish about the Redemption to come any day.....  yet Hashem 
gives us encouragement by enabling us to see our brothers and sisters 
of Yehudah who have not bowed their knees to the Baalim of the 
apostasies of leftist politics, secularism, materialistic pursuits 
and liberal /false religions. Hazak, Hazak, v'nit hazek!

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/24/world/middleeast/24tomb.html?_r=2&oref=slogin&oref=slogin

Steve



From eliasaph at uniteourheart.com  Sat Oct 25 22:48:46 2008
From: eliasaph at uniteourheart.com (Steve Mathe)
Date: Sat, 25 Oct 2008 20:48:46 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] Rabbi Greenbaum's class This Sunday
Message-ID: <200810260348.m9Q3mk8R025505@mail383c25.carrierzone.com>

Hello Everyone,

A reminder that Rabbi Greenbaum will be holding class live from 
Jerusalem on Sunday at http://www.azamra.org.  You will be able to 
ask questions live via keyboard.

Steve



From jid at westnet.com.au  Sun Oct 26 05:59:25 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 20:59:25 +1000
Subject: [Fwd: [Dialogue] Weeping and rejoicing at Joseph's tomb on Oct 23rd]
Message-ID: <49044D8D.2030401@westnet.com.au>

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Subject: [Dialogue] Weeping and rejoicing at Joseph's tomb on Oct 23rd
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From patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com  Sun Oct 26 08:44:40 2008
From: patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com (Pat Robbins)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 09:44:40 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Parsha Bereshit with Rabbi Riskin
In-Reply-To: <49039C89.1050305@westnet.com.au>
References: <49039C89.1050305@westnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <BLU125-DS6A0618518107F7C584EB1BA250@phx.gbl>

We NEED this kind of anointed teaching desperately.  It is down-to-earth, practical, and so very inspiring.  It strengthens our faith in wholly following HaShem.  It combats the prevailing attitude of "every man doing what is right in his own eyes."  

Thank you for this precious gift, Joe.

Shavua tov,

Pat  


From: JOE INDOMENICO 
Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2008 6:24 PM
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
Subject: [Dialogue] Parsha Bereshit with Rabbi Riskin


Shavua Tov Chaverim,

some food for thought (no pun intended)

Shalom v'Ahavah
JOE.
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=BLuCs1kg6zU 


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From patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com  Sun Oct 26 09:28:19 2008
From: patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com (Pat Robbins)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 10:28:19 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Weeping and rejoicing at Joseph's tomb on Oct 23rd
In-Reply-To: <200810260257.m9Q2vPnL004485@mail383c25.carrierzone.com>
References: <200810260257.m9Q2vPnL004485@mail383c25.carrierzone.com>
Message-ID: <BLU125-DS33E69C1B50D304398EBEBBA250@phx.gbl>

What an awesome article, Steve!!!  Indeed, may our courageous brothers and 
sisters of Yehudah be strengthened!!!!  And may we catch their fervor in our 
spirits to serve HaShem with all our might!

Pat

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Steve Mathe" <eliasaph at uniteourheart.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2008 10:57 PM
To: <dialogue at rootsoffaith.org>
Subject: [Dialogue] Weeping and rejoicing at Joseph's tomb on Oct 23rd

> Friends,
>
> Here is something that will make you weep and make you rejoice.....  there 
> are some of Judah who remember and love Joseph.... all this means that the 
> collective consciousness of Israel is being influenced to the better by 
> such acts, and we all benefit from such valiant acts.... truly we are in 
> the end of days and these are signs thereof..... yes there are terrible 
> events yet to come...... the trends in the world indicate that .... and am 
> not polly-annish about the Redemption to come any day.....  yet Hashem 
> gives us encouragement by enabling us to see our brothers and sisters of 
> Yehudah who have not bowed their knees to the Baalim of the apostasies of 
> leftist politics, secularism, materialistic pursuits and liberal /false 
> religions. Hazak, Hazak, v'nit hazek!
>
> http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/24/world/middleeast/24tomb.html?_r=2&oref=slogin&oref=slogin
>
> Steve
>
> _______________________________________________
> 


From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sun Oct 26 10:13:44 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 11:13:44 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Moshav Band's musical "Bereshit"
Message-ID: <855590370810260813k5e7dca1bie55727e3668b1cd3@mail.gmail.com>

Enjoy...
            *Hanoch*
**
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vl31is_RgP8
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sun Oct 26 10:36:43 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 11:36:43 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Parsha Bereshit with Rabbi Riskin
In-Reply-To: <BLU125-DS6A0618518107F7C584EB1BA250@phx.gbl>
References: <49039C89.1050305@westnet.com.au>
	<BLU125-DS6A0618518107F7C584EB1BA250@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <855590370810260836o151f134fp82a18dda62905455@mail.gmail.com>

Shalom Joe,

     Toda for forwarding this - Rav Riskin has always had a way of making
everything more understandable and thought provoking.  "Back in the day," as
the cliche goes, I had the opportunity to learn in the Yeshiva he had
established in NYC.  He is one of the special teachers of Torah of this
generation.

      B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,
              * Hanoch
*
On Sun, Oct 26, 2008 at 9:44 AM, Pat Robbins <patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com>wrote:

>  We NEED this kind of anointed teaching desperately.  It is down-to-earth,
> practical, and so very inspiring.  It strengthens our faith in wholly
> following HaShem.  It combats the prevailing attitude of "every man doing
> what is right in his own eyes."
>
> Thank you for this precious gift, Joe.
>
> Shavua tov,
>
> Pat
>
>  *From:* JOE INDOMENICO <jid at westnet.com.au>
> *Sent:* Saturday, October 25, 2008 6:24 PM
> *To:* dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
>  *Subject:* [Dialogue] Parsha Bereshit with Rabbi Riskin
>
>  *Shavua Tov Chaverim,
>
> some food for thought (no pun intended)
>
> Shalom v'Ahavah
> JOE.
> *http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=BLuCs1kg6zU
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sun Oct 26 10:48:01 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 11:48:01 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Weeping and rejoicing at Joseph's tomb on Oct 23rd
In-Reply-To: <BLU125-DS33E69C1B50D304398EBEBBA250@phx.gbl>
References: <200810260257.m9Q2vPnL004485@mail383c25.carrierzone.com>
	<BLU125-DS33E69C1B50D304398EBEBBA250@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <855590370810260848n2aa8c910k86df7dbe7ed15a68@mail.gmail.com>

When I read this in the "Times," I couldn't help but think how the Israeli
government surrendered to the savage hordes of ruthless creatures, who
destroyed the tomb of Yosef; someone *they *supposedly revere as a prophet!
It's time to to a 'tikkun' - a restoration, or repair, of all that we've
done wrong in the Land of Israel...it's LONG overdue...

B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,
         * Hanoch
*
On Sun, Oct 26, 2008 at 10:28 AM, Pat Robbins
<patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com>wrote:

> What an awesome article, Steve!!!  Indeed, may our courageous brothers and
> sisters of Yehudah be strengthened!!!!  And may we catch their fervor in our
> spirits to serve HaShem with all our might!
>
> Pat
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "Steve Mathe" <eliasaph at uniteourheart.com>
> Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2008 10:57 PM
> To: <dialogue at rootsoffaith.org>
> Subject: [Dialogue] Weeping and rejoicing at Joseph's tomb on Oct 23rd
>
>
> Friends,
>>
>> Here is something that will make you weep and make you rejoice.....  there
>> are some of Judah who remember and love Joseph.... all this means that the
>> collective consciousness of Israel is being influenced to the better by such
>> acts, and we all benefit from such valiant acts.... truly we are in the end
>> of days and these are signs thereof..... yes there are terrible events yet
>> to come...... the trends in the world indicate that .... and am not
>> polly-annish about the Redemption to come any day.....  yet Hashem gives us
>> encouragement by enabling us to see our brothers and sisters of Yehudah who
>> have not bowed their knees to the Baalim of the apostasies of leftist
>> politics, secularism, materialistic pursuits and liberal /false religions.
>> Hazak, Hazak, v'nit hazek!
>>
>>
>> http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/24/world/middleeast/24tomb.html?_r=2&oref=slogin&oref=slogin
>>
>> Steve
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>
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From patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com  Sun Oct 26 12:44:40 2008
From: patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com (Pat Robbins)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 13:44:40 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Moshav Band's musical "Bereshit"
In-Reply-To: <855590370810260813k5e7dca1bie55727e3668b1cd3@mail.gmail.com>
References: <855590370810260813k5e7dca1bie55727e3668b1cd3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BLU125-DS241CE6BAF065236D25915BA250@phx.gbl>

LOOOOOVE IT!!!


From: Hanoch Young 
Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2008 11:13 AM
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
Subject: [Dialogue] Moshav Band's musical "Bereshit"


Enjoy...
            Hanoch

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vl31is_RgP8


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sun Oct 26 13:07:44 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 14:07:44 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Moshav Band's musical "Bereshit"
In-Reply-To: <BLU125-DS241CE6BAF065236D25915BA250@phx.gbl>
References: <855590370810260813k5e7dca1bie55727e3668b1cd3@mail.gmail.com>
	<BLU125-DS241CE6BAF065236D25915BA250@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <855590370810261107s4bd5e8b7r991cd8539f35b702@mail.gmail.com>

Hey Pat -

    Glad you liked it - they're one of my favorite bands.  They're actually
going to be playing in NYC Wednesday evening (along with Soulfarm, another
great band), and I'd LOVE to go.  It doesn't look like I'll be able to get
out of work early enough though  :-(  (poor me, LOL)

   With my upcoming trip to Israel, I cannot take any other time off, since
I'm already going to be advanced vacation time.  Oh well, there are always
CD's & YouTube, right?  :-)

   B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,

        *  Hanoch
*
On Sun, Oct 26, 2008 at 1:44 PM, Pat Robbins <patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com>wrote:

>  LOOOOOVE IT!!!
>
>  *From:* Hanoch Young <youngbarzel at gmail.com>
> *Sent:* Sunday, October 26, 2008 11:13 AM
> *To:* dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
> *Subject:* [Dialogue] Moshav Band's musical "Bereshit"
>
> Enjoy...
>             *Hanoch*
> **
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vl31is_RgP8
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
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From eliasaph at uniteourheart.com  Sun Oct 26 13:17:12 2008
From: eliasaph at uniteourheart.com (Steve Mathe)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 11:17:12 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] Updates on access to Temple Mount for Prayer
In-Reply-To: <49044D8D.2030401@westnet.com.au>
References: <49044D8D.2030401@westnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <200810261817.m9QIHAbB015092@mail383c25.carrierzone.com>


Friends,

I recommend you go to: http://www.templeinstitute.org/events.htm and 
read up on the recent Hakhel-related developments.  Soneme excerpts 
are below. See the pictures and videos at the site. It seems that 
this is an opening to the Temple Mount by brave local Jews and it 
will be followed by many others who will cause changes to come 
about.  Alll things have to start small, and this is an example for 
us to follow.

Steve

Record numbers of Jews continue to stream up to the Temple Mount on 
each of the intermediate days of Sukkot. Never before witnessed 
scenes of Jews massing at the Moghrabi Gate entrance to the Temple 
Mount are being reported. In spite of or perhaps, because of the 
revolutionary changes taking place, Yehudah Glick, the Temple 
Institute's Director was arrested at the Moghrabi Gate this morning, 
(Sunday, October 19th), for no stated reason. He is currently being 
held by the police, awaiting a hearing.

UPDATE: After being head for several hours, Yehudah Glick was brought 
before a judge. The police sought an order keeping Glick away from 
the Temple Mount for six months. The crime he was being accused of 
committing, which the police defined as "instigation and 
provocation": praying on the Temple Mount. The judge was irate with 
the police, stating emphatically that the ability to pray on the 
Temple Mount is legally guaranteed by the state of Israel to all 
Jews. The judge ordered Glick's immediate release.

In addition, the judge strongly urged Yehudah to appeal to Israel's 
High Court of Justice to define fixed hours for Jewish prayer on the 
Temple Mount.

We thank all who wrote expressing their concern and support.

Court: Jewish Prayer on the Temple Mount is not a Provocation



Judge Ben Atar: An arrangement allowing for Jewish prayer on the 
Temple Mount similar to the arrangement already existing in the Cave 
of the Patriarchs [in Hebron] is the preferable solution.

In the hearing which took place on Sunday, 20 Tishrei, 5769/October 
19, 2008, in the District Court of Jerusalem, before the honorable 
Judge Maurice Ben Atar, the judge determined that Jewish prayer on 
the Temple Mount does not constitute a provocation.

The court released Yehudah Glick, director of the Temple Institute, 
from detention after he had been arrested by the police earlier in 
the day on suspicion of attempting to create a provocation on the 
Temple Mount. The police alleged that Glick tried to enter the Temple 
Mount with articles of prayer, thereby creating a provocation.

Glick was represented at the hearing by attorney Aviad Vissuly, 
claiming that in the past year he has entered the Temple Mount tens 
of times, both as a guide leading groups and in his role as Director 
of the Temple Institute, and in 90% of his visits he has engaged in 
prayer, with the knowledge of the police, and not a single instance 
of provocation has occurred. In addition, Glick claimed that on 
October 15th, 2008, the police authorized the entry of more than 700 
Jews to the Temple Mount in groups of twenty, and and each group was 
authorized by the police to read verses from the book of Deuteronomy, 
related to the Hakhel ceremony. Glick further noted that at the time 
of his arrest he had arrived at the Temple Mount with the identical 
printed materials for guiding groups that he uses each time he 
ascends the Mount, as well as with the printed verses that he had 
been authorized to read on the Mount (on October 15th).

Attorney Aviad Vissuly opened the hearing by mentioning the 
illegality of the police policy of forbidding Jewish prayer on the 
Temple Mount. Vissuly charged that this policy contradicts the 
Israeli Basic Law guaranteeing freedom of religion and worship. He 
likewise charged that the police have never formally adopted the 
forbidding of prayer on the Temple Mount in writing, as such would 
contradict the ruling of the International Court of Justice. In spite 
of this, the police continue to forbid all non-Moslem prayer on the 
Mount in accordance with the demands of the Moslem Wakf which is 
under the control of Islamic Movement.

Judge Maurice Ben Atar ruled that it has never been proven that 
Jewish prayer on the Temple Mount has created a provocation, and 
therefore the police had no basis whatsoever for arresting Yehudah 
Glick: "In light of the lack of legal basis for the arrest, there 
exists no reason for accepting the police request to limit Glick's 
freedom of movement." (The police had earlier presented their request 
that Glick be ordered to stay away from the Temple Mount for a period 
of 180. They later reduced their request to 20 days.) The judge ruled 
that there exists no reason for acquiescing to the police request of 
restricting Glick's access to the Temple Mount, even for a minute. 
The judge further stated that in light of the desire of hundreds of 
Jews to pray on the Temple Mount, an arrangement allowing for Jewish 
prayer on the Temple Mount similar to the arrangement already 
existing in the Cave of the Patriarchs [in Hebron] is the preferable solution.

In response to his arrest and hearing, Yehudah Glick stated that, 
"The feeling is that the Israeli police, instead of admitting that 
they failed in their preparation for the orderly entry of hundred of 
Israeli and tourists who wished to ascend to the Temple Mount to 
perform the agreed upon Hakhel ceremony, throughout the Sukkot 
holiday, in spite of the fact that they had been provided by Glick 
concrete information concerning the numbers months in advance, they 
prefer to betray the very individual who for months has been actively 
pursuing a policy of cooperation with the police. It pains me 
especially that the very same police officers with which I had 
pursued and enjoyed a working relationship built on trust over the 
past years, were those which brutally turned on me at this moment of truth."





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From jid at westnet.com.au  Sun Oct 26 15:45:51 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 06:45:51 +1000
Subject: [Dialogue] WANTON AND CRUEL DESTRUCTION
Message-ID: <4904D6FF.2090908@westnet.com.au>

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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sun Oct 26 20:42:40 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 18:42:40 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] More interesting points about Bereshit
Message-ID: <855590370810261842v3553d784y8282a64b4f7d44df@mail.gmail.com>

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Bereishit: Titans, Men of Renown 25 Tishrei 5769, 24 October 08 10:14
by by Rabbi Chanan Morrison

(IsraelNN.com)

*The Nephilim
*Immediately before the story of Noah and a corrupted world, the Torah makes
a passing mention of Nephilim, powerful giants who lived at that time.

"The Nephilim were on the earth in those days. ...They were the mightiest
ones ever, men of renown." (Genesis 6:4)

Who were these titans? Why does the Torah call them Nephilim?

The Midrash explains that they were called Nephilim because they fell (*
naphlu*) and brought about the world's downfall (*nephilah*). These giants
were catalysts for a great moral collapse of society.

*Studying Foreign Languages
*In 1906, fifteen-year-old Tzvi Yehuda Kook asked his father whether he
should devote time to learning other languages. In his response, Rabbi
Avraham Yitzchak Kook analyzed the relative importance of expertise in
languages and rhetoric:

"We should aspire to help others, both our own people and all of humanity,
as much as possible. Certainly, our influence will increase as we gain
competence in various languages and speaking styles. ...But if perfecting
these skills will come at the expense of analytic study, then this will
reduce the true intellectual content in one's contribution to the world."

Some people mistake proficiency in many languages for intellectual
greatness. This is not the case. Linguistic talents are merely tools.
Genuine perceptiveness and intellectual insight are a function of how well
one has established the foundations of one's own inner integrity.

To demonstrate his point, Rabbi Kook noted that the great Nephilim who
brought about the world's moral collapse were *anshei shem*. Usually
translated as "men of renown," this phrase literally means "men of names,"
or "men of words." They were great leaders, skilled in the arts of
persuasion and rhetoric. But their talents were an empty shell, devoid of
inner content. On the contrary, they used their superficial eloquence for
unscrupulous purposes.

It is interesting to contrast the Nephilim and their highly-developed
oratorical skills with the individual responsible for bringing the Torah's
teachings to the world. The highest level of prophecy was transmitted
through a man who testified about himself that he was not a man of words,
but "heavy of mouth and heavy of tongue" (Exodus 4:10). Moses was not
talented in rhetoric and lacked confidence in his communication skills.
Nonetheless, his moral impact on the world is without equal in the history
of mankind.

*Tools of War
*In these pre-Messianic times, Rabbi Kook wrote, when we must do battle
against ideological foes who attack all that is holy to us, we should look
to King David for inspiration. David rejected the heavy armor of Saul, for
he was not trained in the art of war. Rather, he gathered five smooth stones
from the stream. The five stones are a metaphor: David waged his battle
against Goliath and his blasphemy using the spiritual teachings of the Five
Books of Moses.

We should emulate David, and not invest too much of our time and effort
acquiring the tools of ideological warfare. Like the young shepherd who took
up a slingshot in his fight against Goliath, we should not totally eschew
the implements of rhetoric. But David's victory over the blasphemous
Philistine was achieved due to the purity of his charge, "in the name of the
Lord of hosts, the God of the armies of Israel." (I Samuel 17:45)

Eloquence and elocution are but tools. They may be used for nefarious
purposes, like the corrupt Nephilim, or for conquering evil, like David.
Ultimately, it is not the medium, but the message that counts.

[Adapted from *Igrot HaRe'iyah* vol. I, pp. 29-30]
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(c) Copyright IsraelNationalNews.com
Subscribe to the free Daily Israel Report - sub.israelnn.com
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sun Oct 26 21:01:00 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 19:01:00 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] It all comes down to battling the Hellenists...
Message-ID: <855590370810261901g2025bee3hfcd60c2cded5b59d@mail.gmail.com>

Proud Jew, Proud Israeli 25 Tishrei 5769, 24 October 08 01:29
by by Yishai Fleisher

(IsraelNN.com)

This article may seem at first to be dealing with nothing more than
semantics. But in this case, we are dealing with words pertaining to our
very identity. Our identity is the way we perceive ourselves and broadcast
that perception to others. The name we are given and words we use to
describe ourselves are fundamental to our identity.

In an interview with* Haaretz* journalist Daniel Ben Simon the day following
Shimon Peres' defeat to Benjamin Netanyahu in the 1996 election, the
following exchange took place:

Interviewer: "What happened in these elections?"

Peres: "We lost."

Interviewer: "Who is we?"

Peres: "We, that is, the Israelis."

Interviewer: "And who won?"

Peres: "All those who do not have an Israeli mentality."

Interviewer: "And who are they?"

Peres: "Call them the Jews."

According to the Peres model, there are two publics in Israel: the 'Israeli'
and the 'Jew'. 'Israeli' represents the New Jew, free from the constraints
of religion and free of the "*Galut* mentality." This individual has thrown
off the baggage of two thousand years of exile and has now taken his
rightful place amongst the nations as an equal. He has developed a new
culture, a mix of East and West; and while he speaks Hebrew, he is a citizen
of the world and feels that Israel's greatest mission is to achieve normalcy
and equality amongst the nations.

Peres' 'Jew', on the other hand, stubbornly retains his religious
observance. The 'Jew' tends toward political isolationism and in his
ignorance he is willing to disregard world opinion. The troublesome 'Jew'
supports the continued "occupation" or "settlement" of Judea and Samaria,
thereby retarding all progress towards peace. The 'Jew' is some kind of
relic that needs to be cleared away so that a "New Middle East" can be born.
The 'Jew' even has the audacity to fight for his land, not to mention for
his life.

Recently, Yair Lapid, the son and heir of the anti-religious Shinui party
founder Tommy Lapid, with no trace of brotherly love, eulogized the "Jews"
of Judea and Samaria by saying the following: "These people create a
situation whereby, when the day comes, and the agreements are signed on the
lawn in Washington, it will be easier to give up this land, which isn't
really ours; this land where not only the laws and landscape are different,
but also the people."

This is yet another example of the linguistic and anthropological paradigm
which we have been taught: the progressive and the regressive are two very
different people living in the same parcel of land. One is 'Israeli' while
the other is an outsider; he is the 'Jew'.

The division between the Israeli and the Jew is artificial,
counter-productive, and anti-Jewish. Our leaders should always be striving
to strengthen the bonds that unite every Jew in the world - especially in
this time of renewed anti-Semitism and the world jihad. So why do people
like Peres and Lapid utilize the 'Jew' versus 'Israeli' paradigm? Because
the distinction between 'Jew' and 'Israeli' was created by them and their
post-Zionist cohorts. By blaming the 'Jew', they seek to create a scapegoat
for their failed attempts to make peace by manipulating the public and
giving away our country. By diverting the spotlight away from their own
ineptitude and corruption, they stay in power.

Furthermore, cowardly people who are prepared to give away the heart of
Israel to our sworn enemies feel threatened by fellow countrymen who
represent bravery and a will to survive. For post-Zionists like Peres and
Lapid, the woman who happily raises her kids in Judea and Samaria is a
constant reminder of their own gutlessness, leading them to develop a
burning hate for the pioneering and strong 'Jew'.

The irony of it all is that in today's Israel, the 'Jew' is the new
'Israeli'. Israel was supposed to be the breeding ground for a strong new
Hebrew who does not cower. Yet in today's Israel, it is the
secular-post-Zionist-left which is the cowering Jew being led to the
slaughter. The religious settler is now the emancipated Israeli, bedecked
with side locks and *tzitzit*, and armed with the classic fundamentals of
Zionist ideology; that is, to ingather, to build, and to settle the land of
Israel.

In a cynical and cunning fashion, the post-Zionists are attempting to take
away 'Israeli' identity from those parts of society which still retain the
true 'Israeli' and Zionist spirit. By branding strong Israelis as 'the
Jews', post-Zionists are trying to marginalize and denigrate that segment of
society. The division between Jew and Israeli works to their advantage.

Sadly, after the Disengagement, many of the 'Jews' have also embraced the
very same 'Jew' versus 'Israeli' lingo. While it is not commonplace, some
religious Zionists proclaim: "I am not a *Tzioni*, leave that for the
Israelis, those who kick Jews out of homes and bash our children's heads in
Amona like Cossacks."

Without realizing it, the religious Zionist who embraces the 'Jew' vs.
'Israeli' lexicon is a victim of a propaganda aimed at destroying him by
cutting him off from the state he helped build and defend. Instead of
relinquishing his Israeli identity, he would be better off saying the truth:
it is the post-Zionists who have lost their Israeli self. The strong Jews of
Israel are the real Israelis.

The word 'Israel' has been hijacked and has been made merely to reflect an
identity of citizenship. However, while Israel is indeed the name of our
country, it is much more than that. It is the name of our people.

Our familial and tribal name is Israel. Our Book of Collective Memory tells
us that we are all sons and daughters of one man named Jacob, who was
renamed Israel: "Then G-d said to him, 'Your name is Jacob, your name shall
not be called Jacob any longer, but Israel shall be your name.' Thus he
called his name Israel." (Genesis 35:10)

(Israeli Arabs are not Israeli, and how could they be? Israel is a name set
aside for the people of Israel. Arabs who live here can be called "Arabs
with citizenship of the State of Israel", but they are certainly not
'Israelis'. Ask them and they will tell you the same thing.)

Israel is the country that we have built. We, the Children of Israel, have
returned to our land and have built a prosperous and healthy country in
which Torah flourishes alongside advanced farming, life-saving medicine and
computers. Are these things in contradiction? Of course not. We are one
nation, reuniting on one land, speaking one language. We are Israel.

I am Israeli, because for two-thousand years of exile I was the Jew, a lone
speck traveling through time just to arrive at this point of redemption. I
am no doubt Jewish, and I love Judaism. But I am even prouder that I have
been given the great opportunity, the Jewish dream of two thousand years, to
live in Israel and to help build it into the wonderful and holy country that
it will one day be.

Nobody is going to take away my hard-earned right to be an equal member of
Israeli society. Nobody is going to take from me my country and my identity.
And certainly I am not going to relinquish my name Israel and give it to
those who have forgotten what Israel is really all about.
 www.IsraelNationalNews.com <http://www.israelnationalnews.com/>
(c) Copyright IsraelNationalNews.com
Subscribe to the free Daily Israel Report - sub.israelnn.com
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sun Oct 26 21:04:37 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 19:04:37 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] Moshav Band's musical "Bereshit"
In-Reply-To: <855590370810261107s4bd5e8b7r991cd8539f35b702@mail.gmail.com>
References: <855590370810260813k5e7dca1bie55727e3668b1cd3@mail.gmail.com>
	<BLU125-DS241CE6BAF065236D25915BA250@phx.gbl>
	<855590370810261107s4bd5e8b7r991cd8539f35b702@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <855590370810261904n767314b4h62189efeeba3394e@mail.gmail.com>

Hey Joe -

   I just realized that I passed along the SAME link that you did, to the
list....DUH!!!!   Sorry mate...didn't mean to!  :-)

   B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,
           * Hanoch
*
On Sun, Oct 26, 2008 at 11:07 AM, Hanoch Young <youngbarzel at gmail.com>wrote:

> Hey Pat -
>
>     Glad you liked it - they're one of my favorite bands.  They're actually
> going to be playing in NYC Wednesday evening (along with Soulfarm, another
> great band), and I'd LOVE to go.  It doesn't look like I'll be able to get
> out of work early enough though  :-(  (poor me, LOL)
>
>    With my upcoming trip to Israel, I cannot take any other time off, since
> I'm already going to be advanced vacation time.  Oh well, there are always
> CD's & YouTube, right?  :-)
>
>    B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,
>
>         *  Hanoch
> *
>   On Sun, Oct 26, 2008 at 1:44 PM, Pat Robbins <
> patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>   LOOOOOVE IT!!!
>>
>>  *From:* Hanoch Young <youngbarzel at gmail.com>
>> *Sent:* Sunday, October 26, 2008 11:13 AM
>> *To:* dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
>> *Subject:* [Dialogue] Moshav Band's musical "Bereshit"
>>
>> Enjoy...
>>             *Hanoch*
>> **
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vl31is_RgP8
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>>
>
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Sun Oct 26 21:34:03 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 12:34:03 +1000
Subject: [Fwd: Re: [Dialogue] Moshav Band's musical "Bereshit"]
Message-ID: <4905289B.60901@westnet.com.au>

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From: "Hanoch Young" <youngbarzel at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Dialogue] Moshav Band's musical "Bereshit"
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 19:04:37 -0700
Size: 10374
Url: http://lists.rootsoffaith.org/pipermail/dialogue/attachments/20081027/90aa6dd0/attachment.eml 

From Correim at gninc.ca  Sun Oct 26 21:56:45 2008
From: Correim at gninc.ca (Cornie Reimer)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 21:56:45 -0500
Subject: [Fwd: Re: [Dialogue] Moshav Band's musical "Bereshit"]
In-Reply-To: <4905289B.60901@westnet.com.au>
References: <4905289B.60901@westnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <49052DED.3040103@gninc.ca>

That was a breath of fresh air, so good. Can't put it into words!!!  
Tears of joy!!!

Cornelius



JOE INDOMENICO wrote:
> /Shalom Hanoch,
>
> simply amazing !!!!
> Now we even have the same taste in music. First it was Matisyahu now 
> the Moshav Band.
>
> We will have to stop meeting like this. People might get suspicious. /:-)/
>
> Things can only get better as Yehudah and Yosef further foster their 
> unified mission under the guidance of the RUACH HA CHODESH OF HASHEM.
>
> //B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,/
> /JOE
>
> /
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject:
> Re: [Dialogue] Moshav Band's musical "Bereshit"
> From:
> "Hanoch Young" <youngbarzel at gmail.com>
> Date:
> Sun, 26 Oct 2008 19:04:37 -0700
> To:
> dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
>
> To:
> dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
>
>
> Hey Joe -
>  
>    I just realized that I passed along the SAME link that you did, to 
> the list....DUH!!!!   Sorry mate...didn't mean to!  :-)
>  
>    B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,
>            */ Hanoch
> /*
> On Sun, Oct 26, 2008 at 11:07 AM, Hanoch Young <youngbarzel at gmail.com 
> <mailto:youngbarzel at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>     Hey Pat -
>      
>         Glad you liked it - they're one of my favorite bands.  They're
>     actually going to be playing in NYC Wednesday evening (along with
>     Soulfarm, another great band), and I'd LOVE to go.  It doesn't
>     look like I'll be able to get out of work early enough though 
>     :-(  (poor me, LOL)
>      
>        With my upcoming trip to Israel, I cannot take any other time
>     off, since I'm already going to be advanced vacation time.  Oh
>     well, there are always CD's & YouTube, right?  :-)
>      
>        B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,
>      
>             */  Hanoch
>     /*
>     On Sun, Oct 26, 2008 at 1:44 PM, Pat Robbins
>     <patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com <mailto:patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com>>
>     wrote:
>
>         LOOOOOVE IT!!!
>
>         *From:* Hanoch Young <mailto:youngbarzel at gmail.com>
>         *Sent:* Sunday, October 26, 2008 11:13 AM
>         *To:* dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
>         <mailto:dialogue at rootsoffaith.org>
>         *Subject:* [Dialogue] Moshav Band's musical "Bereshit"
>
>         Enjoy...
>                     */Hanoch/*
>         *//* 
>         http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vl31is_RgP8
>
>         ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>         _______________________________________________
>
>         _______________________________________________
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
>   
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com 
> Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.8.3/1748 - Release Date: 10/26/2008 7:53 PM
>
>   
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
>   
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From patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com  Sun Oct 26 22:03:36 2008
From: patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com (Pat Robbins)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 23:03:36 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Moshav Band's musical "Bereshit"
In-Reply-To: <855590370810260813k5e7dca1bie55727e3668b1cd3@mail.gmail.com><BLU125-DS241CE6BAF065236D25915BA250@phx.gbl>
	<855590370810261107s4bd5e8b7r991cd8539f35b702@mail.gmail.com>
References: <855590370810260813k5e7dca1bie55727e3668b1cd3@mail.gmail.com><BLU125-DS241CE6BAF065236D25915BA250@phx.gbl>
	<855590370810261107s4bd5e8b7r991cd8539f35b702@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BLU125-DS4409FDA34E5E268ECA630BA240@phx.gbl>

Was thinking about your job today, Hanoch, and wondering how it's going.  Surely wish you could go to the concert, but am so happy to know you are going Home to visit Kyra.  Give her a big hug from all of us, please!  I'm so very thankful she's there.
And thank you again for treating us to Moshav Band!!!

Love,

Pat



From: Hanoch Young 
Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2008 2:07 PM
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
Subject: Re: [Dialogue] Moshav Band's musical "Bereshit"


Hey Pat - 

    Glad you liked it - they're one of my favorite bands.  They're actually going to be playing in NYC Wednesday evening (along with Soulfarm, another great band), and I'd LOVE to go.  It doesn't look like I'll be able to get out of work early enough though  :-(  (poor me, LOL)

   With my upcoming trip to Israel, I cannot take any other time off, since I'm already going to be advanced vacation time.  Oh well, there are always CD's & YouTube, right?  :-)

   B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,

          Hanoch


On Sun, Oct 26, 2008 at 1:44 PM, Pat Robbins <patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com> wrote:

  LOOOOOVE IT!!!


  From: Hanoch Young 
  Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2008 11:13 AM
  To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
  Subject: [Dialogue] Moshav Band's musical "Bereshit"


  Enjoy...
              Hanoch

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vl31is_RgP8


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________




  _______________________________________________






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From patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com  Sun Oct 26 22:08:29 2008
From: patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com (Pat Robbins)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 23:08:29 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Updates on access to Temple Mount for Prayer
In-Reply-To: <49044D8D.2030401@westnet.com.au>
	<200810261817.m9QIHAbB015092@mail383c25.carrierzone.com>
References: <49044D8D.2030401@westnet.com.au>
	<200810261817.m9QIHAbB015092@mail383c25.carrierzone.com>
Message-ID: <BLU125-DS2E1E2018BDD9959B63E27BA240@phx.gbl>

Baruch HaShem for Yehudah Glick and Judge Ben Atar!!!!!  And Baruch HaShem for small beginnings!!!!!!!!  May we never despise small beginnings.  ~ Pat


From: Steve Mathe 
Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2008 2:17 PM
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
Subject: [Dialogue] Updates on access to Temple Mount for Prayer



Friends, 

I recommend you go to: http://www.templeinstitute.org/events.htm and read up on the recent Hakhel-related developments.  Soneme excerpts are below. See the pictures and videos at the site. It seems that this is an opening to the Temple Mount by brave local Jews and it will be followed by many others who will cause changes to come about.  Alll things have to start small, and this is an example for us to follow.  

Steve

Record numbers of Jews continue to stream up to the Temple Mount on each of the intermediate days of Sukkot. Never before witnessed scenes of Jews massing at the Moghrabi Gate entrance to the Temple Mount are being reported. In spite of or perhaps, because of the revolutionary changes taking place, Yehudah Glick, the Temple Institute's Director was arrested at the Moghrabi Gate this morning, (Sunday, October 19th), for no stated reason. He is currently being held by the police, awaiting a hearing.

UPDATE: After being head for several hours, Yehudah Glick was brought before a judge. The police sought an order keeping Glick away from the Temple Mount for six months. The crime he was being accused of committing, which the police defined as "instigation and provocation": praying on the Temple Mount. The judge was irate with the police, stating emphatically that the ability to pray on the Temple Mount is legally guaranteed by the state of Israel to all Jews. The judge ordered Glick's immediate release.

In addition, the judge strongly urged Yehudah to appeal to Israel's High Court of Justice to define fixed hours for Jewish prayer on the Temple Mount.

We thank all who wrote expressing their concern and support.


Court: Jewish Prayer on the Temple Mount is not a Provocation


 

Judge Ben Atar: An arrangement allowing for Jewish prayer on the Temple Mount similar to the arrangement already existing in the Cave of the Patriarchs [in Hebron] is the preferable solution.

In the hearing which took place on Sunday, 20 Tishrei, 5769/October 19, 2008, in the District Court of Jerusalem, before the honorable Judge Maurice Ben Atar, the judge determined that Jewish prayer on the Temple Mount does not constitute a provocation.

The court released Yehudah Glick, director of the Temple Institute, from detention after he had been arrested by the police earlier in the day on suspicion of attempting to create a provocation on the Temple Mount. The police alleged that Glick tried to enter the Temple Mount with articles of prayer, thereby creating a provocation.

Glick was represented at the hearing by attorney Aviad Vissuly, claiming that in the past year he has entered the Temple Mount tens of times, both as a guide leading groups and in his role as Director of the Temple Institute, and in 90% of his visits he has engaged in prayer, with the knowledge of the police, and not a single instance of provocation has occurred. In addition, Glick claimed that on October 15th, 2008, the police authorized the entry of more than 700 Jews to the Temple Mount in groups of twenty, and and each group was authorized by the police to read verses from the book of Deuteronomy, related to the Hakhel ceremony. Glick further noted that at the time of his arrest he had arrived at the Temple Mount with the identical printed materials for guiding groups that he uses each time he ascends the Mount, as well as with the printed verses that he had been authorized to read on the Mount (on October 15th).

Attorney Aviad Vissuly opened the hearing by mentioning the illegality of the police policy of forbidding Jewish prayer on the Temple Mount. Vissuly charged that this policy contradicts the Israeli Basic Law guaranteeing freedom of religion and worship. He likewise charged that the police have never formally adopted the forbidding of prayer on the Temple Mount in writing, as such would contradict the ruling of the International Court of Justice. In spite of this, the police continue to forbid all non-Moslem prayer on the Mount in accordance with the demands of the Moslem Wakf which is under the control of Islamic Movement.

Judge Maurice Ben Atar ruled that it has never been proven that Jewish prayer on the Temple Mount has created a provocation, and therefore the police had no basis whatsoever for arresting Yehudah Glick: "In light of the lack of legal basis for the arrest, there exists no reason for accepting the police request to limit Glick's freedom of movement." (The police had earlier presented their request that Glick be ordered to stay away from the Temple Mount for a period of 180. They later reduced their request to 20 days.) The judge ruled that there exists no reason for acquiescing to the police request of restricting Glick's access to the Temple Mount, even for a minute. The judge further stated that in light of the desire of hundreds of Jews to pray on the Temple Mount, an arrangement allowing for Jewish prayer on the Temple Mount similar to the arrangement already existing in the Cave of the Patriarchs [in Hebron] is the preferable solution.

In response to his arrest and hearing, Yehudah Glick stated that, "The feeling is that the Israeli police, instead of admitting that they failed in their preparation for the orderly entry of hundred of Israeli and tourists who wished to ascend to the Temple Mount to perform the agreed upon Hakhel ceremony, throughout the Sukkot holiday, in spite of the fact that they had been provided by Glick concrete information concerning the numbers months in advance, they prefer to betray the very individual who for months has been actively pursuing a policy of cooperation with the police. It pains me especially that the very same police officers with which I had pursued and enjoyed a working relationship built on trust over the past years, were those which brutally turned on me at this moment of truth."








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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Sun Oct 26 22:16:44 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2008 20:16:44 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] My absolute FAVORITE Moshav Band song
Message-ID: <855590370810262016p28ba8f0bi8a65f2b83a33f92b@mail.gmail.com>

Shalom L'Kulchem,

    Please click on the link below for a *REAL* shot of spiritual
adrenaline!  It's a brief video of this past August's Nefesh B'Nefesh Aliyah
flights to Israel.  In one day, they brought in, simultaneously - flights
from the US, Canada & England!

     The song in the background, which is in English is the Moshav Band's
"Come Back."  I get chills every single time I listen to it...May the day
come soon where I can hear that song, and make its message a personal
reality.

      And may we soon begin to bring Ephraim home, as well....
            *  Hanoch*

Click here: YouTube - Come Back - Nefesh
B'Nefesh<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z5z4r_2sx_w>
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From patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com  Sun Oct 26 23:05:15 2008
From: patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com (Pat Robbins)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 00:05:15 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] My absolute FAVORITE Moshav Band song
In-Reply-To: <855590370810262016p28ba8f0bi8a65f2b83a33f92b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <855590370810262016p28ba8f0bi8a65f2b83a33f92b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BLU125-DS2333837521CDA0DB62FEFBA240@phx.gbl>

FANTASTIC VIDEO!!!  I found that as I was watching it, I was forgetting to breathe!!!!  I was actually holding my breath through it!  I guess that's what you call breath-taking!!!!  What a video!!!!

(Hey, Steve!  I think the day of small beginnings is growing larger and larger!!!!)

Thank you AGAIN, Hanoch!!!!!!

Pat  


From: Hanoch Young 
Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2008 11:16 PM
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
Subject: [Dialogue] My absolute FAVORITE Moshav Band song


Shalom L'Kulchem,

    Please click on the link below for a REAL shot of spiritual adrenaline!  It's a brief video of this past August's Nefesh B'Nefesh Aliyah flights to Israel.  In one day, they brought in, simultaneously - flights from the US, Canada & England!

     The song in the background, which is in English is the Moshav Band's "Come Back."  I get chills every single time I listen to it...May the day come soon where I can hear that song, and make its message a personal reality.

      And may we soon begin to bring Ephraim home, as well....
              Hanoch

Click here: YouTube - Come Back - Nefesh B'Nefesh


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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From dhcole1 at cox.net  Mon Oct 27 00:19:06 2008
From: dhcole1 at cox.net (Dave Cole)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 00:19:06 -0500
Subject: [Dialogue] Sunday Shul
Message-ID: <CE1EFC1BD6214D619DBA8A2A2332B17D@davesbook>

Hey All...

Great lesson tonight.  Ross was able to discuss "the roots of our faith"  "Abram's faith"....and "who is God".  Ross spoke of how the book, Restoring Abrahamic Faith, helped clarify his early "seeking".    We had a lively discussion afterward about salvation and sacrifices and what these ideas mean.   I wish you all could have been there,  as I am sure some of you were able to tune in live.  This message is posted on the ROF website.

http://www.rootsoffaith.org/blog-and-podcasts/

shalom
dave
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From tposborne77 at yahoo.com  Mon Oct 27 07:15:39 2008
From: tposborne77 at yahoo.com (Tracy Osborne)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 05:15:39 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Dialogue] My absolute FAVORITE Moshav Band song
Message-ID: <909616.63237.qm@web51102.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Thanks Hanoch!
Why?are the tears welling up in me and I'm all choked up as I watch this? The unexplainable feelings well up within me as I watch this again...On November the 7th, at 5:35pm, I will touch down in Israel for my first time. 
Tracy



________________________________
From: Hanoch Young <youngbarzel at gmail.com>
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2008 11:16:44 PM
Subject: [Dialogue] My absolute FAVORITE Moshav Band song


Shalom L'Kulchem,

??? Please click on the link below for a REAL shot of spiritual adrenaline!? It's a brief video of this past August's Nefesh B'Nefesh Aliyah flights to Israel.? In one day, they brought in, simultaneously - flights from the US, Canada & England!

???? The song in the background, which is in English is the Moshav Band's "Come Back."? I get chills every single time I listen to it...May the day come soon where I can hear that song, and make its message?a personal reality.

????? And may we soon begin to bring Ephraim home, as well....
????????????? Hanoch

Click here: YouTube - Come Back - Nefesh B'Nefesh


      
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Mon Oct 27 07:29:03 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 05:29:03 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] My absolute FAVORITE Moshav Band song
In-Reply-To: <909616.63237.qm@web51102.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
References: <909616.63237.qm@web51102.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <855590370810270529s518c0cc8lb39c04be83f71395@mail.gmail.com>

Hey Tracy,

   Yeah, I know what you mean - I get 'goose bumps' just thinking about it!
THAT's what I meant when I wrote to you about the POWER of music.  Well,
combine that with some incredible  visual images....and, well - there you
have it!

   I'm thrilled that you'll be going to Israel, and I really look forward to
the time we'll spend together in Yerushalayim.  There are *lots* of things
that I can't wait to show you in *OUR CITY; *in *OUR YERUSHALAYIM*.   :-)

   B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,
             * Hanoch*

On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 5:15 AM, Tracy Osborne <tposborne77 at yahoo.com>wrote:

>  Thanks Hanoch!
> Why are the tears welling up in me and I'm all choked up as I watch this?
> The unexplainable feelings well up within me as I watch this again...On
> November the 7th, at 5:35pm, I will touch down in Israel for my first time.
> Tracy
>
>  ------------------------------
> *From:* Hanoch Young <youngbarzel at gmail.com>
> *To:* dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
> *Sent:* Sunday, October 26, 2008 11:16:44 PM
> *Subject:* [Dialogue] My absolute FAVORITE Moshav Band song
>
> Shalom L'Kulchem,
>
>     Please click on the link below for a *REAL* shot of spiritual
> adrenaline!  It's a brief video of this past August's Nefesh B'Nefesh Aliyah
> flights to Israel.  In one day, they brought in, simultaneously - flights
> from the US, Canada & England!
>
>      The song in the background, which is in English is the Moshav Band's
> "Come Back."  I get chills every single time I listen to it...May the day
> come soon where I can hear that song, and make its message a personal
> reality.
>
>       And may we soon begin to bring Ephraim home, as well....
>             *  Hanoch*
>
> Click here: YouTube - Come Back - Nefesh B'Nefesh<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z5z4r_2sx_w>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
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From patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com  Mon Oct 27 08:33:30 2008
From: patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com (Pat Robbins)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 09:33:30 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Petiton for Opening Temple Mount To Jewish Prayer!
Message-ID: <BLU125-DS52BFD6DDAD1098543A42DBA240@phx.gbl>

This is a most important issue.  Please make your voice heard.  It's easy and fast.

G-d's Holy Mountain MUST be opened to Jewish prayers.  


http://www.PetitionOnline.com/har1/
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From patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com  Mon Oct 27 08:40:12 2008
From: patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com (Pat Robbins)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 09:40:12 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Sunday Shul
In-Reply-To: <CE1EFC1BD6214D619DBA8A2A2332B17D@davesbook>
References: <CE1EFC1BD6214D619DBA8A2A2332B17D@davesbook>
Message-ID: <BLU125-DS2CC277DB71B9E4DF89EFFBA240@phx.gbl>

Can't wait to hear this message!  I was working last night and missed it live.  Thank you so much, Dave, for this reminder.  ~ Pat


From: Dave Cole 
Sent: Monday, October 27, 2008 1:19 AM
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
Subject: [Dialogue] Sunday Shul


Hey All...

Great lesson tonight.  Ross was able to discuss "the roots of our faith"  "Abram's faith"....and "who is God".  Ross spoke of how the book, Restoring Abrahamic Faith, helped clarify his early "seeking".    We had a lively discussion afterward about salvation and sacrifices and what these ideas mean.   I wish you all could have been there,  as I am sure some of you were able to tune in live.  This message is posted on the ROF website.

http://www.rootsoffaith.org/blog-and-podcasts/

shalom
dave


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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From eliasaph at uniteourheart.com  Mon Oct 27 09:25:34 2008
From: eliasaph at uniteourheart.com (Steve Mathe)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 07:25:34 -0700
Subject: [Dialogue] A word form Leah Rafaeli
Message-ID: <200810271425.m9REPW67016280@mail384c25.carrierzone.com>


[]

[]
  Torah and Election '08
[]

   27 October, 2008

Shalom

Your word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path. Psalm 119:105
Over the years I have on several occasions 
referred to a principle of Jewish teaching: 
namely, that the weekly Torah portion speaks 
directly to what is happening in Israel, in the 
world and/or in the lives of individuals during 
the very week of its reading. Sometimes the 
message is obvious; sometimes it requires in 
depth study to draw it out, sometimes we don't 
see it at all but that doesn't mean it isn't there.

This past Shabbat I felt inclined to look ahead a 
couple of weeks to the Torah portion that 
coincides with the election in the United States 
on Nov. 4th. Is there perchance any message there for us?

The weekly Torah study of devout Jews begins anew 
on Sunday of each week and culminates on the next 
Shabbat when the entire week's portion is read in 
the synagogue service. Throughout the week, the 
portion is divided into seven sections for study.

Therefore, I looked first at the Torah portion as 
a whole which will be read on Shabbat, Nov. 8th 
and then I zeroed in specifically on the section 
of verses which will be studied on the very day 
of the election, Tuesday, Nov. 4th.

The Torah portion is Lech Lecha - Gen. 12:1 - 
17:27 which begins with the verse: Now Hashem 
said to Abram: 'Get yourself out of your country, 
and from your kindred, and from your father's 
house, and go to the land that I will show you.

The specific section for Tuesday of that week is 
Gen. 13:5 - 18. It is the account of the argument 
that developed between the herdsmen of Avram and the herdsmen of Lot.

Seeing the disunity between them, Avram 
approached Lot and said, 'Let there be no strife, 
I pray you, between me and you, and between my 
herdsmen and your herdsmen; for we are brethren. 
Is not the whole land before you? separate 
yourself, I pray you, from me; if you will go to 
the left,, then I will go to the right; or if you 
will go to the right, then I will go to the left.'

And Lot lifted up his eyes, and saw that all the 
plain of the Jordan was well watered every where; 
[it was before Hashem destroyed Sodom and 
Gomorrah]; it was like the garden of Hashem, like 
the land of Egypt, as you go towards Zoar.

So Lot chose for himself all the plain of the 
Jordan; and Lot journeyed east; and they 
separated themselves, one from the other.

Essentially what we learn from these verses is 
that Avram took the humbler position and gave his 
nephew, Lot, the freedom and the opportunity to 
make a decision about his future.

Lot looked with his eyes and saw one particular 
area that looked lush and held the promise of 
quick prosperity. There is no indication that Lot 
prayed or asked Hashem for guidance in any way. 
He made his decision by what looked like the 
'best deal' for him immediately and in the near future.

The only problem is that very shortly thereafter, 
everything he saw that "looked so good" was 
utterly destroyed and Lot lost nearly everything, 
including his wife. Only his daughters survived with him.

Avram, on the other hand, accepted with gratitude 
what "appeared" to be less prosperous in the 
short run, only to hear from Hashem who spoke 
thus to him after Lot had departed:

And Hashem said to Abram, after Lot had separated 
from him: 'Now, lift up your eyes, and look from 
the place where you are, northward and southward 
and eastward and westward; for all the land which 
you see, I will give to you, and to your seed for 
ever. And I will make your seed as the dust of 
the earth; so that if a man can number the dust 
of the earth, then shall your seed also be numbered.

Arise, walk through the length and breadth of the 
land; for to you will I give it.' And Abram moved 
his tent, and came and dwelt by the terebinths of 
Mamre, which are in Hebron, and there he built an altar to Hashem.

Is there a message? With all due respect, how can anyone miss it???

Lot chose what looked to him the way of quick and 
easy prosperity and relief from the difficulties 
he was facing at that moment right where he was. It ended in utter disaster.

Avram was willing to trust Hashem to care for him 
and to do what was best for him for the purpose 
of fulfilling the covenant which Hashem had 
already made with him earlier. Avram pitched his 
tent at the direction of Hashem and the long term blessings still continue.

I would like to respectfully suggest that we draw 
our own personal application from observing the 
actions and decisions of Avram and Lot as we prepare for the election.

Short term gain for long term pain is the story of Lot.

Faith in Hashem, the moral values of integrity, 
humility and dedication to a Person and a cause 
greater than himself merited eternal blessing not 
only for Avram but for his descendants down to this very day.

What does this say to you? Only you can decide.

It has nothing to do with being Republican or 
Democrat; it has to do with looking to Hashem's 
Torah for divine counsel and guidance. May we all 
cast our vote from a biblical rather than a material perspective.

Shalom and blessings to all,

Leah

email: <mailto:leahrafaeli at yahoo.com>leahrafaeli at yahoo.com
phone: 703-587-4420
web: 
<http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?e=001i2bI232l2pOxXsPetumfgkCFoMcY-RrxDOeKZjNCUujjcQFKGRLFyjLqNiWtM39u-DcJKPrQ5yUB5qXkonB1BSD3WNvePCy9A5PG0fOy8j0=>http://www.lekarev.org 


[]


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From carlson_john at bellsouth.net  Mon Oct 27 10:40:56 2008
From: carlson_john at bellsouth.net (carlson_john at bellsouth.net)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 15:40:56 +0000
Subject: [Dialogue] A word form Leah Rafaeli
In-Reply-To: <200810271425.m9REPW67016280@mail384c25.carrierzone.com>
Message-ID: <102720081540.25617.4905E10700062EEB0000641122228869349B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF02080106A102019C049D0E0C@att.net>

Amein Steve!

--
John C. 

"Be excellent to each other!" 
Bill and Ted 


-------------- Original message from Steve Mathe <eliasaph at uniteourheart.com>: -------------- 


 
  Torah and Election '08  
  27 October, 2008  
  
Shalom 

Your word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path. Psalm 119:105

Over the years I have on several occasions referred to a principle of Jewish teaching: namely, that the weekly Torah portion speaks directly to what is happening in Israel, in the world and/or in the lives of individuals during the very week of its reading. Sometimes the message is obvious; sometimes it requires in depth study to draw it out, sometimes we don't see it at all but that doesn't mean it isn't there. 

This past Shabbat I felt inclined to look ahead a couple of weeks to the Torah portion that coincides with the election in the United States on Nov. 4th. Is there perchance any message there for us? 

The weekly Torah study of devout Jews begins anew on Sunday of each week and culminates on the next Shabbat when the entire week's portion is read in the synagogue service. Throughout the week, the portion is divided into seven sections for study. 

Therefore, I looked first at the Torah portion as a whole which will be read on Shabbat, Nov. 8th and then I zeroed in specifically on the section of verses which will be studied on the very day of the election, Tuesday, Nov. 4th. 

The Torah portion is Lech Lecha - Gen. 12:1 - 17:27 which begins with the verse: Now Hashem said to Abram: 'Get yourself out of your country, and from your kindred, and from your father's house, and go to the land that I will show you. 

The specific section for Tuesday of that week is Gen. 13:5 - 18. It is the account of the argument that developed between the herdsmen of Avram and the herdsmen of Lot. 

Seeing the disunity between them, Avram approached Lot and said, 'Let there be no strife, I pray you, between me and you, and between my herdsmen and your herdsmen; for we are brethren. Is not the whole land before you? separate yourself, I pray you, from me; if you will go to the left,, then I will go to the right; or if you will go to the right, then I will go to the left.' 

And Lot lifted up his eyes, and saw that all the plain of the Jordan was well watered every where; [it was before Hashem destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah]; it was like the garden of Hashem, like the land of Egypt, as you go towards Zoar. 

So Lot chose for himself all the plain of the Jordan; and Lot journeyed east; and they separated themselves, one from the other. 

Essentially what we learn from these verses is that Avram took the humbler position and gave his nephew, Lot, the freedom and the opportunity to make a decision about his future. 

Lot looked with his eyes and saw one particular area that looked lush and held the promise of quick prosperity. There is no indication that Lot prayed or asked Hashem for guidance in any way. He made his decision by what looked like the 'best deal' for him immediately and in the near future. 

The only problem is that very shortly thereafter, everything he saw that "looked so good" was utterly destroyed and Lot lost nearly everything, including his wife. Only his daughters survived with him. 

Avram, on the other hand, accepted with gratitude what "appeared" to be less prosperous in the short run, only to hear from Hashem who spoke thus to him after Lot had departed: 

And Hashem said to Abram, after Lot had separated from him: 'Now, lift up your eyes, and look from the place where you are, northward and southward and eastward and westward; for all the land which you see, I will give to you, and to your seed for ever. And I will make your seed as the dust of the earth; so that if a man can number the dust of the earth, then shall your seed also be numbered. 

Arise, walk through the length and breadth of the land; for to you will I give it.' And Abram moved his tent, and came and dwelt by the terebinths of Mamre, which are in Hebron, and there he built an altar to Hashem. 

Is there a message? With all due respect, how can anyone miss it??? 

Lot chose what looked to him the way of quick and easy prosperity and relief from the difficulties he was facing at that moment right where he was. It ended in utter disaster. 

Avram was willing to trust Hashem to care for him and to do what was best for him for the purpose of fulfilling the covenant which Hashem had already made with him earlier. Avram pitched his tent at the direction of Hashem and the long term blessings still continue. 

I would like to respectfully suggest that we draw our own personal application from observing the actions and decisions of Avram and Lot as we prepare for the election. 

Short term gain for long term pain is the story of Lot. 

Faith in Hashem, the moral values of integrity, humility and dedication to a Person and a cause greater than himself merited eternal blessing not only for Avram but for his descendants down to this very day. 

What does this say to you? Only you can decide. 

It has nothing to do with being Republican or Democrat; it has to do with looking to Hashem's Torah for divine counsel and guidance. May we all cast our vote from a biblical rather than a material perspective. 

Shalom and blessings to all, 

Leah 

email: leahrafaeli at yahoo.com 
phone: 703-587-4420 
web: http://www.lekarev.org 
 
 

  
This email was sent to shenabav at dslextreme.com by leahrafaeli at yahoo.com.
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From carlson_john at bellsouth.net  Mon Oct 27 10:48:15 2008
From: carlson_john at bellsouth.net (carlson_john at bellsouth.net)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 15:48:15 +0000
Subject: [Dialogue] Petiton for Opening Temple Mount To Jewish Prayer!
In-Reply-To: <BLU125-DS52BFD6DDAD1098543A42DBA240@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <102720081548.23159.4905E2BF0004A06100005A7722228869349B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF02080106A102019C049D0E0C@att.net>

Done.

--
John C. 

"Be excellent to each other!" 
Bill and Ted 


-------------- Original message from "Pat Robbins" <patriciarobbinz at hotmail.com>: -------------- 


This is a most important issue.  Please make your voice heard.  It's easy and fast.

G-d's Holy Mountain MUST be opened to Jewish prayers.  


http://www.PetitionOnline.com/har1/
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From tposborne77 at yahoo.com  Mon Oct 27 13:07:50 2008
From: tposborne77 at yahoo.com (Tracy Osborne)
Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2008 11:07:50 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Dialogue] My absolute FAVORITE Moshav Band song
Message-ID: <152167.38225.qm@web51107.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Achi Hanoch,

??? Yes, you are correct. Music plays a part in provoking the prophetic spirit into manifestation. Remember, Elisha said, "Bring me a minstrel...". It is one of HaShem's ordained creations for us to enjoy. David ha Melekh established 24 hour a day musical worship when he brought back the Ark of the Covenant. It is my practice to pick up my guitar or sit down at my piano and begin to sing to E-LO-HEI-NU. 

??? I'm thrilled to be going to?OUR YERUSHALAYIM...and sharing some of it with you is a wonderful blessing along with it!! 

B' Ahavah,
Tracy




________________________________
From: Hanoch Young <youngbarzel at gmail.com>
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
Sent: Monday, October 27, 2008 8:29:03 AM
Subject: Re: [Dialogue] My absolute FAVORITE Moshav Band song


Hey Tracy,

?? Yeah, I know what you mean - I get 'goose bumps' just thinking about it!? THAT's what I meant when I wrote to you about the POWER of music.? Well, combine that with some incredible? visual images....and, well - there you have it!

?? I'm thrilled that you'll be going to Israel, and I really look forward to the time we'll spend together in Yerushalayim.? There are lots of things that I can't wait to show you in OUR CITY; in OUR YERUSHALAYIM.?? :-)

?? B'Ahavat Yehuda v'Yisrael,
?????????????Hanoch


On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 5:15 AM, Tracy Osborne <tposborne77 at yahoo.com> wrote:

Thanks Hanoch!
Why?are the tears welling up in me and I'm all choked up as I watch this? The unexplainable feelings well up within me as I watch this again...On November the 7th, at 5:35pm, I will touch down in Israel for my first time. 
Tracy



________________________________

From: Hanoch Young <youngbarzel at gmail.com>
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2008 11:16:44 PM
Subject: [Dialogue] My absolute FAVORITE Moshav Band song



Shalom L'Kulchem,

??? Please click on the link below for a REAL shot of spiritual adrenaline!? It's a brief video of this past August's Nefesh B'Nefesh Aliyah flights to Israel.? In one day, they brought in, simultaneously - flights from the US, Canada & England!

???? The song in the background, which is in English is the Moshav Band's "Come Back."? I get chills every single time I listen to it...May the day come soon where I can hear that song, and make its message?a personal reality.

????? And may we soon begin to bring Ephraim home, as well....
????????????? Hanoch

Click here: YouTube - Come Back - Nefesh B'Nefesh

_______________________________________________


      
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Tue Oct 28 15:25:44 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 06:25:44 +1000
Subject: [Dialogue] CHEVLEI MASHIACH.... THE BIRTH PANGS.
Message-ID: <49077548.8020908@westnet.com.au>

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From shdennis at rogers.com  Wed Oct 29 07:04:07 2008
From: shdennis at rogers.com (Stephen & Sharon)
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 09:04:07 -0300
Subject: [Dialogue] CHEVLEI MASHIACH.... THE BIRTH PANGS.
In-Reply-To: <49077548.8020908@westnet.com.au>
References: <49077548.8020908@westnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <1D0801965770465E9679E2AFB9E2A7EC@Beeblebrox>

Thank you Joe!   I appreciate the links that you share with us  -  and yes, this talk is profound.

Shalom to All,
Sharon
  ----- Original Message ----- 

  From: JOE INDOMENICO 
  To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org 
  Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2008 5:25 PM
  Subject: [Dialogue] CHEVLEI MASHIACH.... THE BIRTH PANGS.


  Shalom Chaverim,

  this is an article that I hope you will take the time to read.
  It is very profound and searching. Well worth the read and listen.

  http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/128101

  Shalom v'Ahavah
  JOE.





------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Thu Oct 30 09:26:35 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 10:26:35 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] A VERY profound quote
Message-ID: <855590370810300726n4ecafac4y2c574ae638ff0af7@mail.gmail.com>

This quote really cuts to the heart of things...

                * Hanoch*

"Why has the Messiah not come either yesterday or today?
Because we are today just as we were yesterday."

Rabbi Menachem Mendel of Kossov
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Thu Oct 30 09:34:35 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 10:34:35 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] 'The Lessons of Noah's Ark'
Message-ID: <855590370810300734g44b2b8e8oa2201485adf084ef@mail.gmail.com>

<http://www.feedblitz.com/f?Search=40199>  This is so 'simple' but it says
SO much...from Rav Lazer Brody                              * Hanoch*
*The Lessons of Noah's
Ark<http://feeds.feedburner.com/~r/typepad/pGFj/~3/436337598/the-lessons-of-noahs-ark.html>
*

 This week, we read the Torah portion of Noah. What, you don't think that
Bible stories are relevant? Here're ten important lessons from Noah's Ark...

*One*: Don't miss the boat.

*Two*: Remember that we are all in the same boat.

*Three*: Plan ahead. It wasn't raining when Noah built the Ark.

*Four*: Stay fit. When you're 600 years old, someone may ask you to do
something really big.

*Five*: Don't listen to critics; just get on with the job that needs to be
done.

*Six*: Build your future on high ground.

*Seven*: For safety's sake, travel in pairs.

*Eight*: Speed isn't always an advantage. The snails were on board with the
cheetahs.

*Nine*: When you're stressed, float a while.

*Ten*: Remember, the Ark was built by amateurs; the Titanic by
professionals.

[image: NoahArk]<http://lazerbrody.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8345263cd69e2010535c33da4970b-pi>
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From chattertonw at bellsouth.net  Thu Oct 30 12:14:06 2008
From: chattertonw at bellsouth.net (chattertonw at bellsouth.net)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 17:14:06 +0000
Subject: [Dialogue] A VERY profound quote
In-Reply-To: <855590370810300726n4ecafac4y2c574ae638ff0af7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <103020081714.18434.4909EB5E0009387B0000480222216128369B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>

... couple of different ways you could look at this... 

He has not come because, if he had, we would be different, or

He has not come because our failure to change prevents him from doing so...


-------------- Original message from "Hanoch Young" <youngbarzel at gmail.com>: -------------- 


This quote really cuts to the heart of things...

                 Hanoch
"Why has the Messiah not come either yesterday or today?
Because we are today just as we were yesterday."

Rabbi Menachem Mendel of Kossov 
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From carlson_john at bellsouth.net  Thu Oct 30 13:04:13 2008
From: carlson_john at bellsouth.net (carlson_john at bellsouth.net)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 18:04:13 +0000
Subject: [Dialogue] A VERY profound quote
In-Reply-To: <103020081714.18434.4909EB5E0009387B0000480222216128369B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>
References: <855590370810300726n4ecafac4y2c574ae638ff0af7@mail.gmail.com>
	<103020081714.18434.4909EB5E0009387B0000480222216128369B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>
Message-ID: <103020081804.18874.4909F71D000303FA000049BA22218683269B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF02080106A102019C049D0E0C@att.net>

OR...

He did come once and was rejected.  But before he left he set in place the final markers along the Ancient Path so that those who had eyes to see and ears to hear (because they love the Lord his G-d with all of their heart, all of their soul and all of their mind), could find their way back to HaShem through the things he taught which echoed the prophets before him.  So that when he returns, there will be no excuse left for those who do not turn back.

Just another thought.
--
John C. 

"Be excellent to each other!" 
Bill and Ted 


-------------- Original message from chattertonw at bellsouth.net: -------------- 


... couple of different ways you could look at this... 

He has not come because, if he had, we would be different, or

He has not come because our failure to change prevents him from doing so...


-------------- Original message from "Hanoch Young" <youngbarzel at gmail.com>: -------------- 


This quote really cuts to the heart of things...

                 Hanoch
"Why has the Messiah not come either yesterday or today?
Because we are today just as we were yesterday."

Rabbi Menachem Mendel of Kossov 
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Thu Oct 30 16:36:08 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 17:36:08 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] A VERY profound quote
In-Reply-To: <103020081714.18434.4909EB5E0009387B0000480222216128369B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>
References: <855590370810300726n4ecafac4y2c574ae638ff0af7@mail.gmail.com>
	<103020081714.18434.4909EB5E0009387B0000480222216128369B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>
Message-ID: <855590370810301436j131be6efx828fb8a819f30865@mail.gmail.com>

My personal feeling - it's the second one....

          *  Hanoch
*
On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 1:14 PM, <chattertonw at bellsouth.net> wrote:

>  ... couple of different ways you could look at this...
>
> He has not come because, if he had, we would be different, or
>
> He has not come because our failure to change prevents him from doing so...
>
>
>
> -------------- Original message from "Hanoch Young" <youngbarzel at gmail.com>:
> --------------
>
> This quote really cuts to the heart of things...
>
>                 * Hanoch*
>
> "Why has the Messiah not come either yesterday or today?
> Because we are today just as we were yesterday."
>
> Rabbi Menachem Mendel of Kossov
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Thu Oct 30 16:48:50 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 17:48:50 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] A VERY profound quote
In-Reply-To: <103020081804.18874.4909F71D000303FA000049BA22218683269B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF02080106A102019C049D0E0C@att.net>
References: <855590370810300726n4ecafac4y2c574ae638ff0af7@mail.gmail.com>
	<103020081714.18434.4909EB5E0009387B0000480222216128369B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net>
	<103020081804.18874.4909F71D000303FA000049BA22218683269B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF02080106A102019C049D0E0C@att.net>
Message-ID: <855590370810301448x4c92657ag16d0e8117db73f6c@mail.gmail.com>

Hey John,

    I'm really challenged to try to understand the logic (not the emotion)
in what you're suggesting.  Where do we get the idea that when Mashiach
comes, he will need to be 'accepted' ?  He'll be calling the shots, his
appearance on the scene is not conditional on anyone 'accepting' him - it's
not going to be a popularity contest.

   And why would we accept the idea of a FAILED Messiah; one who came, but
since he was 'rejected' he left; but will return some day?  A few thousand
years later...?

   Can someone help me to understand what the sources are that can
illuminate this for me?

   Thanks for bringing this up John;  I'm thrilled that your Israel trip is
rapidly approaching.  You'll be going shortly after I'll be returning.  Have
a fabulous time!!

    Best regards,-
      *   Hanoch
*
On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 2:04 PM, <carlson_john at bellsouth.net> wrote:

>   OR...
>
> He did come once and was rejected.  But before he left he set in place the
> final markers along the Ancient Path so that those who had eyes to see and
> ears to hear (because they love the Lord his G-d with all of their heart,
> all of their soul and all of their mind), could find their way back to
> HaShem through the things he taught which echoed the prophets before him.
> So that when he returns, there will be no excuse left for those who do not
> turn back.
>
> Just another thought.
> --
> John C.
>
> "Be excellent to each other!"
> Bill and Ted
>
>
> -------------- Original message from chattertonw at bellsouth.net:
> --------------
>
>  ... couple of different ways you could look at this...
>
> He has not come because, if he had, we would be different, or
>
> He has not come because our failure to change prevents him from doing so...
>
>
>
> -------------- Original message from "Hanoch Young" <youngbarzel at gmail.com>:
> --------------
>
> This quote really cuts to the heart of things...
>
>                 * Hanoch*
>
> "Why has the Messiah not come either yesterday or today?
> Because we are today just as we were yesterday."
>
> Rabbi Menachem Mendel of Kossov
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
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From carlson_john at bellsouth.net  Thu Oct 30 17:32:25 2008
From: carlson_john at bellsouth.net (carlson_john at bellsouth.net)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 22:32:25 +0000
Subject: [Dialogue] A VERY profound quote
In-Reply-To: <855590370810301448x4c92657ag16d0e8117db73f6c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <855590370810300726n4ecafac4y2c574ae638ff0af7@mail.gmail.com><103020081714.18434.4909EB5E0009387B0000480222216128369B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF9902019B9D0A9B9B0E080C@att.net><103020081804.18874.4909F71D000303FA000049BA22218683269B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF02080106A102019C049D0E0C@att.net>
	<855590370810301448x4c92657ag16d0e8117db73f6c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <103020082232.14847.490A35F80009877F000039FF22230704929B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF02080106A102019C049D0E0C@att.net>

Well,

Unfortunately, in my experience, the logic depends largely on one's perspective, interpretation and personal beliefs regarding the scriptures when it comes to the Messianic prophesies. It's not crystal clear as far as I can tell and therefore, logic will only take one so far.

For instance, in Glenn's second proposal he suggests "He has not come because our failure to change prevents him from doing so...".  Logically, by the very same argument you presented I could easily ask, "how could anything man does prevent G-d for completing His plan regarding Moschiach since his appearance is not conditional?".

The thought I was offering is really not intended to suggest that Messiah's appearance is any more conditional than the appearance and prophesy of any other annointed one that has been sent to mankind (be it Israel or not).  G-d sends whom He will send to remind His people of the message He has been telling us since the beginning.  Whether man (Judah, Israel or otherwise) is willing to heed it and return to Him is entirely up to man. G-d's mercy, though limitless, will be withdrawn from those who do not heed, at it's appointed time, when Messiah does appear (I believe).  

I really don't think that it is as critically important that we recognize exactly who Messiah was (if he has come before) as much as it is that we recognize the teaching to return to HaShem.  It is by our recognition of HaShem that we will recognize Messiah when he does come.

But to answer your question more directly (off the top of my head), Psalm 118:22.

I'm sorry we're gonna miss each other again.  Sooner or later we'll get in synch.

Shalom man.
--
John C. 

"Be excellent to each other!" 
Bill and Ted 


-------------- Original message from "Hanoch Young" <youngbarzel at gmail.com>: -------------- 


Hey John,

    I'm really challenged to try to understand the logic (not the emotion) in what you're suggesting.  Where do we get the idea that when Mashiach comes, he will need to be 'accepted' ?  He'll be calling the shots, his appearance on the scene is not conditional on anyone 'accepting' him - it's not going to be a popularity contest.

   And why would we accept the idea of a FAILED Messiah; one who came, but since he was 'rejected' he left; but will return some day?  A few thousand years later...?

   Can someone help me to understand what the sources are that can illuminate this for me?

   Thanks for bringing this up John;  I'm thrilled that your Israel trip is rapidly approaching.  You'll be going shortly after I'll be returning.  Have a fabulous time!!

    Best regards,-
         Hanoch


On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 2:04 PM, <carlson_john at bellsouth.net> wrote:

OR...

He did come once and was rejected.  But before he left he set in place the final markers along the Ancient Path so that those who had eyes to see and ears to hear (because they love the Lord his G-d with all of their heart, all of their soul and all of their mind), could find their way back to HaShem through the things he taught which echoed the prophets before him.  So that when he returns, there will be no excuse left for those who do not turn back.

Just another thought.
--
John C. 

"Be excellent to each other!" 
Bill and Ted 


-------------- Original message from chattertonw at bellsouth.net: -------------- 



... couple of different ways you could look at this... 

He has not come because, if he had, we would be different, or

He has not come because our failure to change prevents him from doing so...


-------------- Original message from "Hanoch Young" <youngbarzel at gmail.com>: -------------- 


This quote really cuts to the heart of things...

                 Hanoch
"Why has the Messiah not come either yesterday or today?
Because we are today just as we were yesterday."

Rabbi Menachem Mendel of Kossov 

_______________________________________________
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Thu Oct 30 18:51:53 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2008 09:51:53 +1000
Subject: [Fwd: Re: [Dialogue] A VERY profound quote]
Message-ID: <490A4899.1050408@westnet.com.au>

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Subject: Re: [Dialogue] A VERY profound quote
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 17:48:50 -0400
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Thu Oct 30 20:00:47 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2008 11:00:47 +1000
Subject: [Dialogue] Noah Build An ARK!
Message-ID: <490A58BF.7040600@westnet.com.au>

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From carlson_john at bellsouth.net  Thu Oct 30 22:51:28 2008
From: carlson_john at bellsouth.net (carlson_john at bellsouth.net)
Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2008 03:51:28 +0000
Subject: [Dialogue] Noah Build An ARK!
In-Reply-To: <490A58BF.7040600@westnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <103120080351.26028.490A80C00009413C000065AC22230647629B0A02D2089B9A019C04040A0DBF02080106A102019C049D0E0C@att.net>

Man that brings back memories.  Too bad they didn't have the video part, his face was priceless during his standup.

Thanks Joe.

--
John C. 

"Be excellent to each other!" 
Bill and Ted 


-------------- Original message from JOE INDOMENICO <jid at westnet.com.au>: -------------- 

On a lighter note............
Shabbat Shalom
JOE
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=Zyc1315KawQ&feature=related 
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From RNDAVAR at aol.com  Thu Oct 30 22:57:36 2008
From: RNDAVAR at aol.com (RNDAVAR at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 2008 23:57:36 EDT
Subject: [Dialogue] Check out Israeli Archaeologists Find Ancient Text
Message-ID: <ca5.3c6fff94.363bdc30@aol.com>

I found this tonight on the web.  Shalom, Ross
 
_Click  here: Israeli Archaeologists Find Ancient Text_ 
(http://news.aol.com/article/israeli-archaeologists-find-ancient-text/233027?icid=100214839x12123711
34x1200758828)  
 
Ross K.  Nichols 
_www.RootsofFaith.org_ (http://www.rootsoffaith.org/) 


**************Plan your next getaway with AOL Travel.  Check out Today's Hot 
5 Travel Deals! 
(http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1212416248x1200771803/aol?redir=http://travel.aol.com/discount-travel?ncid=emlcntustrav00000001)
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From RNDAVAR at aol.com  Thu Oct 30 23:22:13 2008
From: RNDAVAR at aol.com (RNDAVAR at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2008 00:22:13 EDT
Subject: [Dialogue] A Father's Tribute to Ezra
Message-ID: <bcd.3da19fc0.363be1f5@aol.com>

Glenn, Rhonda and all,
 
I am thinking of Ezra's parents tonight.  When I first read this  tribute I 
was very moved.  I cannot imagine the pain that a parent goes  through when 
they lose a child, though I know several who have had to endure  this and my 
heart goes out to all of them tonight.  
 
On the 29th (yesterday) they held a service for Ezra.  Please keep  this 
family in your prayers.  May the good hand of God comfort them during  this time 
of sorrow.
 
I am reminded of the opening words of Isaiah 40....nachamu nachamu ami  
(Comfort ye, comfort ye my people).
 
So sad, and yet from his father's words, this young boy loved life and  lived 
it to the fullest. He relates a special lesson that he learned from his  son. 
I highlighted the phrase in his father's words that really hit home:
 
"When Ezra couldn't walk anymore, he turned to World of Warcraft. When he  
couldn?t see, he turned to music, or our pets, or food, or directing me to play  
World of Warcraft for him. The trick was that, as his world got  smaller, he 
just looked at it more closely. If I am to take  any shred of good from this 
suffering, I?ll have to learn from him."
 
May we all learn to look at our world closely and make the most of every  day.
 
Shalom, Ross
 
Ross K.  Nichols 
_www.RootsofFaith.org_ (http://www.rootsoffaith.org/) 


**************Plan your next getaway with AOL Travel.  Check out Today's Hot 
5 Travel Deals! 
(http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1212416248x1200771803/aol?redir=http://travel.aol.com/discount-travel?ncid=emlcntustrav00000001)
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From jid at westnet.com.au  Fri Oct 31 01:43:25 2008
From: jid at westnet.com.au (JOE INDOMENICO)
Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2008 16:43:25 +1000
Subject: [Dialogue] Mashiach at the gates of Rome.
Message-ID: <490AA90D.8010804@westnet.com.au>

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From youngbarzel at gmail.com  Fri Oct 31 12:22:20 2008
From: youngbarzel at gmail.com (Hanoch Young)
Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2008 13:22:20 -0400
Subject: [Dialogue] Why an Ark?
Message-ID: <855590370810311022j3e528e34r97a5ad0953b0d029@mail.gmail.com>

Noach: Gathering Within the Ark Cheshvan 2, 5769, 31 October 08 02:55
by by Rabbi Chanan Morrison

(IsraelNN.com) *Why an Ark?
*Why was it necessary for Noah to build an ark in order to save his family
from the Flood's destruction? Could God not have arranged an easier way to
rescue him?

The *Midrash* already raises this question, explaining that the 120 years
that Noah worked constructing the enormous boat were meant to provide the
people of his generation a chance to repent.

*Rebuilding the World
*Rabbi Moshe Chaim Luzzatto, the eighteenth-century scholar, gave an
alternative explanation. He wrote that the year spent inside the ark was
necessary to prepare the foundations for a new world. Outside the ark, where
flood waters swept away the world's evil, nothing could survive. Inside the
ark, the inner integrity of the world was reestablished under Noah's
direction. The soul of this great *tzaddik* encompassed all the souls of the
world. As Noah fed and looked after the animals in his care, he renewed the
world on the basis of goodness and kindness.

A similar preparatory stage of spiritual renewal took place many years
later. Before the revelation of the *Zohar*, Rabbi Shimon *bar* Yochai hid
in a cave for thirteen years. He needed this period of seclusion to purify
and prepare himself for the *Zohar*'s inner light (*Adir Bemarom* 7).

*The Path of Personal Growth
*The same phenomenon is true, Rabbi Avraham Yitchak Kook wrote, for our own
moral and spiritual growth. All change is difficult. It is hard to correct
habits and rectify patterns of thought. As one becomes accustomed to view
life in terms of materialistic desires, without thinking one is drawn to
egotism and the pursuit of honor and physical pleasures.

The path to repair deeds and refine character traits has two aspects. The
first pertains to the intellect. One must gain knowledge of each trait and
its characteristics, to know the proper time and place for each trait. Thus,
our very first request in the daily prayers is that God should "grant us
knowledge, understanding and insight."

Theoretical knowledge, however, is not enough. Even after acquiring this
wisdom, it is necessary to accustom the will and the corresponding physical
powers so that they will wholeheartedly conform to this new path. One must
strive to quiet the heart, distancing oneself from all that leads to a
confused state, thus undermining the foundations of character-building. One
needs to acquire a determined and steadfast outlook, to fortify one's traits
so that they will retain their purity and holiness even when occupied in
worldly matters.

*A Private Ark
*One who succeeds in directing his intellect and will in this fashion will
rule over all aspects of life. But for one who has not thought out his path,
his actions and desires are not under the control of the intellect. Such a
person needs to withdraw the powers of the soul, gathering them in, like
lines pulled back to their focal point. "He will gather in his spirit and
soul to himself." (Job 34:14)

That undertaking is similar to Noah's confinement within the ark. It is a
bitter and heavy burden, since the soul naturally desires freedom and
expanse. Even confinement in the body is a terrible prison for the soul; all
the more to be constrained in such a fashion.

Convergence to the nucleus of intellect and inner will is not a pleasant
task. One will feel pained and even depressed from the constraints of this
path of repair. But when the soul's forces have become accustomed to proper
ways, they may be allowed to return to their natural state. Then, one's
spirit and all aspects of the personality will be proper vessels for
fulfilling God's will, and one's powers may be freed to rule over the body,
following the dictates of the intellect.

This path of personal renewal parallels the renewal of the world in the time
of Noah. The months spent in the ark were a preparatory period of converging
and gathering powers, under the direction of the *tzaddik*. But when the
inhabitable dry land appeared, as the punishing waters receded, Noah and the
inhabitants could once again be free of their confinement. So, too, as the
character traits are repaired and perfected, they may be released once
again.

*Testing the Waters
*During the period of confinement, one needs to 'test the waters' - to
measure whether one's powers are ready to be set free. This stage
corresponds to Noah's sending out the raven and the dove. One tests one's
traits in matters that do not involve danger, just like the birds were not
endangered by the flood waters. When the *tzaddik* realized that the world's
repair was still unfinished, he withdrew them back into the ark.

Only when the land was completely dry came the Divine command, "Leave the
ark!" Then it was time to serve God in a free and unhindered manner, for the
spread of Torah and kindness requires a courageous soul, full of strength,
in order to advance freely.

[Adapted from *Mussar Avicha* pp. 33-39]
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From tposborne77 at yahoo.com  Fri Oct 31 12:48:45 2008
From: tposborne77 at yahoo.com (Tracy Osborne)
Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2008 10:48:45 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Dialogue] Mashiach at the gates of Rome.
References: <490AA90D.8010804@westnet.com.au>
Message-ID: <681470.10244.qm@web51101.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Shalom Joe,
I watched the video. Was there something in particular that you wanted us to see in this? Something that caught your special attention?

Thanks for sending it, I enjoyed watching it.
Tracy




________________________________
From: JOE INDOMENICO <jid at westnet.com.au>
To: dialogue at rootsoffaith.org
Sent: Friday, October 31, 2008 2:43:25 AM
Subject: [Dialogue] Mashiach at the gates of Rome.

Shalom Chaverim,

may you all have a blessed and peaceful Shabbat.

If you have a spare hour over the weekend please take the time to listen to this very interesting topic.

Part 1???? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7U8sTZmU2Rk&feature=related 
Part 2???? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W5yt69BlyUk&feature=related 
Part 3???? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mvi0XJA35BQ&feature=related 
Part 4???? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNmdipYEgWo&feature=related 
Part 5???? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNBoOIMpxrA&feature=related 
Part 6???? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pPHxzh9EQbs&feature=related

Shabbat Shalom
JOE.



      
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